Why wasn't crispy shot?

[notsure]

She doesn't it just her opinion

I went over this with Maggie earlier Adam

Umm isn’t that all we’ve got ..... opinions

[lebaleb]

The conversation with Dorothy Bencher doesn't support Bamber's implied suggestion that they were talking about having the twins fostered out. People keep missing out the point that she emphasised that June was 'obviously AGAINST this idea'.

Of course she was against it! They were her grandchildren. That again is not relevant. The fact is that June thought it a possibility. June may have even thought it a remote possibility but was using it to try and motivate Sheila.

[lebaleb]

She was taking sedative medication Lookout, she had a moderate (not low) dosage still in her system and was due another injection.

Your last comment simply isn't true, people have their medication altered all of the time until they find the right dose for treatment. You should know that happens!

People may be medicated but often that doesn't prevent psychotic episodes when they become manic, hyperactive and delusional.

[lebaleb]

If we look at the previous times she'd "had an episode" she was either banging her fists against the wall or putting her wrist through glass. She wasn't killing four with 23 shots, none of which missed, then changing out of bloodied clothing, burning them in the Aga then changing into a nightdress to commit suicide, with or without silencer attached.

If there had been a gun available who knows?

[Stephanie]

If there had been a gun available who knows?

Oh what an imaginative mind you have

[lebaleb]

She'd always turned the psychosis inward before and I see no reason for her to deviate from previous behaviour.

Psychotic episodes come in different degrees of severity. Some can be benign; silly delusions and hysterical laughter, others murderous.

[lebaleb]

I absolutely agree with this lookout. To me this points to her having an episode. Only my opinion though just like I don’t believe she went to bed. Her bed hadn’t been slept in. Compared to June and Neville’s where they obviously go to bed.

During her episode at Freddie's she was under medication. She was taking Anafranil 3x10mg a day. Dr Furgusen says he believes she was taking it. In mental hospitals they have problems with patients even when they are under sedation. The drugs are not 100% effective against psychotic episodes.

[lookout]

People may be medicated but often that doesn't prevent psychotic episodes when they become manic, hyperactive and delusional.

As a family,we unfortunately had the frighteningly sad experience this summer of a child member ( 9 years of age ) who has a " behavioural-type " problem ( medics can't put a diagnosis to it ) who had been given medication because of her outbursts. Her mother took the children shopping and this child had a huge meltdown in a shop and was hitting out at everyone and being destructive. It took her mother all her time to try and control the child but she had to ring a taxi to take them all home.Then an immediate visit to the GP who'd said the wrong medication had been prescribed and also the high dose had been unacceptable for a child of those years. It had been an overdose !
After a much hit and miss decision,it was decided to give her a different medication and since then ( touch wood ) the child has been tons better with no more outbursts to date.
If a 9 year old can't be pacified or controlled,what chance would a young have with a worse degree of such a problem ? Treatment meant to keep them sedated/calm had the opposite effect.A fact.

[Adam]

As a family,we unfortunately had the frighteningly sad experience this summer of a child member ( 9 years of age ) who has a " behavioural-type " problem ( medics can't put a diagnosis to it ) who had been given medication because of her outbursts. Her mother took the children shopping and this child had a huge meltdown in a shop and was hitting out at everyone and being destructive. It took her mother all her time to try and control the child but she had to ring a taxi to take them all home.Then an immediate visit to the GP who'd said the wrong medication had been prescribed and also the high dose had been unacceptable for a child of those years. It had been an overdose !
After a much hit and miss decision,it was decided to give her a different medication and since then ( touch wood ) the child has been tons better with no more outbursts to date.
If a 9 year old can't be pacified or controlled,what chance would a young have with a worse degree of such a problem ? Treatment meant to keep them sedated/calm had the opposite effect.A fact.

Nevill certainly couldn't control Sheila. Which is why he rang Bamber.

[lookout]

The thing is Adam,because there are other siblings and this 9 year old was clearly dangerous,should there have been any harm done to any of the siblings,who would be blamed,the mother ( for inflicting harm ) or a 9 year old child ??

[lookout]

I think I know more than most on this forum regarding being wrongly blamed !! This is why I have every sympathy for JB and the blame he had by those incompetent and malicious people who put him behind bars.

[Caroline]

Of course she was against it! They were her grandchildren. That again is not relevant. The fact is that June thought it a possibility. June may have even thought it a remote possibility but was using it to try and motivate Sheila.

So if they (Sheila and June) were both in agreements about he twins not being fostered, how could there have been a disarrangement? It is VERY relevant!

[lookout]

Nobody in their right mind would/should EVER suggest fostering when there are other areas of a family to consider.

[lookout]

What was wrong with Colin taking charge and having a say until such times as Sheila's health had improved to near normal ?

[Caroline]

Nobody in their right mind would/should EVER suggest fostering when there are other areas of a family to consider.

That's the point Lookout, June was AGAINST fostering!