Author Topic: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!  (Read 15250 times)

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Offline Stephanie

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #105 on: December 17, 2016, 03:13:PM »
His behaviours, post murders, were anything BUT level headed. Level headed wouldn't have partied/traveled/tried to sell pictures of his murdered sister just weeks after the tragedy.

Which reminds me; level headed is how I would have described SH when I met him in Feb 2002. But he was at large, having brutally murdered an elderly women 2 months before. He remained at large for several months more before the police finally caught up with him. Following the murder (In letters post confession-PC) he wrote that he partied harder, took more drugs and did more of everything... So not dissimilar to Jeremy Bamber.

So not only did his 'anxiety' allow him to get a new job. He also got a new girlfriend in the Feb 2002 and moved in with her by the May (2002). If memory serves me correctly he was planning a trip to France too? He told me a story PC that he'd asked the police when he would get his passport back as he'd planned a trip.

   



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Offline lookout

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #106 on: December 17, 2016, 05:56:PM »
He did put on a show at the funeral, pretending to almost faint. Also, he wasn't sick in front of anyone,he went off into the field and pretended to retch. Jeremy's 'feelings' came out when he thought it appropriate to do so - such as being shown around WHF after the murders. Problem is, he couldn't keep up the show for long and he could switch off the grief act instantaneously.




The whole shock of what happens can affect people in different ways. I've said this before and what happened,and what was said by my step-children at their father's ( my husband's ) funeral was totally unacceptable--------all because I WASN'T crying ! So I know how shock can have different effects on different people. Perhaps it had been guilt on their part because they saw little of him and didn't offer once to give me a break in 6 years of nursing him. Why should I have cried----is it a right ? I had too much to think about and I was worn out and dare I say it--relieved,because I was also working as well as attending to him. Then I buzzed off to Australia for a champagne breakfast with my family there--------nothing wrong with that ? Thank God we're all different,I say.I'd hate to be a clone ! I'm level-headed too.Does that make me a psychopath,narcissist,etc etc ? I wouldn't be where and who I am today if I'd " followed the crowd " !!
 

Offline notsure

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #107 on: December 17, 2016, 06:20:PM »



The whole shock of what happens can affect people in different ways. I've said this before and what happened,and what was said by my step-children at their father's ( my husband's ) funeral was totally unacceptable--------all because I WASN'T crying ! So I know how shock can have different effects on different people. Perhaps it had been guilt on their part because they saw little of him and didn't offer once to give me a break in 6 years of nursing him. Why should I have cried----is it a right ? I had too much to think about and I was worn out and dare I say it--relieved,because I was also working as well as attending to him. Then I buzzed off to Australia for a champagne breakfast with my family there--------nothing wrong with that ? Thank God we're all different,I say.I'd hate to be a clone ! I'm level-headed too.Does that make me a psychopath,narcissist,etc etc ? I wouldn't be where and who I am today if I'd " followed the crowd " !


 I know what you mean lookout, I've laughed at the most in appropriate situations and haven't been able to understand why until later on when I've realised its shock. But it is human nature for us to say ' blimey I can't believe he did that or said this , or did you see what he did'. It is this part of someone's behaviours that worry me about circumstantial evidence as it doesn't always fit with what is perceived to be the norm.

Offline lookout

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #108 on: December 17, 2016, 07:01:PM »
I know what you mean lookout, I've laughed at the most in appropriate situations and haven't been able to understand why until later on when I've realised its shock. But it is human nature for us to say ' blimey I can't believe he did that or said this , or did you see what he did'. It is this part of someone's behaviours that worry me about circumstantial evidence as it doesn't always fit with what is perceived to be the norm.





Because I'm well known for my sense of humour by everyone who knows me,they don't for one minute think that I'm " out of place " whatever I may come out with at whatever situation it is. I've never knowingly offended anyone. To laugh is also a " cover-up " at times of how you are feeling inside. Nobody has a right to judge anyone at all in such situations,it's spiteful and petty and those sort should look to themselves and ask if they're so perfect.
It's worse than saying you should have blonde hair and blue eyes ! You know what I'm getting at.
Despicable people.

Offline mike tesko

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #109 on: December 18, 2016, 07:32:AM »
The impression I got through intense and prolonged discussions with Jeremy about the so called prior knowledge which Julie Mugford claimed to be a party to, prior to the shootings occurring,  was a red herring!!!

