Unidentified Male, seen at Whf, PC Myall, at 3.45am...

[Reader]

Is there a separate entry in this log regarding the individual seen walking away from the farmhouse about an hour after the police arrived that morning?

[paulg]

I thought they over took him, and ascertained it was JB after the event? Or did they stop before WHF, and have a discussion?

[TheBrilliantMistake]

I thought the police recognized JB when they overtook him?

There's mention of at least one copper recognising him from a previous motoring incident in which he was involved.  But in terms of the overtaking:

1) It was very early in the morning, so they'd certain notice a car on the roads (which they overtook).
2) It's not clear if they actually knew it was Jeremy at that very moment (although the closer to the house, the more likely it would be).
3) Upon the police arriving, and subsequently Jeremy arriving, it would have been evident at that point that the person they passed was indeed Jeremy.

When they come to write their logs, they state "we passed Jeremy on the way" - which makes sense (even if they didn't know it was Jeremy at that specific moment)

[Reader]

It was Pc Saxby who already knew Jeremy. There was a newspaper article that mentioned a "hunched up scruffy looking man" seen walking away from WHF. That is the individual I was referring to. Is he mentioned in the log being discussed here?

[simong]

That link just takes me to the main page of that site. I am not a member on that site.

[Hartley]

STATEMENT FROM MALCOLM BONNETT: PAGE 1

[Hartley]

STATEMENT FROM MALCOLM BONNETT: PAGE 2

[paulg]

Ok, i have had my brother out and about. He drives a VW Passat and i have had him driving different routes that EP could have taken that night. He drove as quickly as possible breaking speed limits, is a Class 1 driver. He says there was no traffic. Witham Police station Newland street to Pages lane- 21 minutes. He says that was the route he belived EP would have taken. He knows the area well and says on a different route that locals would know, he did it in 16 minutes.

Didn't the Police park away from the farmhouse and walk down Pages Lane. I would assume this would take a couple of minutes. My brother and I personally think it would be very hard to receive a call at 3.16am, take all the details, deploy a car from Witham and spot someone 29 minutes later at WHF. In our opinion.

www.sleuthingforjustice.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=74&t=2818&hilit=major+incident+log

Refers to calling a 'mobile police car' CA7. Does this indicate that CA7 was out and about/in the vicinity, rather than at a station?
If Jeremy was told at 3.36 that a car (CA5) would be sent out from Witham...

The mobile police vehicle would likely be parked/patrolling the Witham area. I'll need to check with the local police, but i don't think east of the river Blackwater comes under Witham polices usual jurisdiction. The 13 minutes is consistent with a police car travelling at speed from northern Witham area. Although i broke several speed limits doing the journey, with the aid of flashing blue lights, and the knowledge that i wouldn't get nicked, i could have wiped a few minutes off the time.

This is all useless information as far as i'm concerned, as the unidentified male could well be JB arriving at WHF. I assume that JB's arrival would be logged, and would be unidentified at the time.

The place is unlit, so any identified male would only be a few feet away to be given a sex. The police would aprehend any persons within the vicinity, especially if they're close enough to be given a sex.

And back to the original post, are/was EP looking for an unidentified male, or was the OP just using the log to raise doubts?

And if a highly skilled hitman has killed 5 people, set the scene to look like a suicide, but knew that one victim had made a phone call, would they really wait around to be seen...nah i don't think so.

[TheBrilliantMistake]

To be fair, I can't see Bamber hiring a highly skilled hitman.
Local thug? MAYBE

Not hitman's going to kill a family like that in the James Bond style. And certainly not with a crappy weapon like that.
And the trouble with a local nutter doing the job is that it's just prone to ending up a mess.

That's really why I could never accept the hitman scenario, even though it's technically possible, and he/she was incredibly cunning in deliberately making it look a messy job.
I doubt Bamber would have the means socially or financially to engage such a person. Could be wrong though.

[TheBrilliantMistake]

CA7 seems to be the 'official' car sent and it arrived first and CA7 did all the reporting from the scene
CA5 sent 1 minute later but arrived MUCH later

We don't know why, but in my mind it could be that CA5 'decided to attend too' but was much further away, or otherwise engaged.

CA5 also arrived with CA6 at the house (at the same time). CA6 was part of the Fire Arms escort and had rendezvoused with the Firearms team at a pub. Could it be that CA5 also rendezvoused with them?
Given them arriving at the same time, I suggest this is likely.

[paulg]

Does it really matter who got there first, and who spotted who?

This unidentified person would of had to know Jeremy Bambers phone number, and have the ability to mimic his step fathers voice... As Jeremy Bambers innocence depends on the ability to prove his sister did the murders, otherwise his story of events are just made up rubbish.

Would he recognise his step fathers voice? yes
Did his step father tell him his sister had gone beserk with a rifle? apparently yes
Would the unidentified male be able to fool his step father that he was Sheila, so much so, that he rang Jeremy convinced that the man in drag was Sheila? Highly unlikely.

[chelmsey]

Does it really matter who got there first, and who spotted who?

This unidentified person would of had to know Jeremy Bambers phone number, and have the ability to mimic his step fathers voice... As Jeremy Bambers innocence depends on the ability to prove his sister did the murders, otherwise his story of events are just made up rubbish.

Would he recognise his step fathers voice? yes
Did his step father tell him his sister had gone beserk with a rifle? apparently yes
Would the unidentified male be able to fool his step father that he was Sheila, so much so, that he rang Jeremy convinced that the man in drag was Sheila? Highly unlikely.

   

    Great post +1     

[chelmsey]

I think MT though is telling us that the unidentified male was the person that was supposedly  spotted in the upstairs window by PC BEWS,PC MYALL and JB.Assuming  that MT believes the unidentified male was Ralph.But then was MT stating that the police were desperately trying to identify this unidentified male.............oh now I am confused   

[VORTEX]

Does it really matter who got there first, and who spotted who?

This unidentified person would of had to know Jeremy Bambers phone number, and have the ability to mimic his step fathers voice... As Jeremy Bambers innocence depends on the ability to prove his sister did the murders, otherwise his story of events are just made up rubbish.

Would he recognise his step fathers voice? yes
Did his step father tell him his sister had gone beserk with a rifle? apparently yes
Would the unidentified male be able to fool his step father that he was Sheila, so much so, that he rang Jeremy convinced that the man in drag was Sheila? Highly unlikely.

Paulg - What about if the unidentified person had a gun to your head and said make this call and say these exact words (could be reading off a script). Risky .....in case they go off script and say the real story of whats going on. If i was the one with the gun in my hand back in 1985 I would have got Nevill to say the words into a cassette recorder and played it down the line as required. This prevents any risk of someone saying exactly whats going on if it dawns on them they are going to die anyway. You have a lot of power over someone with a gun to their head as well as their families. It's the way of modern bank robberies where you target individuals who work there and their families to get the access information etc - look at the Securitas heist in Kent a few years back. 

[chelmsey]

Vortex. I used to have that same thought.But would that not be very very risky.If JB had decided to call 999 and there was a police car in the vincinity, that could attend quickly ,there would have been a very real risk that the killer could have been spotted or even caught?