The forensic evidence shows 100% the silencer was used. But not by Sheila.

[lookout]

because theres evidence to show what you two are agreeing on never happened

Your evidence is non-existant.You only copy what everyone else says,never your OWN thoughts which at least lebaleb and I produce. 

[John]

Thanks.

I can't see any situation where Sheila would put the silencer on. It was in the gun cupboard and she was in a rage. Neville was with her and there is no proof she knew how to do it.

If in the beginning she was the only one awake and wanted to commit a silent execution, she could have put the silencer on. Then shot June and Neville in the main bedroom, which is where they were shot. But then Neville wouldn't have been able to phone Bamber.

Nobody who is mentally disturbed to the extent she would want to wipe out her entire family before committing suicide would even contemplate the use of a silencer.  It is very clear from the evidence that the killer was working to a preordained plan and knew exactly what he was doing.  Sheila Caffell was an innocent victim, of that there can be no doubt. And those who suggest otherwise should be ashamed of themselves.

[John]

Sheila could have used the rifle without silencer then attached it to shoot the children fearing they would wake. Later removing it to facilitate her suicide. How difficult could attaching a silencer be? You just screw it on and off.
When she attached the silencer Neville was already incapacitated or dead.
You can't draw assumptions from Sheila's actions whilst she was psychotic. She may have had, in her mind, perfectly rational reasons for returning the silencer to the gun cupboard. That is one of the definitions of delusion, i.e. Actions that seem logical to her are irrational to a normal person.
Sheila may have had hours to commit the murders if the rifle shots could be heard over the dogs and vehicles arriving and departing, from the end of the driveway.

Nonsense!

[John]

its what you get john,when one tries to be too clever.you can see why he spun that tale about the call'because he had to be there with police .not only to lead them down the garden path but also to show it couldnt have been me i was outside with police .also pretending seeing movement upstairs, to further reinforce it

Correct Sami, we can read Bamber like a book.  His plan was so simple that even some of the police like Taff Jones were taken in by it.  Unfortunately for him however it took many more shots that he ever anticipated or planned for allowing Nevill to get downstairs and the fight over the kitchen table.  That is where his attempt to blame Sheila should have ended but he made the mistake of carrying on regardless. Sheila never fought with Nevill otherwise she would have come off second best.

This case is by no means rocket science but good old fashioned detective work.

[David1819]

The forensic evidence shows 100% that the silencer was on the rifle during the massacre -

Aga paint.

Human blood. Almost certainly Sheila's.

No back splatter on the rifle end. Although there were several contact shots.


While there are a lot of reasons why Bamber would use a silencer. There are a lot of reasons why the opposite is true for Sheila.

Reasons why Sheila would not use the silencer:

Bamber said he left the rifle without the silencer on.

The available rifle was fully loaded and ready for a spontaneous shooting. It did not have a silencer attached.

Sheila may not know how to put the silencer on.

Sheila may not know how to take the silencer off.

Sheila would not want to put the silencer on. It was not a silent execution attempt and Neville was awake.

Sheila would not have time to put the silencer on. Neville was awake.

Sheila would not have put the silencer back into a box and then into a cupboard.

Sheila could not shoot herself with the silencer on.

If the silencer was on the rifle, Sheila would have left it on to burn Neville's back.

If the silencer was on, Sheila would have taken it off and left it next to her prior to shooting herself.

If Sheila could not take the silencer off, she would have used another rifle to kill herself. Or stayed alive.

Sheila would not have time to take the silencer off and put it away. Together with everything else she was supposed to have done between Neville's call and the police arriving.

You seem to be ignoring the fact that the contact wounds to Sheila's neck show the silencer was not attached. Dr Fowler concluded this while studying the autopsy photos. Plus the experiments in America show a silencer would leave a very different mark, this can even be seen in the crime scene photos we have available but if you look close enough. The CCRC never directly challenged the work of Fowler instead they criticised Dr Fowler for not answering questions that he was not even asked.

[Caroline]

You seem to be ignoring the fact that the contact wounds to Sheila's neck show the silencer was not attached. Dr Fowler concluded this while studying the autopsy photos. Plus the experiments in America show a silencer would leave a very different mark, this can even be seen in the crime scene photos we have available but if you look close enough. The CCRC never directly challenged the work of Fowler instead they criticised Dr Fowler for not answering questions that he was not even asked.

That's if they were full contact shots!

[John]

You seem to be ignoring the fact that the contact wounds to Sheila's neck show the silencer was not attached. Dr Fowler concluded this while studying the autopsy photos. Plus the experiments in America show a silencer would leave a very different mark, this can even be seen in the crime scene photos we have available but if you look close enough. The CCRC never directly challenged the work of Fowler instead they criticised Dr Fowler for not answering questions that he was not even asked.

I am inclined to agree, Bamber most probably had the silencer attached initially in an attempt to mitigate the noise but removed it when he found that the rifle was most ineffective.

[lookout]

So are you saying that all these people who are presently working in the background ( legals ) for JB are " taken in " by him  too ?

[Adam]

You seem to be ignoring the fact that the contact wounds to Sheila's neck show the silencer was not attached. Dr Fowler concluded this while studying the autopsy photos. Plus the experiments in America show a silencer would leave a very different mark, this can even be seen in the crime scene photos we have available but if you look close enough. The CCRC never directly challenged the work of Fowler instead they criticised Dr Fowler for not answering questions that he was not even asked.

These look like the pictures which were in the 'new evidence' video.

This video suggests Neville's burn marks were done with the rifle nozzle without the silencer Which I agree with. Thread already created.

[Caroline]

So are you saying that all these people who are presently working in the background ( legals ) for JB are " taken in " by him  too ?

Their own personal opinions don't come into it.

[lookout]

Their own personal opinions don't come into it.

Why not ? If they're all like the guilters on here they're wasting their time then,aren't they,so WHY are they helping ? Not for the good of their health,I'm sure. Or money either.

[John]

So are you saying that all these people who are presently working in the background ( legals ) for JB are " taken in " by him  too ?

Undoubtedly, there is a greedy fool born every minute of every day.  We know that certain lawyers were and are attracted to this case simply to get their name in the Press and a bit of free publicity but that sort of backfired with one in particular making a grovelling appeal to me recently to remove his/her name from everything associated to Bamber.  Seemingly his/her children were beginning to ask awkward questions about the morality of working for a child killer.  Maybe some others might want to ponder the same question?

[sami]

Correct Sami, we can read Bamber like a book.  His plan was so simple that even some of the police like Taff Jones were taken in by it.  Unfortunately for him however it took many more shots that he ever anticipated or planned for allowing Nevill to get downstairs and the fight over the kitchen table.  That is where his attempt to blame Sheila should have ended but he made the mistake of carrying on regardless. Sheila never fought with Nevill otherwise she would have come off second best.

This case is by no means rocket science but good old fashioned detective work.

excellent post ,john

[lookout]

Undoubtedly, there is a greedy fool born every minute of every day.  We know that certain lawyers were and are attracted to this case simply to get their name in the Press and a bit of free publicity but that sort of backfired with one in particular making a grovelling appeal to me recently to remove his name from everything associated to Bamber.

Just one then ?

[John]

excellent post ,john

Why thank you kind person.  I try to do my best.