The only guilty knowledge Julie Mugford harboured inside her mind in the months leading up to the shootings, involved information about a burgalry of the family run Osea Road Caravan park office,  the year before when almost £1000 cash had been stolen. I am satisfied that she was not told by Jeremy anything whatsoever to do with planning to shoot dead his family. She made it up after she and Jeremy split up. She was distressed by the experience of having to attend the hospital mortuary to identify each of the five victims. According to Jeremy this experience really freaked Julie out. She couldn't stop talking about their dead bodies. In particular, she told Jeremy how upon seeing Sheila how she had attempted to communicate with Sheila, asking her why it had come to this? Julie Mugford believed at the time of the identification of the bodies that Sheila had shot the other four victims and then killed herself by way of a single shot beneath the point of the chin. As she said this to Jeremy who was in the company of relatives and police officers at his cottage, Julie pointed the index finger of her hand to her throat to denote where the shot she was referring to had entered. She thought Sheila had shot the others, and she believed that Sheila had killed herself. If things had been any different at that time she had the opportunity to reveal her concerns at the time she identified the bodies, and upon returning to Jeremy's cottage with an audience of the police and the relatives...

In addition, it became clear to me that Julie and another accomplice, along with Jeremy had been involved in cheque book fraud which was prevalent in the mid 1980's. On the occasions when I spoke to Jeremy about these activities it became absolutely clear that Julie had certainly been involved with Jeremy in the burglary of the Osea Roa camp site office, cheque book fraud, and drug dealing. After Jeremy effectively dumped her, she threatened to go to the police and tell them about these criminal activities Jeremy had been responsible for. Jeremy told me that he told her that if she did that she would only be dropping herself and the other accomplice in it, because of their involvement in the commissioning of those crimes. I got the clear impression that Jeremy obviously did not want to volunteer to go to the police and 'fess up' to the burglary, the cheque book fraud, and drug dealing offences, but that if Julie wanted to go down that road, he was letting her know that she would be dropping herself, and possible the other accomplice in it. I am satisfied that he was telling me the truth regarding this situation. I have seen and known about many similar situations involving other people in other cases where somebody sets out to get revenge against another by adopting similar threatening tactics. In most of these cases, the police and the CPS do not charge an informant with any criminal matter, even though if what they told the police amounted to them having admitted to any involvement in criminal activity. I believe there is no evidence to support Julie Mugfords claim that Jeremy had been planning to kill his family for over a year before the shootings. If people choose to believe her story then you should ask yourself why she was not in the dock along with Jeremy at his trial? Part of her account included her allegedly giving Jeremy some of her medication in the form of tablets which she says he was planning to administer in drinks given to his family to make them sleep, but she says that Jeremy had tried them out on himself first and decided they didn't work. Now, if there had been any truth in this story, Julie should have been charged along with Jeremy on a count of 'Conspiracy to murder. But, nothing...
« Last Edit: December 18, 2016, 10:42:AM by mike tesko »
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Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #110 on: December 18, 2016, 05:31:PM »
In addition, it became clear to me that Julie and another accomplice, along with Jeremy had been involved in cheque book fraud which was prevalent in the mid 1980's. On the occasions when I spoke to Jeremy about these activities it became absolutely clear that Julie had certainly been involved with Jeremy in the burglary of the Osea Roa camp site office, cheque book fraud, and drug dealing. After Jeremy effectively dumped her, she threatened to go to the police and tell them about these criminal activities Jeremy had been responsible for. Jeremy told me that he told her that if she did that she would only be dropping herself and the other accomplice in it, because of their involvement in the commissioning of those crimes. I got the clear impression that Jeremy obviously did not want to volunteer to go to the police and 'fess up' to the burglary, the cheque book fraud, and drug dealing offences, but that if Julie wanted to go down that road, he was letting her know that she would be dropping herself, and possible the other accomplice in it. I am satisfied that he was telling me the truth regarding this situation. I have seen and known about many similar situations involving other people in other cases where somebody sets out to get revenge against another by adopting similar threatening tactics. In most of these cases, the police and the CPS do not charge an informant with any criminal matter, even though if what they told the police amounted to them having admitted to any involvement in criminal activity. I believe there is no evidence to support Julie Mugfords claim that Jeremy had been planning to kill his family for over a year before the shootings. If people choose to believe her story then you should ask yourself why she was not in the dock along with Jeremy at his trial? Part of her account included her allegedly giving Jeremy some of her medication in the form of tablets which she says he was planning to administer in drinks given to his family to make them sleep, but she says that Jeremy had tried them out on himself first and decided they didn't work. Now, if there had been any truth in this story, Julie should have been charged along with Jeremy on a count of 'Conspiracy to murder. But, nothing...
You have to ask yourself what relationship Jeremy had with Julie that past year. If she has become a burden to him and no longer an asset as he has decided to play the field or just take a mental breather then why does he telephone her three times within the space of a few hours and why make a beeline for her at Bourtree Cottage, when he told Police under interrogation that their liaison had been cooling during the previous six months?

