Who has more rights thirty years on: Jeremy or Colin?

[lebaleb]

Steve, I suspect that pigs may levitate before it happens.

I agree. Especially considering he's innocent.

[Jane]

I agree. Especially considering he's innocent.

But still to be proved after 30 years.

[Caroline]

I agree. Especially considering he's innocent.

He's not.

[lookout]

He's not.

Of course he's innocent. If you're at degree level in psychology you should have read/thought beyond his guilt taking EVERYTHING into consideration,including him as a person from childhood until present day.

[Caroline]

Of course he's innocent. If you're at degree level in psychology you should have read/thought beyond his guilt taking EVERYTHING into consideration,including him as a person from childhood until present day.

Eh? I think I should be saying that to you! I have looked at this from both sides, whereas you decided he was innocent from day one (for whatever reason) and haven't budged. It's because I have some understanding of psychology that I believe he is a psychopath an has no remorse and I already gave an account of how I believe his childhood and upbringing contributed to his current state.

[mike tesko]

Police photographed the anshuzt rifle resting against the bedroom window (crime scene photograph No. 23), before police took the rifle and positioned 'it' on Sheila Caffells body, and then photographing the rifle on her body, and later on during the trial, relying upon such photographs (26, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 and 32, etc) as evidence that these images represented exactly how Sheila Caffell's body was found, unmoved, untouched, by anybody...

[Jane]

Of course he's innocent. If you're at degree level in psychology you should have read/thought beyond his guilt taking EVERYTHING into consideration,including him as a person from childhood until present day.

Which is precisely what I've done and having looked at the case from all angles, my conclusion is that he's guilty.

[mike tesko]

You can all keep ignoring the facts, trying to pretend that Jeremy Bamber killed his sister, and that after killing her he set the scene to make it look like she had shot herself. You can all pretend that as a result of Jeremy trying to be so clever, that his efforts even went so far to hoodwink the police into coming to the conclusion that Sheila had killed herself...

But, none of this could be remotely true...

Photographic records taken at the scene on 7th August 1985 (when viewed in sequence) establish beyond doubt that police did not first come across Sheila's body on the floor of the main bedroom with the anshuzt rifle upon her. No, sir. What the original photographic records show and confirm, is that 'the anshuzt rifle', me ducks, was photographed resting against the bedroom window frame, before police moved it onto Sheila Caffells body. Now, what does this activity tell us? Well, it tells all of us that the court was dramatically deceived by the police / prosecutions presentation of their photographic evidence. The police did not photograph the position of the rifle as it was claimed to have been found, but rather, all such photographs proved was that it was the police who set out to promote the idea that Sheila Caffell had taken her own life. Scenes of crime officers (SOCO) deliberately set the scene to support the case that Bambers sister had taken her own life. The sequence with which crime scene photographs were taken ( 23, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 and 32, etc) establishes police culpability for this / that...

[Jane]

You can all keep ignoring the facts, trying to pretend that Jeremy Bamber killed his sister, and that after killing her he set the scene to make it look like she had shot herself. You can all pretend that as a result of Jeremy trying to be so clever, that his efforts even went so far to hoodwink the police into coming to the conclusion that Sheila had killed herself...

But, none of this could be remotely true...

Photographic records taken at the scene on 7th August 1985 (when viewed in sequence) establish beyond doubt that police did not first come across Sheila's body on the floor of the main bedroom with the anshuzt rifle upon her. No, sir. What the original photographic records show and confirm, is that 'the anshuzt rifle', me ducks, was photographed resting against the bedroom window frame, before police moved it onto Sheila Caffells body. Now, what does this activity tell us? Well, it tells all of us that the court was dramatically deceived by the police / prosecutions presentation of their photographic evidence. The police did not photograph the position of the rifle as it was claimed to have been found, but rather, all such photographs proved was that it was the police who set out to promote the idea that Sheila Caffell had taken her own life. Scenes of crime officers (SOCO) deliberately set the scene to support the case that Bambers sister had taken her own life. The sequence with which crime scene photographs were taken ( 23, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 and 32, etc) establishes police culpability for this / that...

Indeed we can go in ignoring, what you refer to as, "the facts" which thus far no one has taken up. What we can't ignore is that Jeremy is still, where he is likely to remain, in prison.

