The John Kennedy Bradley, testimony at Bambers trial...

[mike tesko]

Saving their own necks from what? Oh of course, they shot Sheila and now Nevile - sorry, don't buy any of that so there was no motivation.

Just shows you how very little you pay attention to the detail, since it has never been my suggestion that cops shot and killed Sheila and Neville, I have only mentioned the shooting of Neville on the footing that Sheila was never downstairs in the kitchen as it clearly states in the police radio message log version of the events (two dead bodies in kitchen, the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female, one of these deaths a murder, and the other ...a suicide)

[mike tesko]

Just shows you how very little you pay attention to the detail, since it has never been my suggestion that cops shot and killed Sheila and Neville, I have only mentioned the shooting of Neville on the footing that Sheila was never downstairs in the kitchen as it clearly states in the police radio message log version of the events (two dead bodies in kitchen, the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female, one of these deaths a murder, and the other ...a suicide)

The 'Officers Report' (1612, refers, first part of investigation - SC/688/85) 'shooting in kitchen on entry'...

Now, either there was (a) a shooting in the kitchen which didn't involve any victim, (b) there was a shooting in kitchen involving one of the victims...

Lets also not forget the magical moment when a fragmented bullet (PV/20) grew and became a whole bullet so thaat the prosecutions Ballistic expert could say that in his opinion the Whole bullet in question (PV/20) had been loaded and fired via the anshuzt rifle (of course it had, but unfortunately, it was loaded and fired from the anshuzt rifle during unreported, unofficial test firings of the anshuzt rifle andd comntrol ammunition, control ammunition which was usedd in a substitution exercise, so that the prosecutions case at trial could lead with the assumption that the killings of the five victims had been as a result of a one gun crimke, where the same gun had fired all 25 / 24 shots...

[Jane]

Just shows you how very little you pay attention to the detail, since it has never been my suggestion that cops shot and killed Sheila and Neville, I have only mentioned the shooting of Neville on the footing that Sheila was never downstairs in the kitchen as it clearly states in the police radio message log version of the events (two dead bodies in kitchen, the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female, one of these deaths a murder, and the other ...a suicide)

Right! So yu woz just 'avin a larrf every time you've mentioned Sheila pulling the police weapon into her own neck, and the police accidentally firing the second shot, and you threw in the suggestion that they killed Nevill to raise debate? S'okay! Just as long as we're clear.

[Jane]

The 'Officers Report' (1612, refers, first part of investigation - SC/688/85) 'shooting in kitchen on entry'...

Now, either there was (a) a shooting in the kitchen which didn't involve any victim, (b) there was a shooting in kitchen involving one of the victims...

Lets also not forget the magical moment when a fragmented bullet (PV/20) grew and became a whole bullet so thaat the prosecutions Ballistic expert could say that in his opinion the Whole bullet in question (PV/20) had been loaded and fired via the anshuzt rifle (of course it had, but unfortunately, it was loaded and fired from the anshuzt rifle during unreported, unofficial test firings of the anshuzt rifle andd comntrol ammunition, control ammunition which was usedd in a substitution exercise, so that the prosecutions case at trial could lead with the assumption that the killings of the five victims had been as a result of a one gun crimke, where the same gun had fired all 25 / 24 shots...

I think what we have here is the indiscriminate use of the English language. It properly should have read "On entry THERE HAD BEEN a shooting (incident?) in the kitchen".

[mike tesko]

Right! So yu woz just 'avin a larrf every time you've mentioned Sheila pulling the police weapon into her own neck, well, no I wasn't since that was what did happen... and the police accidentally firing the second shot  My account is totally accurate and true..., and you threw in the suggestion that they killed Nevill to raise debate? No, I was merely making out the case for if any of you cannot bring yourelves to accept the true version of events that the only other alternative was that Cops must have shot Neville Bamber upon entering the kitchen, because there was a shooting incident in the kitchen upon entry of the cops! I am glad to hear that no-one buys into tht scenario - that being the case, tghen what shooting incident is being referred to in the 'officers report' (1612 of SC/688/85)? S'okay! Just as long as we're clear. Make no mistake about it, how else could Sheila be beleived to have been dead in the kitchen, her death referred to to on countless occassions during individual police radio message logs

[mike tesko]

I think what we have here is the indiscriminate use of the English language. I was surprised to learn that PS Bews copuld even tell the correct time to be honest, his messages timed at 7.37am, 7.38am, 7.42am and 8.10am have caused me to revise my opinion that anybody who worked for Essex police in that era could not know or tell the correct time of day or night! Additionally, they were always referring to a trick of this or a trick of that whatever needed to be said. If cops can't record basic things in  basic english in a log, or an officers reportr, why should anyone believe a word any of them say, or have said, or what they could  say, or what they could have said (its a tricky situation)!!! It properly should have read "On entry THERE HAD BEEN a shooting (incident?) in the kitchen". Whether it should, or it shouldn't, it didn't...

