Author Topic: Russia - worrying?  (Read 365209 times)

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Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2430 on: February 02, 2023, 07:32:PM »
Yes, all facts contrary to your beliefs are western propaganda 🙄

https://www.science.org/content/article/russians-must-know-it-s-lie-ukrainian-bat-research-spun-false-tale-bioweapons
   You haven't posted any facts. The article that you have just linked is just the person who has been caught at the centre protesting, incoherently and very badly, his innocence. Like a child, with his chocolate smeared face, denying even having ever seen the now missing chocolate bar.
    Labs whose very existence was denied are now just doing innocent stuff. As I have said, David, if we were to imagine that it was a network of Russian or Chinese or Syrian biolabs funded by their military-we would be satisfied with nothing less than a full independent investigation. We wouldn't be satisfied with Russian - Chinese officials and media claiming that there is nothing for anyone else to worry about because we are only doing innocent stuff in our biolabs that we previously denied even existed. No nothing to concern yourselves with it's just US disinformation.
    The evidence is being meticulously gathered and presented by Russia. The ever evolving excuses and denials of the US State Department only emphasise the need for transparency on what they are doing in this huge network of biolabs.
    Get your blinkers off. Look at your own side more critically. 
« Last Edit: February 02, 2023, 07:33:PM by gringo »

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2431 on: February 02, 2023, 07:35:PM »
Hacker Group Releases 128GB Of Data Showing Russia's 'Wide-Ranging' Illegal Surveillance Of Citizens.

https://www.ibtimes.com/hacker-group-releases-128gb-data-showing-russias-wide-ranging-illegal-surveillance-citizens-3663530




Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2434 on: February 02, 2023, 10:31:PM »
    What have any of the above stories got to do with anything?  What is the point being made? Western media outlets say something about Russia. And what?

    Russian politician dies in mysterious circumstances in India? Are we just meant to infer without evidence that it was Putin or something?
    That is the problem with this kind of evidence free propaganda masquerading as some sort of vanguard against Russian imperialism or some such. Nothing is stated. It is left to the readers own internal irrationality to infer that Russia must have done it. Probably Putin personally. It is idiotic drivel and doesn't even accuse Russia. What is the point of it?
    Anyone dies anywhere- BBC, Guardian, Channel 4 report that the person was critical of Russian invasion or some other mealy mouthed bollocks and relies on your own pre-programmed bias after that.
    Russia spies-what a revelation-who fucking knew that?- it's good that we would never resort to such tactics. All that Snowden, Vault 7, GCHQ visiting Guardian and smashing the hard drives, US denying airspace to presidential jets because they believed Snowden to be on board, Julian Assange.
    Fuck off even pretending that Russia are even close to the global reach of the Western NATO surveillance state. You need to ignore all of that to feign revulsion at the IB Times hack piece-which offered no evidence of its central claim. Just some non attributable hacked materials and we are told to believe that they were hacked from the Russian government by an anonymous source. It is very light on actual evidence and is basically an anonymous source saying, "trust me".
    Can anyone read with a critical eye?
   
    What is the point that is being attempted to be made? Because none was.
    Is Ukraine going to win now? Is Putin getting deposed? Does he die of cancer first? You all need to hold your own government and media to account-not other countries governments. That attitude is what got us where we are. The casual racism inherent in this western attitude- needing to sort out all those corrupt foreign governments-is why the rest of the world is uniting against us.
   
    Posting irrelevant and pointless articles without articulating any wider point, or bothering to make one, adds nothing to anyone's understanding.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2435 on: February 03, 2023, 08:42:AM »
One of the alleged "bioweapons labs" in Ukraine is the Institute of Experimental and Clinical Veterinary Medicine in Kharkiv. The very same place that has done collaborative work with the Russian Institute of Cytology and Genetics.

http://iekvm.kharkov.ua/index.php

https://www.icgbio.ru/?s=ukraine


Luhansk Regional Diagnostic Veterinary Laboratory and the Kherson Diagnostic Laboratory are also supposed to be part of the alleged bioweapons program. Which begs the question as to why Russia has never produced any tangible evidence despite taking control of these facilities. Did they forget to look?  ::)

https://ua.usembassy.gov/wp-content/uploads/sites/151/Kherson-DL-Fact-Sheet-Eng.pdf

https://ua.usembassy.gov/wp-content/uploads/sites/151/130131-Luhansk-RDVL-Fact-sheet.pdf
« Last Edit: February 03, 2023, 08:46:AM by David1819 »

Offline nugnug

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Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2437 on: February 03, 2023, 08:41:PM »
     More NATO unity. What is this intelligence of a security threat? Is it foreknowledge? Seems as if something is afoot in Turkiye. After the failed 2016 coup-have NATO/US got plans in place for the upcoming Turkish elections? Very strange. Below from RT; Full link to article on RTNews mirror site swentr.site below;

US should get ‘filthy hands’ off Türkiye – minister

Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu accused Washington of working to hurt his country amid consulate closure row

Turkish Interior Minister Suleyman Soylu accused US ambassador Jeffry Flake of trying to “confuse” people in the host nation and told him to get his “filthy hands” off of it. He has previously claimed that Western nations were waging “psychological warfare” to undermine tourism in Türkiye.

