Author Topic: Order of Inheritance  (Read 15928 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

No-Bits

  • Guest
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #45 on: July 15, 2014, 04:20:PM »
So it seems that the Nevill & June Estate, went to Mabel Speakman and then the Pamela Boutflour along with the rest of Mabel Speakmans Estate.

Then you are saying that Pamela refused to inherit the Estate (do you mean just the Bamber portion?), and then it bounced on to Pamela's children?

So have I got that right?

Ann Eaton & David Boutflour inherited a portion of the estate, but only because Pamela Boutflour refused it?

Pamela Boutflour inherited a portion of Mabel Speakmans Estate, which she would have done so anyway?

 
« Last Edit: July 15, 2014, 04:27:PM by Harters »

No-Bits

  • Guest
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #46 on: July 15, 2014, 04:26:PM »
So have I got that right?

Ann Eaton & David Boutflour inherited a portion of the estate, but only because Pamela Boutflour refused it?

Pamela Boutflour inherited a portion of Mabel Speakmans Estate, which she would have done so anyway?

That hardly equates the the portrayal of the relatives on this forum as money grabbing; framing Jeremy to get their hands on the inheritance, etc, etc, etc.  :-\

It doesn't really work does it?  ???
« Last Edit: July 15, 2014, 04:27:PM by Harters »

Offline Jan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10318
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #47 on: July 15, 2014, 04:40:PM »
So have I got that right?

Ann Eaton & David Boutflour inherited a portion of the estate, but only because Pamela Boutflour refused it?

Pamela Boutflour inherited a portion of Mabel Speakmans Estate, which she would have done so anyway?

It sounded from Annes statement that she was to inherit something directly as it was changed so she would be included? But I would have to check the wording. She also did not comment on what granny speakman was ever told . Perhaps it is covered in one of the other 1991 statements.

Offline scipio_usmc

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9502
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #48 on: July 15, 2014, 04:45:PM »
So have I got that right?

Ann Eaton & David Boutflour inherited a portion of the estate, but only because Pamela Boutflour refused it?

Pamela Boutflour inherited a portion of Mabel Speakmans Estate, which she would have done so anyway?

Nevill estate to his neice (Jacqueline) and nephew Anthony in equal shares

June estate to sister Pam

Granny estate to daughter Pam

The above only concerns the residuary estates.  There were minor legacies to various relatives and then what remained after such is the residuary estate.

Pam reportedly gave away some of the inheritance to Ann. Whether she gave David (Ann's brother) anything is unclear.  At any rate whatever Pam didn't give away during her life would be included in her estate at death.

Politeness is organized indifference- Paul Valéry

No-Bits

  • Guest
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #49 on: July 15, 2014, 04:48:PM »
Nevill estate to his neice (Jacqueline) and nephew Anthony in equal shares

June estate to sister Pam

Granny estate to daughter Pam

The above only concerns the residuary estates.  There were minor legacies to various relatives and then what remained after such is the residuary estate.

Pam reportedly gave away some of the inheritance to Ann. Whether she gave David (Ann's brother) anything is unclear.  At any rate whatever Pam didn't give away during her life would be included in her estate at death.

It makes a mockery of the 'greedy relatives framing Jeremy to obtain inheritance' claims don't you think?

Sheds a whole new light on the matter. Wow. :o

Offline Jan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10318
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #50 on: July 15, 2014, 04:51:PM »
How they distributed after inheritance is a completely different subject I would imagine

Offline Jan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10318
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #51 on: July 15, 2014, 04:53:PM »
found this- although of course this is a statement not a proof of what finally happened to the estate.

Offline Jan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10318
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #52 on: July 15, 2014, 04:55:PM »
this is what anne said after stating nothing about what granny speakman was told about jeremy

No-Bits

  • Guest
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #53 on: July 15, 2014, 04:58:PM »
Yeah, with everybody's help, it looks like we've found out what happened to the estate.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2014, 05:04:PM by Harters »

Offline Jan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10318
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #54 on: July 15, 2014, 05:04:PM »
this is what it says on the official web site

"Jeremy was disinherited on conviction and the estate passed to the Boutflours . . Anne moved into the farmhouse. "

Then as someone else stated there was a fight from other members of the family to try and get the share they thought they were entitled to . So it does not prove much except the inheritance trail may have been more complicated than they thought hence the in family fighting afterwards - also I were under the impression that even before the trial they wanted Jeremy out of that financial web - so even before he was convicted they had made moves to exclude him. I think that does paint quite a picture.

Offline scipio_usmc

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9502
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #55 on: July 15, 2014, 05:05:PM »
That hardly equates the the portrayal of the relatives on this forum as money grabbing; framing Jeremy to get their hands on the inheritance, etc, etc, etc.  :-\

It doesn't really work does it?  ???

Part of why it doesn't work is based on some allegations from Jeremy and his supporters.

If Granny Speakman actually had a sizable inheritance in her will for Jeremy then the conspiracy doesn't work.

If the relatives understood the law then in that case they would realize instead of going to Jeremy then
 June's estate would go to her mother.  If Jeremy was to receive the bulk as he and some others allege then that means Jeremy would still profit not Ann and David.

