Jeremy Bamber Forum

JEREMY BAMBER CASE => Jeremy Bamber Case Discussion => Topic started by: mike tesko on April 26, 2013, 07:06:PM

Title: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: mike tesko on April 26, 2013, 07:06:PM
PC Bird photographed the fingers of Sheila's right hand resting  directly upon the sooty ammunition magazine of the rifle. This would havw produced significantly higher Lead deposit results than those attributrd to the hand swabs taken from  her right hand..
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Patti on April 26, 2013, 07:38:PM
PC Bird photographed the fingers of Sheila's right hand resting  directly upon the sooty ammunition magazine of the rifle. This would havw produced significantly higher Lead deposit results than those attributrd to the hand swabs taken from  her right hand..

I totally agree with this. I have always said that her right hand would have shown some GR.  Its ridiculous to think it would not have.  :) :) :) :)
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Caroline R on April 26, 2013, 09:09:PM
I totally agree with this. I have always said that her right hand would have shown some GR.  Its ridiculous to think it would not have.  :) :) :) :)

Except the hand swabs were rejected and submitted under a different reference - were they even the same swabs?  ;)
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: mike tesko on April 26, 2013, 10:19:PM
Does anybody know if the medicine prescribed and used by Sheila, which was found to be present in the blood taken from her at the morgue, has its own type of dna? Or, to put it another way, when the dna profiling was done in connection with the failed 2002 appeal, did the presence of medicines which might have been lining of the silencers tube and baffle plates, produce results to confirm or disprove a presence of medicines, taken by Sheila, there?
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 10:17:AM
I'm not an expert but I'm pretty sure medicine doesn't have it's own DNA.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 10:26:AM
I'm not an expert but I'm pretty sure medicine doesn't have it's own DNA.


No,,,but it shows up in a blood test as we all know----------------particularly cannabis.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 10:36:AM

No,,,but it shows up in a blood test as we all know----------------particularly cannabis.


If it had been Sheilas' blood,,there would have been signs of cannabis,,as it takes anything up to 12 hours to assimilate. So if Sheila had smoked it that evening,,it would have still been in her bloodstream,,so any test done would have showed up.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 11:06:AM
It only shows up if you test for it.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Caroline R on April 27, 2013, 11:12:AM
It only shows up if you test for it.

Not sure if the signs of drugs would degrade over time?
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 11:15:AM
Not sure if the signs of drugs would degrade over time?

Me neither tbh, I guess we need a haematologist / toxicologist.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 11:16:AM
Naturally.
 So if that minute speck of blood had been properly tested,it would have indicated if a noxious substance had been taken.
 But because the result was questionable,it was so impaired as to render it " might,may,or could have been ", it wasn't a definite and positive result from one person.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 11:19:AM
What result?
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 11:22:AM
The so-called silencer result that had been handled by all and sundry.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 11:50:AM
If you mean the blood grouping results then yes, it was only claimed at trial that it was blood of the same type as Sheila's, or a remote possibility of an intimate mix of blood of the same types as Neville and June's.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 12:01:PM
If you mean the blood grouping results then yes, it was only claimed at trial that it was blood of the same type as Sheila's, or a remote possibility of an intimate mix of blood of the same types as Neville and June's.


Bridget,,I'm sorry,,but it's not good enough to state that " there was a remote possibility " of anything.
I'm a black and white person,,always have been,,so it either was,or it wasn't,,nothing in-between.

Not your fault,,not my fault,,but this is about how the case was dealt with,and to my mind,,it was a ruddy shambles from start to finish.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 12:04:PM

Bridget,,I'm sorry,,but it's not good enough to state that " there was a remote possibility " of anything.
I'm a black and white person,,always have been,,so it either was,or it wasn't,,nothing in-between.

Not your fault,,not my fault,,but this is about how the case was dealt with,and to my mind,,it was a ruddy shambles from start to finish.

There was no DNA testing at the time of the trial so they presented the best evidence they had at the time. It was up to the jury whether or not to accept it.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 12:08:PM
There was no DNA testing at the time of the trial so they presented the best evidence they had at the time. It was up to the jury whether or not to accept it.


Well at some point in time " the best " will prove that it should never have been submitted.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 12:18:PM
In your opinion.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 12:29:PM
My opinion is a pretty strong one too.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 12:31:PM
But nevertheless as worthless as mine in the scheme of things.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 12:37:PM
But nevertheless as worthless as mine in the scheme of things.


I suppose so for the time being,anyway.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: mike tesko on April 27, 2013, 06:16:PM
There was no DNA testing at the time of the trial so they presented the best evidence they had at the time. It was up to the jury whether or not to accept it.

