Re - Professor Herbert Leon MacDonell:

[David1819]

He was hired by Jeremy in 1993. He was America's first and foremost ballistics expert.

He did a through investigation of all the trial evidence and new evidence that Jeremy's lawyer, Ewen Smith had got together.

His findings -

Everyone, including Sheila was shot to death by someone else.

He makes some interesting points.

Jeremy vowed to keep on fighting.

There is no question in the manner of death of Sheila Caffell, said the professor.

She could not shoot herself with the silencer attached. So was shot by someone else.

Dr MacDonell has recanted on his 1993 conclusions.

In 2011 MacDonell told Channel 4 News.

Dr MacDonell, who testified in the OJ Simpson murder case and was involved in the investigations into the assassinations of US Senator Robert F Kennedy and Martin Luther King Jr, told Channel 4 News:

“From the bloodstain patterns the victim’s arms must have been moved. Bloodstains on the floor showed that other objects were also moved. I concluded that it had to have been murder because of the two shots under her chin. (But) Some time later I learned that the pathologists concluded that she could have fired both shots so I now believe it could have been suicide as well.”

[Roch]

Dr MacDonell has recanted on his 1993 conclusions.

I wonder what he thinks about the bloodstain on the carpet (from Sheila having been placed in the recovery position) that police crudely attempted to cover with the bible as a prop, for the purpose of crime scene photography? 

They probably didn't think it was important to cover the entire stain.  As far as EP were concerned, after the Coroner had recorded a verdict of four murders and one suicide, the case would be forgotten about.  Nobody was ever meant to see the photographs anyway.  Whatever had gone pear-shaped for police that morning - would become safe immediately after the Coroner's verdict. 

However, Jeremy's relatives' insistence that he had committed the killings and their threats to go to the press, put paid to that original plan.  As EP did not want whatever had gone pear-shaped being exposed.

Oh wait!  I forgot -  it was Jeremy Bamber who staged the scene.  Therefore Jeremy Bamber must have attempted to hide the unusual bloodstain, using the bible as a prop.  Presumably, he must have thought that particular stain would look unsightly, for the police photography of his handiwork later in the day.

[Stephanie]

I wonder what he thinks about the bloodstain on the carpet (from Sheila having been placed in the recovery position) that police crudely attempted to cover with the bible as a prop, for the purpose of crime scene photography? 

They probably didn't think it was important to cover the entire stain.  As far as EP were concerned, after the Coroner had recorded a verdict of four murders and one suicide, the case would be forgotten about.  Nobody was ever meant to see the photographs anyway.  Whatever had gone pear-shaped for police that morning - would become safe immediately after the Coroner's verdict. 

However, Jeremy's relatives' insistence that he had committed the killings and their threats to go to the press, put paid to that original plan.  As EP did not want whatever had gone pear-shaped being exposed.

Oh wait!  I forgot -  it was Jeremy Bamber who staged the scene.  Therefore Jeremy Bamber must have attempted to hide the unusual bloodstain, using the bible as a prop.  Presumably, he must have thought that particular stain would look unsightly, for the police photography of his handiwork later in the day.

This is a myth Roch.

Jeremy Bamber did stage the crime scene in the hope of getting away with murder.

Just because someone changes their mind regarding an opinion, doesn't make the facts any less clearer, especially when seen in there entirety.

Forensic expert Tiernan Coyle wrote to the COA following SH's appeal being upheld in 2011. His letter was lengthy and referred to his findings. Not only didn't he agree with the fibre evidence in the prosecution case he went further suggesting the clothing worn by the offender/s was made of a tracksuit type material. Can't remember his exact description. But he was wrong, and like many others experts, put his reputation on the line.

I have often wondered why the public didn't make more of SH's confession and why so many people, including experts, appeared to focus on his confession having been made due to his alleged mental health at the time or that his confession was false due to some other reason.

I've wondered if the reason more wasn't made of SH's confession could have been down to ego's? So many professionals were involved in his case over the years; all of them of course wrong. But none of them, apart from David Jessel, ever spoke out publicly of having been duped; of their findings having been wrong.

None of them ever redacted their findings over the years? None of them ever reviewed their findings as far as I am aware. Therefore there is a wealth of material in the public domain that is not only misleading it is wrong. The same applies to other cases.

And the thing is, over the years people (Including experts) change their minds. But when they change their minds these changes aren't made a big deal of nor placed in the public domain, therefore only their original comments are available. Which again can be misleading and wrong.

[Roch]

This is a myth Roch.

Jeremy Bamber did stage the crime scene in the hope of getting away with murder.

Just because someone changes their mind regarding an opinion, doesn't make the facts any less clearer, especially when seen in there entirety.

Steph, you might be missing the point.  Why would he wish to cover a large and distinctive bloodstain on the carpet?  In effect, he would not be concealing the bloodstain in real terms - as it would simply be discovered by police underneath the bible anyway? Even if we took the line that he was motivated to cover the stain for some obscure reason - what possible reason or motivation could that be? 

Who had motive or reason to cover a heavy and distinctive bloodstain at the scene?  Jeremy Bamber was not doubling up as both killer and scene of crime photographer for Essex Constabulary.

[lookout]

Good posts there,Roch. CPR------yes,as spots of aspirated blood are clearly seen around the area of the carpet where Sheila was. Whoever had performed the procedure would have had blood on their clothing--------but it's not noticeable on a dark uniform is it ?

[Stephanie]

Steph, you might be missing the point.  Why would he wish to cover a large and distinctive bloodstain on the carpet?  In effect, he would not be concealing the bloodstain in real terms - as it would simply be discovered by police underneath the bible anyway? Even if we took the line that he was motivated to cover the stain for some obscure reason - what possible reason or motivation could that be? 

