Human blood in the silencer:

[Adam]

490. Because the blood sample of June Bamber no longer exists, it has not been possible to do a direct comparison between her DNA and that of the major component. However, it has been possible to obtain a sample from June Bamber's sister, Pamela Boutflour, which because closely related relatives are statistically more likely to have shared components than unrelated individuals, has enabled conclusions to be drawn. That evidence shows that it is about 3,500 times more likely that the major source of DNA was from a full sister of Pamela Boutflour, i.e. June Bamber, compared to it being from an unrelated female. Both Mr Clayton and Miss Tomlinson, the DNA experts from whom we have heard, assessed this as strong evidenced that the major component therefore comes from June Bamber.

So it seems contact shots for June, Neville and Sheila. This is likely as Neville, June and Sheila were dead or asleep for at least one shot. Giving Bamber the chance to make contact shots.

The DNA and blood evidence having similar results, saying a male and female (June's) DNA was in the silencer.   While Sheila's and possible a mixture of June and Neville's blood was inside.

The one thing Bamber can cling to is that there were no traces of Sheila's DNA found in the silencer. But as the judge said at trial, Sheila wouldn't kill everyone and then bother putting the silencer away, and all blood evidence prior to 1996 said it was Sheila's blood.

[Jan]

490. Because the blood sample of June Bamber no longer exists, it has not been possible to do a direct comparison between her DNA and that of the major component. However, it has been possible to obtain a sample from June Bamber's sister, Pamela Boutflour, which because closely related relatives are statistically more likely to have shared components than unrelated individuals, has enabled conclusions to be drawn. That evidence shows that it is about 3,500 times more likely that the major source of DNA was from a full sister of Pamela Boutflour, i.e. June Bamber, compared to it being from an unrelated female. Both Mr Clayton and Miss Tomlinson, the DNA experts from whom we have heard, assessed this as strong evidenced that the major component therefore comes from June Bamber.

So it seems contact shots for June, Neville and Sheila. This is likely as Neville, June and Sheila were dead or asleep for at least one shot. Giving Bamber the chance to make contact shots.

The DNA and blood evidence having similar results, saying a male and female (June's) DNA was in the silencer.   While Sheila's and possible a mixture of June and Neville's blood was inside.

The one thing Bamber can cling to is that there were no traces of Sheila's DNA found in the silencer. But as the judge said at trial, Sheila wouldn't kill everyone and then bother putting the silencer away, and all blood evidence prior to 1996 said it was Sheila's blood.

where did the DNA come from Adam as the blood no longer existed?

Can you clarify factually who had contact shots and who did not from the original evidence?

[Adam]

62. Mr Fletcher also gave evidence of the range at which the shots had been fired. The lower (and not immediately fatal) of the injuries suffered by Sheila Caffell was caused when the muzzle of the gun was within three inches of the throat. The upper injury was a contact shot.

63. Of the seven injuries suffered by June Bamber, five were shots from the gun held at least one foot away from the body. The bullet wound between the eyes was fired from less than one foot away, and could have been with the gun in contact with the skin, although he viewed that as unlikely. Mr Fletcher was unable to estimate the range of the shot which had caused the injury to the right side of Mrs Bamber's chest.

64. In respect of the eight shots into Nevill Bamber's body, the six to his head and face were fired when the rifle was within a few inches of the skin. The remaining injuries to the arm were caused when the gun was at least two feet from the body.

65. As regards the twins, four of the five injuries suffered by Daniel were caused when the gun was held within one foot of his head, the fifth was from over two feet away. The three wounds to Nicholas were contact or close proximity shots.

[Adam]

The above information from the 2002 appeal is just saying Sheila certainly had a contact shot. This is supported by all the pre 1996 silencer blood evidence saying it was Sheila's blood.

It says it is unlikely Neville or June had contact shots.  So I am not sure how their DNA could get into the silencer. If there are other ways, pre massacre their DNA could have got into the silencer, I don't know why Bamber brought this issue up at the appeal. Although he struck lucky that the results didn't find Sheila's DNA inside.

Perhaps the unidentified male's DNA was Nicolas, who had contact  shots.

[Steve_uk]

The above information from the 2002 appeal is just saying Sheila certainly had a contact shot. This is supported by all the pre 1996 silencer blood evidence saying it was Sheila's blood.

It says it is unlikely Neville or June had contact shots.  So I am not sure how their DNA could get into the silencer. If there are other ways, pre massacre their DNA could have got into the silencer, I don't know why Bamber brought this issue up at the appeal. Although he struck lucky that the results didn't find Sheila's DNA inside.

Perhaps the unidentified male's DNA was Nicolas, who had contact  shots.

Is there anything to be drawn from Sheila's DNA not present in the silencer?

[Caroline]

Is there anything to be drawn from Sheila's DNA not present in the silencer?

I always found that VERY odd Steve, if June's was in there but it was supposed to be Sheila's blood - then would imagine that at least some of Sheila's DNA would have been present.

[lookout]

I always found that VERY odd Steve, if June's was in there but it was supposed to be Sheila's blood - then would imagine that at least some of Sheila's DNA would have been present.

Well it wasn't and that's that so fathom that one out.

[Caroline]

Well it wasn't and that's that so fathom that one out.

Bit rude! 

[lookout]

Haven't you worked it out yet ? My my you're slow with that one.

[Caroline]

Haven't you worked it out yet ? My my you're slow with that one.

Oh do enlighten me Lookout?? 

[lookout]

Oh do enlighten me Lookout?? 

Here's me thinking the guilters knew everything.What a let-down.

[Caroline]

Here's me thinking the guilters knew everything.What a let-down.

Well, clearly you have no idea - you can try and bluff all you like Lookout but you're not fooling anyone. You do know that I don't believe the silencer was used right? That was the reason for my comment to Steve - 

[Adam]

Is there anything to be drawn from Sheila's DNA not present in the silencer?

Well if Sheila's DNA not being in the silencer, was grounds for a release, the 2002 appeal would have released Bamber.

I don't know enough about DNA. If Neville and June's blood and DNA could get into the silencer from close range, but not contact shots, then that explains that. However I believe out of the 15 shots into them, at least one each could have been a contact shot.

Sheila certainly had a contact shot, which explains her blood being in the silencer. Maybe the DNA was in the blood evidence which was removed in 1996. Or maybe it's quite normal for someone's blood, but not their DNA to be found somewhere.

[lookout]

Well, clearly you have no idea - you can try and bluff all you like Lookout but you're not fooling anyone. You do know that I don't believe the silencer was used right? That was the reason for my comment to Steve - 

Stands to sense really that Sheila with blood and gubbins on her hand/s handled the silencer but didn't necessarily screw it onto the rifle.

[Caroline]

Stands to sense really that Sheila with blood and gubbins on her hand/s handled the silencer but didn't necessarily screw it onto the rifle.

How did she put it back in the cupboard after shooting herself?  I have no idea what 'gubbins' is??