You tell us what THE police did but it wasn't the police en masse that you allege to have killed her, but A policeman. Can we expect a confession from this individual any time soon? Is one of the team going to break ranks and spill the beans? OR, will they do what teams, whose lives may depend on the actions of the rest of that team, stick together.

[guest154]

Which is precisely what I've done and having looked at the case from all angles, my conclusion is that he's guilty.

Same here, Jane. And am willing to have my mind changed if anything was to present itself, but it hasn't in 30 years. Nothing that has come forward in 30 years has cast any doubt but Jeremy's actions the past 30 years with his changing of times, his strange blogs, the invention of a call from Neville, the changing of "Sheila" to "she" and then back again - all has added to his guilt, for me.

I don't believe there is any "new" evidence, because the same people claiming such are the same people that have claimed this how many times now?the new evidence claims fall under suspicion for me & I don't class Sheilas medical records as new evidence.

To believe in his innocence you have to go with your gut, because there isn't any proof or reason to believe otherwise - and thankfully the legal system in this country deals with evidence and not gut instinct or people that can't hide their hate of Julie or their love of Bamber and allow either of those issues to cloud their judgement and take over.

[mike tesko]

The facts are indisputably clear, Jeremy Bamber did not shoot and kill his sister with 'that' anshuzt rifle which police photographed (crime scene photograph No. 23) leaning against the window frame of the main bedroom, prior to 'it' being brought from the window and placed on the body of Sheila Caffell, as per crime scene photographs, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 and 32, etc.  Shame on you all for not recognising the very serious nature of what police officers have done in staging the scene of Sheila Caffells death, to promote the idea that she had taken her own life. The lot of you ought to be ashamed of yourselves for treating what these police officers have done, claiming photographs they took after fabricating the death scene, claiming Jeremy had staged it.  Whoever set the rifle on Sheila's body and the taking of photographs after 'they' had tampered with the scene to promote the idea that she had taken her own life, were involved in a conspiracy by that stage, to support the case for Sheila having shot the others, and then herself. If police had not constructed Sheila's death scene by bringing the anshuzt rifle from the bedroom window, onto her body, it would have been more difficult to establish Sheila had killed herself (in the coroners court system), after killing the other four victims. Planting the anshuzt rifle on Sheila's body by police, Was intended to make the passage of the case through the Coroners Court System as smoothly as possible. An example of this, is the fact that during the first full month of the investigation, no steps were taken to match any of the bullets to a particular weapon...

[Caroline]

The facts are indisputably clear, Jeremy Bamber did not shoot and kill his sister with 'that' anshuzt rifle which police photographed (crime scene photograph No. 23) leaning against the window frame of the main bedroom, prior to 'it' being brought from the window and placed on the body of Sheila Caffell, as per crime scene photographs, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 and 32, etc.  Shame on you all for not recognising the very serious nature of what police officers have done in staging the scene of Sheila Caffells death, to promote the idea that she had taken her own life. The lot of you ought to be ashamed of yourselves for treating what these police officers have done, claiming photographs they took after fabricating the death scene, claiming Jeremy had staged it.  Whoever set the rifle on Sheila's body and the taking of photographs after 'they' had tampered with the scene to promote the idea that she had taken her own life, were involved in a conspiracy by that stage, to support the case for Sheila having shot the others, and then herself. If police had not constructed Sheila's death scene by bringing the anshuzt rifle from the bedroom window, onto her body, it would have been more difficult to establish Sheila had killed herself (in the coroners court system), after killing the other four victims. Planting the anshuzt rifle on Sheila's body by police, Was intended to make the passage of the case through the Coroners Court System as smoothly as possible. An example of this, is the fact that during the first full month of the investigation, no steps were taken to match any of the bullets to a particular weapon...

I agree with your first comment but come to a completely opposing conclusion.

