Author Topic: Disturbing Evidence, which confirms that cops handed back silencer to the family  (Read 117824 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
I disagree there are many examples in the case file in my possession which have been produced using the same, or similar fonts!

Those fonts aren't similar at all.
Few people have the imagination for reality

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
In the obviously fake letter, Stan is supposed to refer to a Sound Moderator, yet in his court testimony it’s refered to as a Silencer, also the fact Anne and other family members refer to it as silencer?  Why the newer version Sound Moderator all of a sudden?


http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=9010.0;attach=50307

Stan Jones Court Testimony

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=417.0;attach=1264

Peter Eaton statement
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1209.0;attach=6232


Anne’s testimony

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=211.0;attach=492

I agree - I think we can now move on from this.
Few people have the imagination for reality

Offline sami

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4490
I agree - I think we can now move on from this.
its only fair to give mike the last word on this ,caroline :)

Offline Jane

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 33764
Thats what I said, it got refered to Sound Moderator once it had been to Huntington in my guess, Fletchers statement is dated 13/November And Howard is 3/October I would hazard a guess that even though they are talking about earlier dates, the actual letters are later dates.  I find it strange he would write a statement Saying he was handed a Sound Moderator so early in his statement, then refer to this without any prompt in Court as a Silencer?

As do I, Justice, and as I said as part of my initial response to the report. SINCE then, in order to give it greater consideration, I've rewritten it in my own hand. I'm extremely puzzled by this sentence. Having stated that he attended the scene on Aug 7th, he goes on to say "On August 9th along with DCI "Taff" Jones I attended (the scene) I covertly returned it (the sound moderator) to the farmhouse on the authority of DCI "Taff" Jones" Firstly. I'd ask WHY the need to continually put the DCI's forename in inverts? Everyone knew him as Taff? Secondly,  he states -totally unnecessarily- that the action of returning the SM was "covert", given that he goes on to say that the action was authorized by a senior officer. The insertion of "covertly" causes me to smell a very large rat.

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
Mike, can you post a close up of the font used in the statement. The letters are too blurry to make out what kind of font it is. I'm sure you would like to know if it;s genuine or fake?
Few people have the imagination for reality

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51079
Thats what I said, it got refered to Sound Moderator once it had been to Huntington in my guess, Fletchers statement is dated 13/November And Howard is 3/October I would hazard a guess that even though they are talking about earlier dates, the actual letters are later dates.  I find it strange he would write a statement Saying he was handed a Sound Moderator so early in his statement, then refer to this without any prompt in Court as a Silencer?

The whole purpose of someone creating a composite witness statement for somebody else, is to suggest that the named witness made such a statement of their own free will, when clearly this is not the case. The fact that whoever created DS Jones 8th September 1985 composite witness statement and used the description of the gun suppressor as being 'A SOUND MODERATOR', rather than a silencer as you are suggesting Stan Jones would have described it, only serves to highlight why these composite witness statements should not be created and used for evidential purposes, since the named witness has no control or very little if any input into the body or contents of the composite statement being created for them by another...

I am more interested in the timing of when this composite witness statement was created, as well as its contents...

Why did someone create this version of that composite witness statement?

Well, its no secret that Stan Jones must have felt like a big weight had been lifted off his shoulders when his boss, DCI 'Taff' Jones was removed from his post as head of the investigation, and replaced by DCS 'Mick' Ainsley. It seems to me that it allowed Stan Jones leeway of sorts to delve into the troublesome  aspects of the case. For example, it must have been very frustrating having seen the bodies of the two female victims laid on top of the bed, on that first morning, only for him to find out later on, that June Bambers body had been photographed on the floor by the bedroom door, and with Sheila's body ending up on the floor on the opposite side of the bed, clutching the rifle? It must have been somewhat puzzling to 'Stan' Jones to see that Sheila had got two bullet wounds to her neck by the time her body was eventually photographed, whereas there had only been one bullet  wound there when he viewed her body insitu on top of the bed! Then there  was all the additional blood which according to the crime scene photographs taken once her body had been moved from the bed to the floor, ran horizontal in fashion across her neck and from the corners of her mouth, and nostril? There was no such blood staining of that nature when he had looked at Sheila laying on top of the bed earlier! And, that large triangular shaped bloodstain on the right hand side of Sheila's nightdress, which wasn't there previously!

It must have been very frustrating  for Stan Jones to be on the receiving end of 'Taff' Jones tongue, over disclosing information to Ann Eaton and the other relatives regarding the location and position of June and Sheila's bodies laid on top of the bed, side by side, as witnessed by him prior to attending Jeremy's cottage at 9 Head Street, on that first morning of the police investigation, only to discover later that the two bodies had been displaced from the bed to different parts of the bedroom floor, either side of the bed...

