And so, members of the raid team, falsified the contents of their statements...

[paulg]

Being serious for a second, the forensic evidence does not put a gun in Sheilas hand. So given Jeremy's phone call to the police, it still suggests he had knowledge of the shootings.

EP should have failed to get a conviction though IMO, but i'd have liked to see no one benefit from inheritance..this should have gone to a childrens charity or something.

...Back to my dog theory.

[chelmsey]

Being serious for a second, the forensic evidence does not put a gun in Sheilas hand. So given Jeremy's phone call to the police, it still suggests he had knowledge of the shootings.

EP should have failed to get a conviction though IMO, but i'd have liked to see no one benefit from inheritance..this should have gone to a childrens charity or something.

...Back to my dog theory.

Did you notice that in Woodcocks statement he says Jeremy told him that Sheila knew how to use all of the weapons and that he had taught her how to use them. A little different to what he testified in court!

[paulg]

Being serious for a second, the forensic evidence does not put a gun in Sheilas hand. So given Jeremy's phone call to the police, it still suggests he had knowledge of the shootings.

EP should have failed to get a conviction though IMO, but i'd have liked to see no one benefit from inheritance..this should have gone to a childrens charity or something.

...Back to my dog theory.

Did you notice that in Woodcocks statement he says Jeremy told him that Sheila knew how to use all of the weapons and that he had taught her how to use them. A little different to what he testified in court!

Yes, was talking to Si about this a few days ago.

[Kaldin]

Interesting how he states that Sheilas body was laying flat but with her head propped up against the bedside table.I dont really want to have a look at her pic again,but was she not laying completely flat?

Yes, that's strange. In the photos the blood had flowed across her face and slightly upwards which would defy the laws of gravity if her head was raised when that blood flowed.

Blood may have flowed from her mouth in a different direction, if her head was moved by dog under bed.

Huh? If her head was propped up the blood would have gone down her face. It has not done that. It's gone from her mouth into her ears, and ears are usually higher up than one's mouth. It's also gone into her left eye.

[mike tesko]

Interesting how he states that Sheilas body was laying flat but with her head propped up against the bedside table.I dont really want to have a look at her pic again,but was she not laying completely flat?

Yes, that's strange. In the photos the blood had flowed across her face and slightly upwards which would defy the laws of gravity if her head was raised when that blood flowed.

---------------------

Blood has run in these directions because her head was lolled to one side when they were moving her around, for example, blood inside the void of her mouth ran to the left side of her mouth in the direction of her ear on that side of her head, because whoever was moving her held her head in such a position that it was the only place the blood could flow at that time, the same can be said to be true of the blood which ran out of the other side of her mouth in the direction of her other ear, it was caused because of the way Sheila's head was carried into its last resting position. The reason some blood ran back into the socket of her left eye was because during the movement of her body bu the police, her head was tilted backward at some point...

Blood may have flowed from her mouth in a different direction, if her head was moved by dog under bed.

Huh? If her head was propped up the blood would have gone down her face. It has not done that. It's gone from her mouth into her ears, and ears are usually higher up than one's mouth. It's also gone into her left eye.

[Kaldin]

Blood has run in these directions because her head was lolled to one side when they were moving her around, for example, blood inside the void of her mouth ran to the left side of her mouth in the direction of her ear on that side of her head, because whoever was moving her held her head in such a position that it was the only place the blood could flow at that time, the same can be said to be true of the blood which ran out of the other side of her mouth in the direction of her other ear, it was caused because of the way Sheila's head was carried into its last resting position. The reason some blood ran back into the socket of her left eye was because during the movement of her body bu the police, her head was tilted backward at some point...

I don't buy that. If her head was propped up when she was shot (or shot herself), blood would have come out of her mouth and down.

[Alias]

the police admitted they moved her hand and the gun to photograph a blood stain.

They had no choice but to admit that.The photographs prove it.But they don't show the position in which she was originally found.Makes you wonder what else they tampered with   

Ewww.........Definitely am not thinking what you think I am thinking     
hmmm  hope your not thinking what i think your thinking   

FUNNY!
On another note, her legs were very neatly aligned. She almost looks TOO neatly positioned after a gruesome killing or suicide - suicide more likely for this position in my opinion; but of course the killer might have placed her like that after the shooting for some reason (that wouldn´t point to a hired hitman, I think). 
OR the police (and we KNOW the police moved at least the rifle and the hand). Perhaps she was in a too "indecent" position for the police to want to photograph her - who knows!
When I stumbled upon the photo of Sheila, I was really shocked - there was no warning, and I am not sure I would have wanted to see her face! It haunts me, really. She was very beautiful, so graceful even in death.

[mike tesko]

The complete page five contents have been retyped by use of a different typewriter...

What happened to the original page five?

Furthermore, since the original version consisted of 13 pages, there must be at least four pages missing or extracted which have not been disclosed...

One of these missing four pages (page Five) has been retyped, but a total of three full pages of information and evidence has been taken out of this revised version for one reason or another...

Note that the crucial change at page five, commences just when the police first enter the kitchen...

[smiffy]

Woodcock claims that when Collins looked through the window the body though to be a female was "just inside the door".
upon entering the kitchen he describes Ralph in the position and state that appears in the photographs.

