Photographic still image taken from crime scene video - The shocking truth...

[ngb1066]

I understand how you feel. Sometimes I feel wrong/dirty for posting here, not perfect wording but hard to describe how I feel - so hope you understand.

But don't leave. Maybe if we all collectively ignored the most offensive topics?

Nobody should feel wrong or dirty for posting here.  The fact that members may find some posts by others distasteful or offensive (as has happened many times) does not reflect in any way upon members who post in a constructive and respectful manner.

Do you feel the same way about posting on the red forum, where you are a moderator?  You have seen some of the filth which has been posted there.  The argument of those who are members of both forums has always been that the offensive posts have nothing to do with them.

[David1819]

I probably WON'T be forgiven for saying it but I'm forced to suggest that if he can only come up with "stuff" of the calibre he's been asking us, lately, to swallow, the sad fact would appear to be that "the shocking truth" is that there is no more "shocking truth" than there was when Jeremy was convicted. I can't answer for the effect of his latest threads on those who believe Jeremy is innocent. All they've done to me, seeing these fairy tales dreamed up by his, hitherto, strongest advocate, is to convince me further of his guilt.

There is allot of evidence the police have not released. The CCRC had to request not once or twice but three times for Bambers legal team to see all 406 crime scene photos and they still wont release them to the public. There also 100s of thousands of papers they are not releasing either. Its not anyone's fault we cant come up with anything because its all under police protection.

As for the threads Mike has posted about talking to the dead beyond the grave and magic coins I mean why cant it be taken down its meaningless and embarrassing

[guest154]

Nobody should feel wrong or dirty for posting here.  The fact that members may find some posts by others distasteful or offensive (as has happened many times) does not reflect in any way upon members who post in a constructive and respectful manner.

Do you feel the same way about posting on the red forum, where you are a moderator?  You have seen some of the filth which has been posted there.  The argument of those who are members of both forums has always been that the offensive posts have nothing to do with them.

The difference for me is that the posts on the red forum are usually about people here, people that are in a position to defend themselves. June/Sheila sadly aren't able to do that or to rebuke some of the accusations made about them on this forum.

Perhaps your word "uncomfortable" is better than the word dirty for how it feels to post here at times.

But FYI I haven't been on the red forum for months.

[lookout]

You have to question why photo's and paperwork aren't being released whichever side one is on.

[scipio_usmc]

The difference for me is that the posts on the red forum are usually about people here, people that are in a position to defend themselves. June/Sheila sadly aren't able to do that or to rebuke some of the accusations made about them on this forum.

Perhaps your word "uncomfortable" is better than the word dirty for how it feels to post here at times.

But FYI I haven't been on the red forum for months.

Some people on red view Mike's presence here as de-legitimizing the site.  They think his lies should be reigned in.  I am more into a free flow of debate and would rather see his stuff be challenged than simply have him be banned or his posts overly moderated.  After proving his claims wrong I have left threads where he continued posting the same tripe or more tripe anyway but I felt no need to bother continuing to respond because I already made my points.

People already made their case effectively against these claims- especially by contacting the filmmaker.  It seems to me the debate was won, why keep it going after that?  The record was already corrected so what is the endgame?  If the expectation is to try to get Mike to admit the truth you are wasting your time. Since the record was already corrected people who actually try reading the thread would see other people don't agree with him and that's enough to protect one's integrity from being merged with Mike's.





 

[Jane]

There is allot of evidence the police have not released. The CCRC had to request not once or twice but three times for Bambers legal team to see all 406 crime scene photos and they still wont release them to the public. There also 100s of thousands of papers they are not releasing either. Its not anyone's fault we cant come up with anything because its all under police protection.

As for the threads Mike has posted about talking to the dead beyond the grave and magic coins I mean why cant it be taken down its meaningless and embarrassing

It has been said that everything there is HAS been released but Jeremy's team are saying it hasn't. I understand that certain docs WERE destroyed. Had there been any duplicity I would imagine that ANYTHING pertaining to it would, by now, have gone the same way...................which is hopefully what MAY happen to certain threads :D

[David1819]

You have to question why photo's and paperwork aren't being released whichever side one is on.

You can access the photos if you really push for it like the CCRC did. Crime scene photos are confidential specially if the close relatives of the dead are still alive.

[Alias]

Some people on red view Mike's presence here as de-legitimizing the site.  They think his lies should be reigned in.  I am more into a free flow of debate and would rather see his stuff be challenged than simply have him be banned or his posts overly moderated.  After proving his claims wrong I have left threads where he continued posting the same tripe or more tripe anyway but I felt no need to bother continuing to respond because I already made my points.

People already made their case effectively against these claims- especially by contacting the filmmaker.  It seems to me the debate was won, why keep it going after that?  The record was already corrected so what is the endgame?  If the expectation is to try to get Mike to admit the truth you are wasting your time. Since the record was already corrected people who actually try reading the thread would see other people don't agree with him and that's enough to protect one's integrity from being merged with Mike's.





 

It´s Mike´s board.

[Alias]

I understand how you feel. Sometimes I feel wrong/dirty for posting here, not perfect wording but hard to describe how I feel - so hope you understand.