There must have been doubts in Stan Jones mind, about what had happened to Sheila after he left the scene in the company of DC 'Mick' Clark and Jeremy...

'Taff' Jones did not confide in him, and Stan Jones knew better than to ask questions of him...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
The whole purpose of someone creating a composite witness statement for somebody else, is to suggest that the named witness made such a statement of their own free will, when clearly this is not the case. The fact that whoever created DS Jones 8th September 1985 composite witness statement and used the description of the gun suppressor as being 'A SOUND MODERATOR', rather than a silencer as you are suggesting Stan Jones would have described it, only serves to highlight why these composite witness statements should not be created and used for evidential purposes, since the named witness has no control or very little if any input into the body or contents of the composite statement being created for them by another...

I am more interested in the timing of when this composite witness statement was created, as well as its contents...

Why did someone create this version of that composite witness statement?

Well, its no secret that Stan Jones must have felt like a big weight had been lifted off his shoulders when his boss, DCI 'Taff' Jones was removed from his post as head of the investigation, and replaced by DCS 'Mick' Ainsley. It seems to me that it allowed Stan Jones leeway of sorts to delve into the troublesome  aspects of the case. For example, it must have been very frustrating having seen the bodies of the two female victims laid on top of the bed, on that first morning, only for him to find out later on, that June Bambers body had been photographed on the floor by the bedroom door, and with Sheila's body ending up on the floor on the opposite side of the bed, clutching the rifle? It must have been somewhat puzzling to 'Stan' Jones to see that Sheila had got two bullet wounds to her neck by the time her body was eventually photographed, whereas there had only been one bullet  wound there when he viewed her body insitu on top of the bed! Then there  was all the additional blood which according to the crime scene photographs taken once her body had been moved from the bed to the floor, ran horizontal in fashion across her neck and from the corners of her mouth, and nostril? There was no such blood staining of that nature when he had looked at Sheila laying on top of the bed earlier! And, that large triangular shaped bloodstain on the right hand side of Sheila's nightdress, which wasn't there previously!

It must have been very frustrating  for Stan Jones to be on the receiving end of 'Taff' Jones tongue, over disclosing information to Ann Eaton and the other relatives regarding the location and position of June and Sheila's bodies laid on top of the bed, side by side, as witnessed by him prior to attending Jeremy's cottage at 9 Head Street, on that first morning of the police investigation, only to discover later that the two bodies had been displaced from the bed to different parts of the bedroom floor, either side of the bed...

There must have been doubts in Stan Jones mind, about what had happened to Sheila after he left the scene in the company of DC 'Mick' Clark and Jeremy...

'Taff' Jones did not confide in him, and Stan Jones knew better than to ask questions of him...

If you post  apicture of the font we might be able to work that out!
Few people have the imagination for reality

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51079
Mike, can you post a close up of the font used in the statement. The letters are too blurry to make out what kind of font it is. I'm sure you would like to know if it;s genuine or fake?

Of course, but I can assure you all that this document was amongst the material in my possession all the while, I still have a mountain of other stuff to go through and I shall be keeping a keen eye open for anything else that could be of interest...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 27076
Of course, but I can assure you all that this document was amongst the material in my possession all the while, I still have a mountain of other stuff to go through and I shall be keeping a keen eye open for anything else that could be of interest...

I'm not saying it wasn't but the more it can be linked to the 1980'sthe more likely it's genuine. If it is genuine then it would be wrong to sit on it.
Few people have the imagination for reality

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51079
The whole purpose of someone creating a composite witness statement for somebody else, is to suggest that the named witness made such a statement of their own free will, when clearly this is not the case. The fact that whoever created DS Jones 8th September 1985 composite witness statement and used the description of the gun suppressor as being 'A SOUND MODERATOR', rather than a silencer as you are suggesting Stan Jones would have described it, only serves to highlight why these composite witness statements should not be created and used for evidential purposes, since the named witness has no control or very little if any input into the body or contents of the composite statement being created for them by another...

I am more interested in the timing of when this composite witness statement was created, as well as its contents...

Why did someone create this version of that composite witness statement?