However...Ralph's position in the photographs is too far from the door to be viewed by a reasonable person as being "just inside the door".

If Ralph had been in that position when Collins looked through the window it is inconceivable that he could have been mistaken for a woman.

Note Gibbons who went in the house not too long after declared to see Ralph seated.
this undermines Woodcock entirely.


Woodcock gives the time of Gibbons and the doctor as going round the house at 8.40 am...this was Gibbons second trip round the house...so his first trip round the house with Harris and Montgomery has to be between 8.15am  approx and 8.40am.

[mike tesko]

Woodcock claims that when Collins looked through the window the body though to be a female was "just inside the door".
upon entering the kitchen he describes Ralph in the position and state that appears in the photographs.

However...Ralph's position in the photographs is too far from the door to be viewed by a reasonable person as being "just inside the door".

If Ralph had been in that position when Collins looked through the window it is inconceivable that he could have been mistaken for a woman.

Note Gibbons who went in the house not too long after declared to see Ralph seated.
this undermines Woodcock entirely.


Woodcock gives the time of Gibbons and the doctor as going round the house at 8.40 am...this was Gibbons second trip round the house...so his first trip round the house with Harris and Montgomery has to be between 8.15am  approx and 8.40am.

-----------------

My own view, is that the body of Sheila was just inside th e pantry door, as viewed by PC Collins from the vantage point of being outside the kitchen window...

[smiffy]

The "just inside the door" to me does not sound a proper description Collins would have said.

This stands out to me as a lie.... a claim made after the event in desperation to try passing off Ralph as the "woman's body"viewed by Collins.

"Just" is a commonly used word by liars///but the real issue is "the door".  The door refers to a specific door.  There were several doors....and someone not looking through the window will not know what door Collins would be speaking of. by saying "the door"...unless some pre discussion had gone on. Even with this it would be an improper description as in such terms Collins would refer to "behind of" or "in front of" depening on his perspective.

In my view Collins would have identified a specific door by more that using "the door" or would have spoke in general terms as "a door".
The "just inside the door" claim in my view appears to be a lie to try and sell the false story of misidentification.
I would not rely on the "just inside the door" in regards to where the womans body (Sheila) was.


Sitting or lying....The presumption ..unless stated otherwise ...for describing a body would be that the body was on the ground (lying).  Only if different would we expect an observer to report differently.
From the kitchen window we should think of what floor areas in the kitchen could be seen where a body could be seen lying on the ground.
Woodcock's overturned (completely upside down table) claim would increase the ground area in which a females body could be viewed from the kitchen window.. An upright table would block the view.

[smiffy]

In my view the overturned table claim is bogus and may have been an idea aired in a discussion about covering up what really happened when the firearms team entered.
The principle being that with an overturned table Collins would have a good view of more the floor area in the kitchen to support the misidentification claim of the "woman" for Ralph. It is my view that Woodcock has more lies to remember than most so we would excpect more errors to creep in and him losing track of the story being presented.

I remember in the 70's our family having an old  table of very similar design to the one in the kitchen .
Note the one in the kitchen had its end leafs extended. These have to sit on supports.
In upturning a table of that weight and construction we should expect some considerable  damage to occur unless carefully turned over by more than one person. The table shows none.

[smiffy]

I am in agreement with where Mike contends the woman's body to be in the kitchen when Collins looked through the window.
 
If indeed there was a body at that spot ..it makes sense that the kitchen table was pushed away from the body  to allow access past the body (or even to examine it and move it etc).  It is to be noted that the box of bullets was close by and also the phone .
The cupboard next to this contended position of the body had blood splashes and there were bloodied finger smears (prints) photographed at this spot.

Also remember the "note" with the coded message  ...the please, please, please and 5 number 3's written on it. The worktop that had the phone on it had some felt tip pens upon it. Just the right size for the capital letters that were written on the note and the first of the "Please" words. This does suggest Sheila was at some time using this area of the kitchen and was of interest to her.

It appears to from the phone photographs that the children and possibly another helping had at some time been making paper models...a  simple church or castle type model building being made..the "Gloy" type glue container being nearby. A piece of paper is near to the model and what I at first thought may have been blood  looks like where someone used (tested out) a red/orange type felt pen.
The other side of the phone from the church/castle model (ie to the left as viewed) is another item (with bird picture on it) that is sitting on a piece of paper......there is a reddish mark on this that is hard to make out...it may be blood or more felt pen markings.
It would be useful to know if indeed the "coded note" was written in felt pen and what colour it was if this contention is correct.

[grahameb]

The place where he wrote that both feet were spotlessly clean. Almost as if to get his story straight. Why else would he emphasise that? Her suicide was not in contention there, so that observation would be irrelevant.

[smiffy]

Hmm  think of the staged pictures of Sheila.
Would you notice clean feet more than  the bible?......NO

Peoples attention would be drawn to the bible surely?...YES

In my view the bible was not present as shown and much else is wrong.

A liar is prone to enhancing things to make them look more believable.
Woodcock could have said she had clean feet.  Instead he talks of spotlessly clean feet. Alarm bells ring as that suggests to me very strongly that he is lying about the feet and that in reality they were not clean as he claims.