“I’m telling you very clearly, get your filthy hands off Türkiye. I know clearly what you have done, what steps you have taken, and how you want to confuse Türkiye,” the minister said in a speech on Friday.

Soylu claimed the first questions “every US ambassador” arriving in Türkiye was asked were “How can I stage a coup” and “How can I harm Türkiye.” The minister also stated that European nations were “run” by American diplomats.

The remarks came a day after the US and several EU nations decided to temporarily shut down their consulates in Istanbul due to “security considerations.” The foreign governments also advised their citizens to avoid tourist hotspots in Türkiye, citing a terrorist threat.[.]

Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu said the nations involved failed to convey to Ankara any evidence that would justify the shutdowns.

“They tell us, ‘We have concrete information, there’s a threat. That’s why we’re closing’. Who did it come from? Where? Who will do it? There’s no information about that,” Cavusoglu said on Thursday.

The top diplomat described the move as “deliberate” and possibly designed to put the incumbent government into a “difficult situation” before the upcoming general elections.[.]

https://swentr.site/news/570910-t%C3%BCrkiye-minister-us-ambassador/


Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2438 on: February 04, 2023, 06:37:AM »
Nearly 200,000 Russian troops have been killed or injured in Ukraine, US officials say

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-war-russia-death-toll-b2274969.html
« Last Edit: February 04, 2023, 06:45:AM by David1819 »

Offline Roch

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2439 on: February 04, 2023, 10:45:AM »
    What have any of the above stories got to do with anything?  What is the point being made? Western media outlets say something about Russia. And what?

    Russian politician dies in mysterious circumstances in India? Are we just meant to infer without evidence that it was Putin or something?
    That is the problem with this kind of evidence free propaganda masquerading as some sort of vanguard against Russian imperialism or some such. Nothing is stated. It is left to the readers own internal irrationality to infer that Russia must have done it. Probably Putin personally. It is idiotic drivel and doesn't even accuse Russia. What is the point of it?
    Anyone dies anywhere- BBC, Guardian, Channel 4 report that the person was critical of Russian invasion or some other mealy mouthed bollocks and relies on your own pre-programmed bias after that.
    Russia spies-what a revelation-who fucking knew that?- it's good that we would never resort to such tactics. All that Snowden, Vault 7, GCHQ visiting Guardian and smashing the hard drives, US denying airspace to presidential jets because they believed Snowden to be on board, Julian Assange.
    Fuck off even pretending that Russia are even close to the global reach of the Western NATO surveillance state. You need to ignore all of that to feign revulsion at the IB Times hack piece-which offered no evidence of its central claim. Just some non attributable hacked materials and we are told to believe that they were hacked from the Russian government by an anonymous source. It is very light on actual evidence and is basically an anonymous source saying, "trust me".
    Can anyone read with a critical eye?
   
    What is the point that is being attempted to be made? Because none was.
    Is Ukraine going to win now? Is Putin getting deposed? Does he die of cancer first? You all need to hold your own government and media to account-not other countries governments. That attitude is what got us where we are. The casual racism inherent in this western attitude- needing to sort out all those corrupt foreign governments-is why the rest of the world is uniting against us.
   
    Posting irrelevant and pointless articles without articulating any wider point, or bothering to make one, adds nothing to anyone's understanding.

There has been a number of articles inferring that 'prominent' Russians who have expressed views divergent to Putin's current policy in Ukraine have died suddenly or mysteriously. I don't know whether it's propaganda or a good indicator of Russian actions against such people.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2440 on: February 04, 2023, 11:24:AM »
There has been a number of articles inferring that 'prominent' Russians who have expressed views divergent to Putin's current policy in Ukraine have died suddenly or mysteriously. I don't know whether it's propaganda or a good indicator of Russian actions against such people.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Russian_businessmen_suspicious_deaths#List_of_deaths
« Last Edit: February 04, 2023, 11:25:AM by David1819 »