Well, its no secret that Stan Jones must have felt like a big weight had been lifted off his shoulders when his boss, DCI 'Taff' Jones was removed from his post as head of the investigation, and replaced by DCS 'Mick' Ainsley. It seems to me that it allowed Stan Jones leeway of sorts to delve into the troublesome  aspects of the case. For example, it must have been very frustrating having seen the bodies of the two female victims laid on top of the bed, on that first morning, only for him to find out later on, that June Bambers body had been photographed on the floor by the bedroom door, and with Sheila's body ending up on the floor on the opposite side of the bed, clutching the rifle? It must have been somewhat puzzling to 'Stan' Jones to see that Sheila had got two bullet wounds to her neck by the time her body was eventually photographed, whereas there had only been one bullet  wound there when he viewed her body insitu on top of the bed! Then there  was all the additional blood which according to the crime scene photographs taken once her body had been moved from the bed to the floor, ran horizontal in fashion across her neck and from the corners of her mouth, and nostril? There was no such blood staining of that nature when he had looked at Sheila laying on top of the bed earlier! And, that large triangular shaped bloodstain on the right hand side of Sheila's nightdress, which wasn't there previously!

It must have been very frustrating  for Stan Jones to be on the receiving end of 'Taff' Jones tongue, over disclosing information to Ann Eaton and the other relatives regarding the location and position of June and Sheila's bodies laid on top of the bed, side by side, as witnessed by him prior to attending Jeremy's cottage at 9 Head Street, on that first morning of the police investigation, only to discover later that the two bodies had been displaced from the bed to different parts of the bedroom floor, either side of the bed...

There must have been doubts in Stan Jones mind, about what had happened to Sheila after he left the scene in the company of DC 'Mick' Clark and Jeremy...

'Taff' Jones did not confide in him, and Stan Jones knew better than to ask questions of him...

I have no doubt whatsoever in my mind that the purpose of someone creating this version of Stan Jones composite witness statement in the instant example has got something to do with the relatives still having got possession of a silencer / sound moderator, which by the 11th September 1985, Ann Eaton was handing it (DRB/1) over to DC Oakey, along with the other DRB exhibits, which for one reason or another, had their exhibit references altered and changed variously, and became AE/2, AE/3 and AE/4. then CAE/2, CAE/3 and CAE/4, until eventually DC Oakey presented them using his own identifying mark HGO, etc, etc, etc...

If as we know it to be the case, the investigation altered course from the 6th September 1985, as a result of Robert Boutflour bending Simpsons ear so that a fresh investigation altogether was to take place, which it did (SC/786/85) the silencer / sound moderator / suppressor had to be introduced again, or at least one had to introduced. With this in mind, it would appear that a composite witness statement was created in Stan Jones name, explaining that the said item had in fact been returned into the possession of the family. The contents of Stan Jones composite witness statement, dated, 8th September 1985, served that purpose, and it distanced Stan Jones from the influence of 'Taff' Jones, the DCI...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Jane

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 33764
I have no doubt whatsoever in my mind that the purpose of someone creating this version of Stan Jones composite witness statement in the instant example has got something to do with the relatives still having got possession of a silencer / sound moderator, which by the 11th September 1985, Ann Eaton was handing it (DRB/1) over to DC Oakey, along with the other DRB exhibits, which for one reason or another, had their exhibit references altered and changed variously, and became AE/2, AE/3 and AE/4. then CAE/2, CAE/3 and CAE/4, until eventually DC Oakey presented them using his own identifying mark HGO, etc, etc, etc...

If as we know it to be the case, the investigation altered course from the 6th September 1985, as a result of Robert Boutflour bending Simpsons ear so that a fresh investigation altogether was to take place, which it did (SC/786/85) the silencer / sound moderator / suppressor had to be introduced again, or at least one had to introduced. With this in mind, it would appear that a composite witness statement was created in Stan Jones name, explaining that the said item had in fact been returned into the possession of the family. The contents of Stan Jones composite witness statement, dated, 8th September 1985, served that purpose, and it distanced Stan Jones from the influence of 'Taff' Jones, the DCI...

"The purpose of someone creating this version of Stan Jones' composite witness statement..............."  those words suggest not only that you believe it to be fake, but you also appear to say -by dint of the fact that you refer to it as being "composite"- that none of it was ever original to start with.

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51079
I have no doubt whatsoever in my mind that the purpose of someone creating this version of Stan Jones composite witness statement in the instant example has got something to do with the relatives still having got possession of a silencer / sound moderator, which by the 11th September 1985, Ann Eaton was handing it (DRB/1) over to DC Oakey, along with the other DRB exhibits, which for one reason or another, had their exhibit references altered and changed variously, and became AE/2, AE/3 and AE/4. then CAE/2, CAE/3 and CAE/4, until eventually DC Oakey presented them using his own identifying mark HGO, etc, etc, etc...

If as we know it to be the case, the investigation altered course from the 6th September 1985, as a result of Robert Boutflour bending Simpsons ear so that a fresh investigation altogether was to take place, which it did (SC/786/85) the silencer / sound moderator / suppressor had to be introduced again, or at least one had to introduced. With this in mind, it would appear that a composite witness statement was created in Stan Jones name, explaining that the said item had in fact been returned into the possession of the family. The contents of Stan Jones composite witness statement, dated, 8th September 1985, served that purpose, and it distanced Stan Jones from the influence of 'Taff' Jones, the DCI...