Best evidence being the introduction of the dodgy silencer, and the dodgy photographs taken by PC Bird, after police officers restaged Sheila's body on the bedroom floor - easy to fool the jury and everybody else wasn't it...
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on April 27, 2013, 06:21:PM
A case of what the eye doesn't see,eh,Mike.? Are all cases carried out this way.?
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Steve_uk on April 27, 2013, 06:36:PM
No don't do that. I rather like it for the short snappy posts. I took one to read the Eaton's had a baby until the sentence became clear.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on April 27, 2013, 06:50:PM
No don't do that. I rather like it for the short snappy posts. I took one to read the Eaton's had a baby until the sentence became clear.

Lol

It's ok if the response is only a few words but he sticks whole paragraphs in it and it takes ages to scroll through. I have a low boredom threshold.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Alias on April 29, 2013, 09:46:PM
Lol

It's ok if the response is only a few words but he sticks whole paragraphs in it and it takes ages to scroll through. I have a low boredom threshold.

So do I. I was just thinking, is there no way of speeding the damned thing up!
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: packagebuilder on May 01, 2013, 11:35:PM
What mike is saying, toxicology results.

they test the blood for chemicals like drugs or poisons

and urine to for the same..

If this "flake blood" inside the silencer was Shelia's then it should come back positive for cannabis? if tested for drugs.

We know Shelia's blood test of toxicology came back positive for cannabis!! if the blood in the silencer came back negative then its not her blood and the case falls! we all know rabbits don't smoke cannabis.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on May 02, 2013, 12:33:AM
What mike is saying, toxicology results.

they test the blood for chemicals like drugs or poisons

and urine to for the same..

If this "flake blood" inside the silencer was Shelia's then it should come back positive for cannabis? if tested for drugs.

We know Shelia's blood test of toxicology came back positive for cannabis!! if the blood in the silencer came back negative then its not her blood and the case falls! we all know rabbits don't smoke cannabis.

They didn't test the flake for cannabis.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Lugg on May 02, 2013, 09:34:AM
What mike is saying, toxicology results.

they test the blood for chemicals like drugs or poisons

and urine to for the same..

If this "flake blood" inside the silencer was Shelia's then it should come back positive for cannabis? if tested for drugs.

We know Shelia's blood test of toxicology came back positive for cannabis!! if the blood in the silencer came back negative then its not her blood and the case falls! we all know rabbits don't smoke cannabis.
Good point PB. I have the reasoning powers of a rabbit sometimes. ;D
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Lugg on May 02, 2013, 09:36:AM
They didn't test the flake for cannabis.
Interesting. Another fail on their part then? Especially if they were trying to prove that the silencer was used that night.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: susan on May 02, 2013, 09:48:AM
Hi Lugg great point made by packagebuilder.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: lookout on May 02, 2013, 09:59:AM
Interesting. Another fail on their part then? Especially if they were trying to prove that the silencer was used that night.


Am I losing track here,,or was there a silencer which was damaged.? Because if there was a damaged silencer,,it would have been done on/under the shelf of the Aga,,because of the unexpected length of rifle complete with silencer. It being cumbersome.
If this was the case,,it would have been the damaged silencer in the cupboard if anything.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on May 02, 2013, 05:25:PM
Interesting. Another fail on their part then? Especially if they were trying to prove that the silencer was used that night.

Well not really, because they didn't find any trace of cannabis in the blood sample taken from Sheila either. Cannabis type compounds were found in the urine sample which lead them to conclude that she had used cannabis several days beforehand.
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: maggie on May 02, 2013, 05:40:PM
Well not really, because they didn't find any trace of cannabis in the blood sample taken from Sheila either. Cannabis type compounds were found in the urine sample which lead them to conclude that she had used cannabis several days beforehand.
Hi Bridget, unless they did a specific THC test cannabis would not have showed up.  In a light cannabis smoker it only stays in the blood stream for about 4 hours, of course a heavy user would have it continually showing in the blood under tests.  Cannabis does stay in the body, I think in the liver and kidneys for a month or more but not in the blood. :)
Title: Re: Sheila's right hand resting on sooty magazine clue...
Post by: Bridget on May 02, 2013, 05:45:PM
Hi Bridget, unless they did a specific THC test cannabis would not have showed up.  In a light cannabis smoker it only stays in the blood stream for about 4 hours, of course a heavy user would have it continually showing in the blood under tests.  Cannabis does stay in the body, I think in the liver and kidneys for a month or more but not in the blood. :)

That's interesting Maggie, thank you :)

It should at least put to bed the theory that a neg test on the flake for cannabis (if it had been done) would exclude the blood from being Sheila's.
Title: Re: To The 'Eater of the Worms' Can....
Post by: campion on May 03, 2013, 10:42:AM
  Can someoe kindly explain to me, the significance of locking up Ann Eaton Topic?
Title: Re: To The 'Eater of the Worms' Can....
Post by: maggie on May 03, 2013, 10:59:AM
  Can someoe kindly explain to me, the significance of locking up Ann Eaton Topic?
Hi campion the thread was locked late last night/early morning to stop it becoming anymore abusive. Have unlocked it just now sorry for inconvenience  ;D