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2441 on: February 04, 2023, 12:43:PM »
There has been a number of articles inferring that 'prominent' Russians who have expressed views divergent to Putin's current policy in Ukraine have died suddenly or mysteriously. I don't know whether it's propaganda or a good indicator of Russian actions against such people.
   There are always articles "inferring" this. Why do you assume the "mysterious deaths" are down to Russia and Putin? When there are instances of "prominent" UK citizens dying or US citizens dying- do you infer that the government did that too, or just Russians? No evidence offered, just innuendo, you should be able to figure it out by now, Roch.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2442 on: February 04, 2023, 01:12:PM »
A factory inside Russia that was expected to help rebuild the Crimean bridge has gone up in flames in a suspected Ukrainian strike.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/02/04/russia-ukraine-war-russia-ukraine-war-latest-news-putin-germany/
« Last Edit: February 04, 2023, 01:30:PM by David1819 »

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2443 on: February 04, 2023, 07:57:PM »
There has been a number of articles inferring that 'prominent' Russians who have expressed views divergent to Putin's current policy in Ukraine have died suddenly or mysteriously. I don't know whether it's propaganda or a good indicator of Russian actions against such people.
   The idea of Putin being some all controlling dictator ordering murders of his alleged rivals is too idiotic for words. It is a sad reflection of our media that it has become so infantilised. It doesn't even need debunking because there is nothing to debunk.
    Somebody is killed in Russia.
    Western media immediately link it in the most tenuous way with Putin.
    The articles themselves make no accusations, realising there is nothing but innuendo to link it to Putin. Indoctrinated readers fail to see that no evidence is offered or accusation even made. Just lots of innuendo and the reader has to make the accusation themselves-they just don't realise it.
   
     Nemtsov, the idiotic Navalny saga.
     Do yourself a favour, Roch. Search for yourself the election results from Russia over the last couple of decades that this Putin obsession of the Western media has gone on.
     None of the people called "The Opposition leader" are anything of the sort. This massive lie should alert you to the notion that everything that follows is probably bollocks.
     Take a look yourself and search for the results;
     United Russia (Putin's party) usually garner around 50% give or take.
     The Communist Party garner around 25-30%
     A number of smaller parties usually get anything between 1 and 5%
     Navalny, Nemtsov and any other fringe figure touted in Western media as "opposition leader" is a false premise that is easily dismissed straight away by any discerning reader. If any foreign media described Tommy Robinson or Nick Griffin as "UK opposition leader", you would probably stop reading on the grounds of them being so poorly informed/straight up liars. Check their facts. Don't swallow everything they say whole without even a cursory check on the facts they use as their premise. Both of these figures were not rivals or a threat to Putin in any sense. The Communist Party leader is unarguably the opposition in Russia. That is a bit uncomfortable for Western media and leaders so they pretend that irrelevant fringe figures are "Putin's rival".
    If Putin is "bumping off" opposition leaders then he is being remarkably lax because the prominent politicians and leaders of his main opposition(the Communists) have been left unharmed.
    Western media outlets and politicians never refer to the Communist Party in Russia at all, never mind as "the opposition" to United Russia. If they either don't know or just ignore this fact-everything else they say after that is uninformed propaganda. This is not really arguable. Hold your sources of "information" to some standards.
   
    Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus-one lie, all lies
    You should be "marking" their work at all times not swallowing the dubious and un-evidenced claims whole. The whole edifice of lies is crashing around them now. The disinformation about Ukraine in Western media is off the scale and bears no resemblance to real events. Informed, knowledgable and sane experts will never be interviewed in western media.
    None the less-cold hard reality is smashing into western propaganda. Truth is emerging, slowly at first-then a deluge is coming. NATO and the EU will be lucky to see 2023 out in one piece. The rest of the world will get on with creating a new multi-polar world, new means of trade bypassing the dollar- all ongoing. Putin will not be overthrown, die of cancer, BRICS+ will continue to expand. Western abuse of reserve status of the dollar-weaponising of SWIFT, illegal sanctions(abusing reserve status), theft of foreign reserves-it's all over.
    NATO the ultimate enforcer of the above system is, despite western propaganda to the contrary, currently getting it's arse handed to it by Russia. It doesn't matter whether you believe this or not. The rest of the world (Africa, Asia, South America) believe it. They are turning to Russia and China because they have seen Russia demonstrate the weakness of NATO-who are powerless to turn the tide. Nobody gives a f#+k about western public opinion anymore. The West is no longer the "shining city on the hill" for the rest of the world.
   The collapse of the current NATO enforced western financial system is going to shock western populations when cold hard reality hits. Outsourcing our manufacturing decades ago is about to bite us on the arse.
   
   

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2444 on: February 04, 2023, 08:56:PM »
https://twitter.com/i/status/1621438853323132929

    Above a simple graphic demonstrating Russian aggression against "democracy defending peace-loving" NATO