Who had motive or reason to cover a heavy and distinctive bloodstain at the scene?  Jeremy Bamber was not doubling up as both killer and scene of crime photographer for Essex Constabulary.

Where is you evidence Roch? Or is it only the word on A N other?

Further, no gun shots were heard from outside the farmhouse and you can guarantee if Jeremy Bamber had ever heard gunshots he would have made more of them over the years.

[Jane]

Good posts there,Roch. CPR------yes,as spots of aspirated blood are clearly seen around the area of the carpet where Sheila was. Whoever had performed the procedure would have had blood on their clothing--------but it's not noticeable on a dark uniform is it ?

Or a black wet suit.

[Stephanie]

Steph, you might be missing the point.  Why would he wish to cover a large and distinctive bloodstain on the carpet?  In effect, he would not be concealing the bloodstain in real terms - as it would simply be discovered by police underneath the bible anyway? Even if we took the line that he was motivated to cover the stain for some obscure reason - what possible reason or motivation could that be? 

Who had motive or reason to cover a heavy and distinctive bloodstain at the scene?  Jeremy Bamber was not doubling up as both killer and scene of crime photographer for Essex Constabulary.

Good posts there,Roch. CPR------yes,as spots of aspirated blood are clearly seen around the area of the carpet where Sheila was. Whoever had performed the procedure would have had blood on their clothing--------but it's not noticeable on a dark uniform is it ?

Actually Lookouts post is a good example of how easily things are twisted and taken out of context.

All it takes is one person to do as Lookout has done and a whole other story begins to take shape.

The other aspect is egos. When an expert or professional person has given an opinion why should it be taken as fact? How many experts/professionals have been wrong? What are their agendas/motives? Are they likely to admit they are wrong, after been proven wrong, or are they the type to dig their heals in no matter what?

What I am saying is that just because an expert or A N Other has claimed something, doesn't mean it is right/a fact.

There appears to be too much over reliance on 'expert' opinion, when common sense is often all that is needed.

[lookout]

If you've read a number of my posts,it states that I hardly do " expert opinions " I'd rather follow my own intuition.

[Roch]

Where is you evidence Roch? Or is it only the word on A N other?

Further, no gun shots were heard from outside the farmhouse and you can guarantee if Jeremy Bamber had ever heard gunshots he would have made more of them over the years.

Where is you evidence Roch? Or is it only the word on A N other?

Further, no gun shots were heard from outside the farmhouse and you can guarantee if Jeremy Bamber had ever heard gunshots he would have made more of them over the years.

It's highly unlikely that an officer would go on record to state that Sheila was placed in the recovery position (unless there is truth in the oft repeated claim, that COLP facilitated an offer for immunity from prosecution, in return for the truth being told - though whether that would be only verbally communicated  or be recorded in some from is not known by me).

Have a look at Sheila's crime scene photos.  Somebody has precariously placed a bible over a distinctive bloodstain on the carpet.  TFG officers initially questioned their superiors regarding the scene having been altered (from how it had first appeared to how it appeared the next time they viewed it).

The rifle that was supposed to have been used in the killings doesn't make much noise - it's only .22 calibre.  JB was sat in a police car in Page's Lane - so he would not have heard any shots. 

There was some interesting early news footage in which the reporter said 'the final shot that people heard... was the suicide shot'.

I'm not sure whether this clip was different to the Caroline Leuchars ITN footage.  I've checked the links for that footage in the archives and have noticed that many clips have now become unavailable to view and have 'not for resale' written underneath them.  I'm a bit curious about that.

[Caroline]

I wonder what he thinks about the bloodstain on the carpet (from Sheila having been placed in the recovery position) that police crudely attempted to cover with the bible as a prop, for the purpose of crime scene photography? 

They probably didn't think it was important to cover the entire stain.  As far as EP were concerned, after the Coroner had recorded a verdict of four murders and one suicide, the case would be forgotten about.  Nobody was ever meant to see the photographs anyway.  Whatever had gone pear-shaped for police that morning - would become safe immediately after the Coroner's verdict. 

However, Jeremy's relatives' insistence that he had committed the killings and their threats to go to the press, put paid to that original plan.  As EP did not want whatever had gone pear-shaped being exposed.

Oh wait!  I forgot -  it was Jeremy Bamber who staged the scene.  Therefore Jeremy Bamber must have attempted to hide the unusual bloodstain, using the bible as a prop.  Presumably, he must have thought that particular stain would look unsightly, for the police photography of his handiwork later in the day.

No, he didn't think that.

[Caroline]

I don't have to exert myself when I post anyway. It's known as confidence in the knowledge that I'm on the winning side,so no pressure nor lengthy posts needed,or referring to others,as a safety net of uncertainty.

We're also confident Lookout.

[lookout]

We're also confident Lookout.

I'm glad/pleased to hear that.

[lookout]

And that's the difference between people like you Lookout;

I'm not out to win.

For me it's about the truth. Winning doesn't come in to it.

This is about Jeremy winning his battle for freedom. He's already told the truth,now it's all about Justice being done and being seen to be done.
The winning is for Jeremy.

[Stephanie]

This is about Jeremy winning his battle for freedom. He's already told the truth,now it's all about Justice being done and being seen to be done.
The winning is for Jeremy.

What people like you see as the truth and what people like me see as the truth are very different things Lookout.

I do not want people like Jeremy Bamber to win his freedom because of a technicality, even though he's guilty.

Jeremy Bamber will no doubt continue to win over the minds of others and recruit like minded people, but he will never be released from prison!

I see Jeremy Bamber for what he is, as do many others and indeed the courts.

Jeremy Bamber has a distorted and inflated sense of himself. He also has a hard time seeing others points of view and he is unable to see the flaws in his own thinking.

And it is for these reasons he slips up time and time again.