Beyond reasonable doubt.

[maggie]

so he volunteered information that incriminated him. If that window did not operate in that way he would have been proven innocent as it would have to have been someone still in the house.

I am not sure Jeremy said he could lock the window again did he? I thought that info came from AE and the police tried it and couldn't manage it. But oh well never mind, the judge said that it didn't matter how he got in and out just that he could have ...... that's our justice system aparrently. The fact is if he could have got in and out by the window so could anyone else.  It was never a secret in the family that the younger members climbed through the window when the door was locked.

[Jane]

found the thread - will have a read.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,2971.msg160717.html#msg160717

Is this the window that Adam insists Jeremy took a hack saw to several days prior to the murder? One wonder what explanation he'd have given to one of the many people who could have seen him doing it AND how he managed entrance and exit without getting some kind of print on  the bottom  ledge which was said to be clean.

[bigdaveglasgow75]

i went into the u justice forum.most of them are very anti jeremy.

[maggie]

Is this the window that Adam insists Jeremy took a hack saw to several days prior to the murder? One wonder what explanation he'd have given to one of the many people who could have seen him doing it AND how he managed entrance and exit without getting some kind of print on  the bottom  ledge which was said to be clean.

I know April and the hacksaw was found ages after - end Sept begining October wasn't it? Also I think found by a rellie. The windows had already been checked by forensics and nothing found then after finding hacksaw windows were checked again and marks found. ...... strange that, very, very strange.

[Jan]

So basically the answer is because they knew at some time he had exited that kitchen window before ,- they did not have to prove that is what happened on that night    So unless the catch to that window he supposedly had exited from had been changed before the murders and he was not aware of that - then that is going no-where. So they did not even have to find recent foot prints or finger prints to show why the police were sure the house was fully secured from the inside in their original reports, but  changed their minds when they though JB was responsible 

[susan]

Maggie/april  the windows had been freshly painted white just prior to the murders and no marks on the window cills after the murders then of course much later they appeared they changed the case number or something I remember Patti really digging into it wish she was here.

[Jane]

So basically the answer is because they knew at some time he had exited that kitchen window before ,- they did not have to prove that is what happened on that night    So unless the catch to that window he supposedly had exited from had been changed before the murders and he was not aware of that - then that is going no-where. So they did not even have to find recent foot prints or finger prints to show why the police were sure the house was fully secured from the inside in their original reports, but  changed their minds when they though JB was responsible 

Jansus, I may be wrong but I have a feeling that they were actually TOLD that they didn't have to PROVE that he did it (get in through the window) only that it was POSSIBLE that he did. Why the HELL could the same noot have applied to Sheila?

[susan]

jansus the house was secure on the night of the murders and as I said above the windows recently painted and no marks of the rusty old hacksaw blade had been used nobody entered or left the farm on that fateful evening through any door or window

[Jan]

this was a quote from Patti
"Yet, they knew Jeremy had entered the farm via a window on the 16th of September after the first 2 forensic examinations....So, on the 3rd examination it was established that the downstairs bathroom window had been used.  Of course it had been used, Jeremy left a note on the 16th to BW to ask her to secure the window....The police knew he had gained entry, because at this point he was being watched." 

So if JB left a note for BW to secure a window - why are we accepting that the window would " lock itself " when banged shut? ( I think they said he got in through the bathroom and left through the kitchen on the actual night)

If the windows were painted  I don't suppose they did change any locks? And does anyone know why the door was replaced just before the murders?

[susan]

Jansus if the windows did not bang shut how  :'(come all the windows were secure when the police arrived at the farm how this case ever got to Court I will never know.  Think they just needed a new door which had TWO SETS of keys Bambers kept one and the housekeeper I think had the others or Barbara Wilson.

[Jan]

So - I can only see one apparent not very clear picture of the kitchen window he is supposed to have climbed out of and then banged shut from the outside so it locked itself - and it looks as if there are objects in the window. So how did he climb over those without disturbing them with his big clod hoppers? Pity its not a very good photo.

[grahameb]

i went into the u justice forum.most of them are very anti jeremy.

I think you'll find they are mostly anti justice as well. The owner of the forum is a convicted criminal as well.

[Jan]

I am not sure Jeremy said he could lock the window again did he? I thought that info came from AE and the police tried it and couldn't manage it. But oh well never mind, the judge said that it didn't matter how he got in and out just that he could have ...... that's our justice system aparrently. The fact is if he could have got in and out by the window so could anyone else.  It was never a secret in the family that the younger members climbed through the window when the door was locked.

you are right just checked his statement - he admitted you could get into the house - but said there were no windows that you could bang shut and they would then look as  if they were locked from the inside. He said JM had lied about that.

[Jane]

So - I can only see one apparent not very clear picture of the kitchen window he is supposed to have climbed out of and then banged shut from the outside so it locked itself - and it looks as if there are objects in the window. So how did he climb over those without disturbing them with his big clod hoppers? Pity its not a very good photo.

And how did those same clod-hoppers get in and out without leaving traces of themselves. The bottom of the frame was said to be clean.

[maggie]

So - I can only see one apparent not very clear picture of the kitchen window he is supposed to have climbed out of and then banged shut from the outside so it locked itself - and it looks as if there are objects in the window. So how did he climb over those without disturbing them with his big clod hoppers? Pity its not a very good photo.

Well jansus, think it was Barbara Wilson who noticed the washing up liquid etc had been moved but then it was realised these things were probably moved by the police or their cleaners. There were also blood splashes on the same window but again confirmed the police cleanerz emptied their buckets with bloodied water and splashed the windows.. don't ask me is my answer followed by .... he didn't climb out of the window because he wasn't there.