So in order for Jeremy supporters to have a leg to stand on Speakman's will needed to leave most of the estate to Pam. This would benefit David and Ann because Pam is their mother and when she died they would stand to inherit.

Granted this is not very strong because it means they were plotting so that they would get the property down the road but some people do in fact do such. But you need evidence not just the bald suggestion they planted evidence for such reason. If there were evidence to prove they did fabricate evidence this could be submitted as a potential motive.

The carrot to get Anythony to play ball would be the spectre of him and his sister inheriting Nevill's estate if Nevill's estate were not combined with the other. 

Again though this would at best provide a potential motive if they had proof that the family did in fact plant evidence. It is a pretty weak argument to claim they should not be trusted and all evidence should be discounted because down the road they could have inherited any of the assets that remained when their parents were through with it.

Politeness is organized indifference- Paul Valéry

Offline Jan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 10318
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #56 on: July 15, 2014, 05:13:PM »
personally I don't think they did plant evidence . I think they believed he did it and were more than happy to go along with the police , and do everything they could to get him out of the way . IMO

Then as it was coming up to the trial they tied up what ever lose ends they could.


Opportunists rather than planners. But then I have not read any of the books only documents

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48676
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #57 on: July 15, 2014, 05:14:PM »
The default is per stripes.  Per capita must be mentioned in a will to override the default.  When intestacy rules kick in then the rules are per stripes with the exception of grandparents which is per capita.




The term is per stirpes------------not stripes.

No-Bits

  • Guest
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #58 on: July 15, 2014, 05:22:PM »
Part of why it doesn't work is based on some allegations from Jeremy and his supporters.

If Granny Speakman actually had a sizable inheritance in her will for Jeremy then the conspiracy doesn't work.

If the relatives understood the law then in that case they would realize instead of going to Jeremy then
 June's estate would go to her mother.  If Jeremy was to receive the bulk as he and some others allege then that means Jeremy would still profit not Ann and David.

So in order for Jeremy supporters to have a leg to stand on Speakman's will needed to leave most of the estate to Pam. This would benefit David and Ann because Pam is their mother and when she died they would stand to inherit.

Granted this is not very strong because it means they were plotting so that they would get the property down the road but some people do in fact do such. But you need evidence not just the bald suggestion they planted evidence for such reason. If there were evidence to prove they did fabricate evidence this could be submitted as a potential motive.

The carrot to get Anythony to play ball would be the spectre of him and his sister inheriting Nevill's estate if Nevill's estate were not combined with the other. 

Again though this would at best provide a potential motive if they had proof that the family did in fact plant evidence. It is a pretty weak argument to claim they should not be trusted and all evidence should be discounted because down the road they could have inherited any of the assets that remained when their parents were through with it.

Well that's that then, another myth busted.

I will finally head off on my travels.  :)

Offline scipio_usmc

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9502
Re: Order of Inheritance
« Reply #59 on: July 15, 2014, 05:31:PM »
found this- although of course this is a statement not a proof of what finally happened to the estate.

It is probably the best that we are going to find since at least it is someone who claims to have been involved in the process and to know about it.

While he could have been lying it doesn't seem like that is the case.

If these claims are true then for sure they made her aware that they thought Jeremy did it and she agreed because why else would she be in a great hurry to change her will so that Pam got everything instead of Jeremy getting June's share?

Also it made no sense to say that they told her everyone else died and yet for her to not ask about Jeremy.  Ann Eaton wasn't really sure what she knew about Jeremy or the exact circumstances of the will being changed.

Obviously her claim that David told her she didn't ask about Jeremy until December is not what he claimed.

That is why it is dangerous though to go by the grapevine.  When Ann talks about things she personally witnessed it is one thing.  When she talks about what people told her it is another.  That creates multiple chances for the message to get messed up like her being in error about June and Sheila being found in bed.  While it is possible a cop messed up and said that it is more likely she misunderstood what she was told or misremembered what she was told.  As time passes you forget what you witnessed even but forget even sooner what someone claimed.

The lawyer is of course the most reliable source.  To avoid malpractice claims you keep a detailed record of what the people tell you they want to accomplish so you can establish you followed their wishes. Clients can be pretty freaking ridiculous.  A friend drafted 2 wills for a husband and wife and told them they should retitle some of their assets so each owned around 50% in order to make the plan conained in the wills work.  They never did and one spouse, the one that died owned almost nothing.   The plan had been to give 500,000 to the kids and the remainder to the spouse using a one time exempption of $500,000 from the estate tax. Because the dead soouse had no assets in their name the bequests failed and the exemption was unable to be used.  So that meant the estate of the survivor was huge instead of reduced like they hoped- sop big tax bill when he died. They were pissed off so sued him for malpractice because they didn't follow his instructions to retitle assets.

The point is that lawyers are very careful and he would be in a position to say if Boutflour's account is true though it sounds credible and likely. 

Jeremy's claim that it was changed to write him out because they said he was dead makes no sense since his death would simply result in Pam getting everything under the existing will so the result would have been the same as the change supposedly effected.

Ann Eaton's belief it was changed to make her and David beneficiaries instead of Pam was wrong. But Eaton's error could have been from the fact her mother decided to share the estate with them forgetting that her mother did it vountarily. 
Politeness is organized indifference- Paul Valéry