As far as I am concerned, everything is starting to fall into place regarding 'the introduction of the second silencer / sound moderator/ suppressor' (DRB/1), which the relatives still had possession of by the 11th September 1985. Essex police retained possession of DRB/1 until the 20th September 1985, when along with the other DRB exhibits 'under the disguise of different exhibit references', were sent to Huntingdon Lab' to be checked for blood and fibers. Albeit, much too late for the lab' experts to be able to say that the blood group evidence (A, EAP BA, AK1 and HP 2-1) could have been found inside it (DRB/1) because the blood was found inside the other silencer (DB/1) that had been at the lab' ever since the 30th August 1985' as part of the other investigation (SC/688/85)...

The prosecutions case at the time of Jeremy Bambers trial at Chelmsford Crown Court in October 1986, was based on deception of the worst kind - the 'blood group evidence' attributed to Sheila Caffell, on the footing that it was 'unique and exclusive' to her, was not found inside the silencer / sound moderator / suppressor bearing the identifying mark of DRB/1, it couldn't have been because this silencer / sound moderator / suppressor did not get sent along to the lab' until after the blood had been found in the other one (DB/1). The Lab' records and documentation confirm what I am saying to be the truth, there was never any blood at all inside DRB/1, only red paint upon it from the red painted kitchen aga!

That's what all this business is about, and I'm talking about the composite witness statement made in Stan Jones name, dated, the 8th September 1985, its about trying to marry up two different silencers / sound moderators / suppressors, as the same one! You soon realise that things don't match or marry up in the records concerning the date blood was found inside the one at the lab' (DB/1) on the 12th September 1985, which the ballistic expert, Fletcher dismantled on that date, and found the all important flake trapped between baffle plates, therein. In turn, Fletcher handed DB/1 to the blood expert, John Hayward who analysed the blood which produced the blood group evidence that was used to help convict Jeremy Bamber as the killer, but that blood was not found inside DRB/1 which did not arrive at the lab' until on or after the 20th September 1985...
« Last Edit: December 05, 2017, 01:06:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51079
"The purpose of someone creating this version of Stan Jones' composite witness statement..............."  those words suggest not only that you believe it to be fake, but you also appear to say -by dint of the fact that you refer to it as being "composite"- that none of it was ever original to start with.

But that is the whole point that  I am saying, these composite witness statements that keep getting made by unknown faceless cops, or force solicitors, or the CPS, are statements which are not being made voluntarily, or in many cases with the knowledge and consent of the named witness, these dodgy witness statements are being attributed against someones name, and in the vast majority of cases the named witness does not know anything at all about it, these dodgy witness statements are being misused to help to convict innocent people of crimes they shouldn't have even been prosecuted for, because without the contents of these fabricated composite statements there would be no evidence in the first instance, its completely barmy, the system is corrupted by these measures and means. Someone has got to make a stand against this form of dishonesty and corruption...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 51079
Laying my hands on this composite witness statement, dated, 8th September, 1985, made in Stan Jones name, has caused me to realise the bigger picture behind the decision to prosecute Jeremy Bamber as the killer by starting afresh with a new investigation (SC/786/85) from 6th September 1985! One silencer / sound moderator / suppressor (DB/1) went to the lab' as part of the first investigation (SC/688/85), the second one (DRB/1) went to the lab' as part of the new investigation (SC/786/85). There was blood in the first one (DB/1) and there was red paint from the kitchen aga surround on the second one (DRB/1). By the time the matter came to trial, cops, relatives and the lab' had doctored all the paperwork to give a false impression that there had only been one silencer / sound moderator / suppressor, inside which the blood group evidence and upon it the paint evidence was attributed. This culminated in DRB/1 being the vehicle inside and upon which introduced the key scientific evidence, Court exhibit No.9
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Jane

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 33764
But that is the whole point that  I am saying, these composite witness statements that keep getting made by unknown faceless cops, or force solicitors, or the CPS, are statements which are not being made voluntarily, or in many cases with the knowledge and consent of the named witness, these dodgy witness statements are being attributed against someones name, and in the vast majority of cases the named witness does not know anything at all about it, these dodgy witness statements are being misused to help to convict innocent people of crimes they shouldn't have even been prosecuted for, because without the contents of these fabricated composite statements there would be no evidence in the first instance, its completely barmy, the system is corrupted by these measures and means. Someone has got to make a stand against this form of dishonesty and corruption...

Oh RIGHT!! So there never was a (insert whichever name you want) taken from WHF on Aug 7th and "covertly" returned there on Aug 9th.