Offline Reader

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #111 on: December 18, 2016, 05:59:PM »
Was there anyone else he would have wanted to contact?

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #112 on: December 18, 2016, 06:08:PM »
Was there anyone else he would have wanted to contact?
Well there was Michael Deckers and Malcolm Waters from the Frog and Beans in Colchester, Brett Collins of course and possibly Sue Ford might have been a shoulder to cry on. The point is he chose Julie, and one has to ask oneself why..

Offline Jane

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #113 on: December 18, 2016, 06:11:PM »
Well there was Michael Deckers and Malcolm Waters from the Frog and Beans in Colchester, Brett Collins of course and possibly Sue Ford might have been a shoulder to cry on. The point is he chose Julie, and one has to ask oneself why..

I believe he said why, Steve. It was allegedly to hear a friendly voice!!!!! Perhaps he should have allowed her to say a few more words.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #114 on: December 18, 2016, 06:34:PM »
I believe he said why, Steve. It was allegedly to hear a friendly voice!!!!! Perhaps he should have allowed her to say a few more words.
It was confirmation that the year's talk of wishing to see the demise of his family had been carried out. Whether he couldn't conceal his delight when he stifled a chuckle in the lounge thinking he was out of earshot or wanted a quick grope the point was at that stage Julie was very much still a part of his plans.

Offline Jane

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #115 on: December 18, 2016, 06:42:PM »
It was confirmation that the year's talk of wishing to see the demise of his family had been carried out. Whether he couldn't conceal his delight when he stifled a chuckle in the lounge thinking he was out of earshot or wanted a quick grope the point was at that stage Julie was very much still a part of his plans.

I think he was very confident that she was his. I don't believe, for a moment, he believed she'd leave him, whatever he did..................not that he wanted her, but whilst she was acquiescent -pliable- she was useful.

Offline lookout

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #116 on: December 18, 2016, 06:45:PM »
 " A quick grope ?".Goodness me,that's out of character coming from you Steve. Was it the sherry ?

Joking aside it could even have been a stifled cry,the way men do as though they're choking.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #117 on: December 18, 2016, 07:01:PM »
" A quick grope ?".Goodness me,that's out of character coming from you Steve. Was it the sherry ?

Joking aside it could even have been a stifled cry,the way men do as though they're choking.
I withdraw it if it has caused offence. The fact was he wanted her alone for some reason.

Offline Jane

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #118 on: December 18, 2016, 07:07:PM »
I withdraw it if it has caused offence. The fact was he wanted her alone for some reason.

Steve, how could you POSSIBLY cause offence :o?

Offline mike tesko

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Re: The only opportunity Bamber had to kill his sister, was after 8.10am!!!
« Reply #119 on: December 18, 2016, 07:24:PM »
You have to ask yourself what relationship Jeremy had with Julie that past year. If she has become a burden to him and no longer an asset as he has decided to play the field or just take a mental breather then why does he telephone her three times within the space of a few hours and why make a beeline for her at Bourtree Cottage, when he told Police under interrogation that their liaison had been cooling during the previous six months?

He didn't call her three times, did he? I thought he called her twice? Once at about 10pm on the evening of the 6th August, and then again at about 6.30am, the following morning?

He didn't get arrested until early September, which was a month after the tragedy, by which stage Julie had had ample opportunity to glean information concerning the shootings from the media in general. There is no doubting that after the tragedy it took its toll upon poor Jeremy, so no surprise there that his relationship with her had taken a dip, and he sought distractions elsewhere. None of which makes him a mass murderer, does it?
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...