The evidence is what it is, no need to try and alter it in favour of the prosecutions case, why not alter it in favour of the defendant? Oh, I get it, you favour the criminals in wigs and gowns and uniforms, enough said...

[Jane]

 Since there clearly HAD been a shooting incident in the kitchen, prior to the police entering, no one has ever suggested anything to the contrary...................until you tried to apply new meaning to the words "Shooting in kitchen on entry".

[mike tesko]

 Since there clearly HAD been a shooting incident in the kitchen, prior to the police entering, no one has ever suggested anything to the contrary...................until you tried to apply new meaning to the words "Shooting in kitchen on entry".

There clearly was a shooting incident in kitchen upon entry, and a second body, who could only have been Sheila (7.35am, 7.37am, 7.38am,  7.42am, 7.45am,) downstairs in that kitchen! Sheila was shot in the kitchen, hence why her body was reported as being present in the kitchen! She was suspected of being dead, her apparent death being spoken about in terms of a suicide by 7.45am! Sheila was the only victim who's death can be presented as being a suicide! The first shot across her neck had to be tampered with by the police so that the whole bullet that replaced the piece of a badly fragmented bullet (the original PV/20) could be presented as having been fired via the anshuzt rifle along with the fatal bullet (PV/20), that the shooting of Sheila was a one gun crime!

The problem cops were faced with was that originally that the two bullets subject of the shooting of Sheila Caffell, were fired from two entirely different guns...

[Jane]

There clearly was a shooting incident in kitchen upon entry, and a second body, who could only have been Sheila (7.35am, 7.37am, 7.38am,  7.42am, 7.45am,) downstairs in that kitchen! Sheila was shot in the kitchen, hence why her body was reported as being present in the kitchen! She was suspected of being dead, her apparent death being spoken about in terms of a suicide by 7.45am! Sheila was the only victim who's death can be presented as being a suicide! The first shot across her neck had to be tampered with by the police so that the whole bullet that replaced the piece of a badly fragmented bullet (the original PV/20) could be presented as having been fired via the anshuzt rifle along with the fatal bullet (PV/20), that the shooting of Sheila was a one gun crime!

The problem cops were faced with was that originally that the two bullets subject of the shooting of Sheila Caffell, were fired from two entirely different guns...

Jeremy must have done a good enough job of A) presenting her murder as suicide B) convincing police that she was mentally fragile enough to do it. That a TEAM of shooters can accidentally shoot someone, casually assume they're dead, and step over them is incomprehensible.....................especially as ONE shot from a high calibre police weapon would very likely have done more damage than that of the two shots she sustained, put together. She certainly wouldn't have got up and walked away from that one.

[mike tesko]

Jeremy must have done a good enough job of A) presenting her murder as suicide B) convincing police that she was mentally fragile enough to do it. That a TEAM of shooters can accidentally shoot someone, casually assume they're dead, and step over them is incomprehensible.....................especially as ONE shot from a high calibre police weapon would very likely have done more damage than that of the two shots she sustained, put together. She certainly wouldn't have got up and walked away from that one.

Your speculating without any concrete proof that Sheila wasn't and could not have been the dead (as called) body of one dead female in the kitchen from as early as 7.35am, followed by other timed messages at 7.37am, 7.38am, 7.42am and of course by 7.45am! Cops don't make such glaring mistakes or errors when it comes to passing contemporaneously recorded and timed messages, not on so many occasions without at least somebody at some stage quering what had been told and said by one of their own on as it were several differently timed occasions - cops wouldn't have had sufficient time nor opportunity to falsify these police radio message logs, unlike the contents of their witness statements which could be chopped, changed and edited days, weeks, or months later by which time they could advised about what to leave out, or as the case may be, put in...

The truth of the matter was that Sheila was shot just as cops entered the kitchen and was rendered unconscious immediately, and presumed dead!!!

The fact that the blood flow from the initial shot across the neck appears feint like in its appearance, and vertical in fashion is testimony to the fact that there was only a small amount of bloodflow eminating from the first wound because Sheila was rendered unconscious instanteneously! There was obviously a somewhat protracted delay between Sheila being shot twice because no sooner was she shot a second time blood gushed and flowed from the wound site beneath Sheila's chin! It would appear that there was some truth in what Professor Knight had to say regarding there having been such a potentially lengthy delay in-between both shots! Of course, Sheila wasn't moving around during the entire period in-between shot 1 and shot 2 being inflicted, such a delay was governed by the amount of time Sheila had been rendered unconscious a after the first shot!