[John]

The facts are indisputably clear, Jeremy Bamber did not shoot and kill his sister with 'that' anshuzt rifle which police photographed (crime scene photograph No. 23) leaning against the window frame of the main bedroom, prior to 'it' being brought from the window and placed on the body of Sheila Caffell, as per crime scene photographs, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 and 32, etc.  Shame on you all for not recognising the very serious nature of what police officers have done in staging the scene of Sheila Caffells death, to promote the idea that she had taken her own life. The lot of you ought to be ashamed of yourselves for treating what these police officers have done, claiming photographs they took after fabricating the death scene, claiming Jeremy had staged it.  Whoever set the rifle on Sheila's body and the taking of photographs after 'they' had tampered with the scene to promote the idea that she had taken her own life, were involved in a conspiracy by that stage, to support the case for Sheila having shot the others, and then herself. If police had not constructed Sheila's death scene by bringing the anshuzt rifle from the bedroom window, onto her body, it would have been more difficult to establish Sheila had killed herself (in the coroners court system), after killing the other four victims. Planting the anshuzt rifle on Sheila's body by police, Was intended to make the passage of the case through the Coroners Court System as smoothly as possible. An example of this, is the fact that during the first full month of the investigation, no steps were taken to match any of the bullets to a particular weapon...

I concur with Caroline, the first five words are correct but your interpretation of the remainder is as usual completely twisted to suit your own agenda. 

Certainly the rifle was seen in a photograph leaning against the master bedroom window since a police officer put it there while other photographs were being taken. And yes the police replaced it on Sheila's remains before other photos were taken.  Only the officers who attended the scene know the sequence in which these events took place.  What occurred was quite normal and did not constitute anything sinister and contrary to what you persistently claim, it certainly doesn't in any way prove that Jeremy Bamber is innocent.  Next!

[lebaleb]

To believe in his innocence you have to go with your gut, because there isn't any proof or reason to believe otherwise - and thankfully the legal system in this country deals with evidence and not gut instinct or people that can't hide their hate of Julie or their love of Bamber and allow either of those issues to cloud their judgement and take over.
[/quote]

Twaddle! I do not love Jeremy Bamber or hate Julie Mugford, or vice versa. I don't know them.
No reason to believe that he may be innocent? How about: Lack of credibility of prosecution witness JM. No Rigor in Sheila's arm. No explanation of how Sheila went willingly to be shot. Grave doubt about the admissibility of the silencer after tampering. Indisputable ulterior motives of the relatives.Lack of forensic evidence connecting Jeremy to the crime.. etc.
'The legal system in this country deals with evidence and not gut instinct'. Do you really think that the jury understood all of the evidence? Or at the end of the day 10 of them didn't go with their gut instinct?. If trial and appeal Judges went by the provably accurate evidence alone there would never be any MOJ's, which is sadly not the case.
My brain and my gut's tell me something is wrong with this case.

[Caroline]

To believe in his innocence you have to go with your gut, because there isn't any proof or reason to believe otherwise - and thankfully the legal system in this country deals with evidence and not gut instinct or people that can't hide their hate of Julie or their love of Bamber and allow either of those issues to cloud their judgement and take over.


Twaddle! I do not love Jeremy Bamber or hate Julie Mugford, or vice versa. I don't know them.
No reason to believe that he may be innocent? How about: Lack of credibility of prosecution witness JM. No Rigor in Sheila's arm. No explanation of how Sheila went willingly to be shot. Grave doubt about the admissibility of the silencer after tampering. Indisputable ulterior motives of the relatives.Lack of forensic evidence connecting Jeremy to the crime.. etc.
'The legal system in this country deals with evidence and not gut instinct'. Do you really think that the jury understood all of the evidence? Or at the end of the day 10 of them didn't go with their gut instinct?. If trial and appeal Judges went by the provably accurate evidence alone there would never be any MOJ's, which is sadly not the case.
My brain and my gut's tell me something is wrong with this case.

No rigor in her arm but livor mortis clearly visible on her face and blood dried and cracking around her mouth. The UNTAMPERED picture tells the whole truth and shows that blood wasn't 'flowing' from any of her wounds!! A 45 degree angle shot - impossible to carry out on yourself with that rifle and have it land in the position it was founds.



What forensic evidence do you imagine they would find in a house that he frequented? He told a tale that police had no reason not to initially believe so the fact that a lot of forensic evidence went by the wayside was down to him.

The legal system here often deals with circumstantial evidence in MANY cases, not just this one. There is nothing unusual at all in a conviction which centres on circumstantial evidence and there is certainly no MOJ in this case. Jeremy just still manages to fool some of the people some of the time.