But don't leave. Maybe if we all collectively ignored the most offensive topics?

Thanks Mat.

[scipio_usmc]

It has been said that everything there is HAS been released but Jeremy's team are saying it hasn't. I understand that certain docs WERE destroyed. Had there been any duplicity I would imagine that ANYTHING pertaining to it would, by now, have gone the same way...................which is hopefully what MAY happen to certain threads :D

What hasn't been released is essentially categorized as work product.  It mostly related to aspects of the COLP investigation other than the raw evidence and final report.  The raw evidence was all produced and that is what matters most.  Other documents are just mundane things so unimportant they are not even organized as part of the main file. 

The most important things for the defense were produced- the interviews police did, statements of he various witnesses, pocketbooks of the cops, interviews of the cops involved, the logs.

Those are all the things a defense attorney wants to know in order to know who to question about what and to try coming up with leads to investigate further.

For Jeremy to be innocent requires a vast conspiracy between the crime lab police and family.  The notion there would be some written evidence of that being hidden in the file somewhere is just not realistic.  If they did organize such a conspiracy the documents already produced are the ones that would offer a clue to that. They would not intentionally create let alone keep any documents indicating they did wrongdoing.  Mike claims they took a photo of Sheila before they moved her body to a different location.  If they wanted to move her to fool everyone into thinking she was found somewhere else why would they take a photo of her before they moved her?  That is just one example of something they would not do if they were going to engage in wrongdoing.

When there is wrongdoing the main break is someone admitting the truth. Unless someone admits to planting evidence and explaining who did what and how there is no hope of establishing it. The hope of a document somewhere that will contain such information is totally unrealistic.

[scipio_usmc]

It´s Mike´s board.

I thought he said NGB pays for it and own the domain name?

[Alias]

I thought he said NGB pays for it and own the domain name?

Oh, did he - I missed that then.

Still, he founded the board, so in that sense it is still his.

[scipio_usmc]

Oh, did he - I missed that then.

Still, he founded the board, so in that sense it is still his.

I guess NGB will have to clear it up but that is how Mike made it appear.

[Jane]

What hasn't been released is essentially categorized as work product.  It mostly related to aspects of the COLP investigation other than the raw evidence and final report.  The raw evidence was all produced and that is what matters most.  Other documents are just mundane things so unimportant they are not even organized as part of the main file. 

The most important things for the defense were produced- the interviews police did, statements of he various witnesses, pocketbooks of the cops, interviews of the cops involved, the logs.

Those are all the things a defense attorney wants to know in order to know who to question about what and to try coming up with leads to investigate further.

For Jeremy to be innocent requires a vast conspiracy between the crime lab police and family.  The notion there would be some written evidence of that being hidden in the file somewhere is just not realistic.  If they did organize such a conspiracy the documents already produced are the ones that would offer a clue to that. They would not intentionally create let alone keep any documents indicating they did wrongdoing.  Mike claims they took a photo of Sheila before they moved her body to a different location.  If they wanted to move her to fool everyone into thinking she was found somewhere else why would they take a photo of her before they moved her?  That is just one example of something they would not do if they were going to engage in wrongdoing.

When there is wrongdoing the main break is someone admitting the truth. Unless someone admits to planting evidence and explaining who did what and how there is no hope of establishing it. The hope of a document somewhere that will contain such information is totally unrealistic.

Hmm. There is an old poem which tells us that "For want of a nail a shoe was lost..................." It goes on to tell us that a Kingdom fell because of a horseshoe nail. It was this poem which helped convince me that Jeremy was guilty because the conspiracy-which HAD to be involved for it to be otherwise- was just TOO convoluted and too many would need to be involved. The law of averages says that, by now, SOMEONE would have broken ranks.

[scipio_usmc]

Hmm. There is an old poem which tells us that "For want of a nail a shoe was lost..................." It goes on to tell us that a Kingdom fell because of a horseshoe nail. It was this poem which helped convince me that Jeremy was guilty because the conspiracy-which HAD to be involved for it to be otherwise- was just TOO convoluted and too many would need to be involved. The law of averages says that, by now, SOMEONE would have broken ranks.

Logic does indeed suggest that for such a broad conspiracy there would have been some evidence found in the released documents and by now someone would have broken ranks as you suggest.  In known cases where police lied or evidence was planted people admitted it and that is how we found out.

If people want to ignore that and believe it was planted despite no evidence that is their business but usually people go beyond that and claim there is actual evidence he is innocent or make the bogus claim the evidence doesn't prove anything. Usually when they claim there was no evidence of his guilt they refuse to face how the case was even made against him.  That just amounts to living in denial though to not even want to face how the case was made and one has to face it in order to even attempt to refute it.

Let's just pretend for a moment that the seemingly impossible happened and that this giant conspiracy happened, its was done so perfectly that no documentary evidence exists to establish it and nobody to this date has cracked thus no one outside of the conspiracy is aware it happened.  Does the unlikely possibility of such amount to reasonable doubt?  No because it is not reasonably likely to have happened and the only way it could ever amount to reasonable doubt would be if evidence were produced to suggest it is reasonably likely this conspiracy happened.