Seeking the Truth for Jeremy Bamber

[Patti]

I want to give an honest opinion about the Jeremy Bamber case.  I have been on this forum for well over a year now and still new snippets of information comes through like in the Sheila's birth thread.  But, I have seen many false truths on the forum, I say false because in my opinion those false truths cannot be proved one way or the other.

I have problems with the fact that it has been said that Sheila was found on the bed and that there is a photograph that proves it.  Of course it is possible that Sheila was placed on the bed at some point during the investigation, but the fact remains that this has not been proven. If this all of this is false then all I can say is that it does not help Jeremy Bamber and his plight for innocence one little bit.

I also have problems with the phone call from Neville to the police station.  Maybe I have not studied this enough and need to look into it in more depth.

I also have problems with the many silencers introduced into this case.  I find it perfectly explainable the reason for the change in labels from SBJ/1 DB/1 and DR/1
To introduce more is not only confusing, but it could be untrue.

I think the truth is paramount in this case, it helps Jeremy more to seek to truth that it does to stretch the truth and twist it.

I want to ask a question! How many of you believe that there is a photograph of Sheila on the bed and that the police killed her?

[No-Bits]

Good post.

[haughton]

Patti. I have problems   with "2 bodies in the kitchen and then not 2 bodies in the kitchen"=  Ihave read that when the EP entered the kitchen later and found 1 body and gun gone they went into panic mode and barracaded the kitchen door and sent for back-up. true or false?

[Patti]

Patti. I have problems   with "2 bodies in the kitchen and then not 2 bodies in the kitchen"=  Ihave read that when the EP entered the kitchen later and found 1 body and gun gone they went into panic mode and barracaded the kitchen door and sent for back-up. true or false?

I have problems with that also.  I disbelieve that Sheila was shot in the kitchen and then managed to walk/crawl upstairs, there is absolutely no evidence to support it.

Collins reported via radio that he could see a woman in the kitchen, this logged as we know and those at the station could only hear what was being put over the radio as far as they knew it was a dead female, so when a report of one dead male came through they logged it as being one dead female and one dead male....They are the ones that were mapping this, or logging it and was reliant on what they heard....

I've never heard that they barricaded the door Houghton? Is this then another false?

[haughton]

Patti, Newbury1 mentioned it Jan17 2011

[Patti]

Patti, Newbury1 mentioned it Jan17 2011

Thank Houghton.

This is what Newbury1 said.


Hi,

Just a thought in relation to you commnents on the clean phone in the kitchen.

Mike may have replied to this, but I believe it has been reported that the police used this phone, possibly during the time they barricaded themslves in the kitchen when realising the body of the female first spotted in the kitchen had in fact gone by the time the senior officers entered the kitchen. Realising that they had messed up again the police may have actually wiped the phone either before using it or after.

Mike has also alleged that the kitchen was stage managed, as photos and police statements contradict the state of the kitchen when WHF was entered by the police. The clean phone could have been part of that.

I agree with your "Ashes to Ashes" policing, but this is more like the Keystone Kops!!

Cheers,
Newbury1

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,133.msg442.html#msg442

[Patti]

I doubt a raid team would consider barricading themselves in, for they knew at this point that there were guns in the house and they might have to do a quick exit, so that theory it not a plausible one.  It was said by some of the raid team that they opened windows and this was a means of escape so I doubt that they would barricade themselves in....

Houghton have you seen any document that confirms that this is what they did? 

I'm having an honest day.....where I can pull everything to pieces....Its my way! 

[susan]

Hello Patti

I don't believe the police shot Sheila not sure where the body was found I seem to think AE mentioned she was told Sheila was found on the bed.  Where do you think Sheila died downstairs or upstairs.  Not sure about the phone call to the police but keep an open mind as I do with all the silencers only one silencer seemed to count in this case.  Maybe we will have a clearer picture of events when Mason Doyle's book is published shortly.

[haughton]

Patti, it's just what I have read on this forum and elsewhere. I have no access to documents.

[Patti]

Hello Patti

I don't believe the police shot Sheila not sure where the body was found I seem to think AE mentioned she was told Sheila was found on the bed.  Where do you think Sheila died downstairs or upstairs.  Not sure about the phone call to the police but keep an open mind as I do with all the silencers only one silencer seemed to count in this case.  Maybe we will have a clearer picture of events when Mason Doyle's book is published shortly.

Hi Susan

I think that's an honest answer and brave one.   I agree that Clarke told AE that Sheila was found on the bed, but this was early days and I don't believe that Clarke himself had witnessed the scene at this point.  But, this had convinced AE at that time, but when more details surrounding the scene came out it was said that Sheila was found on the floor at the other side of the bed.  Susan, I don't think she was shot by the police or shot herself downstairs. 

Although, looking at the photo of Sheila there is insufficient evidence that tells us she died in the position she was found.  Normally there are large amounts of blood in the area where someone has died. Not the drips or spatter that we can see in the photo.  We can't see what is under the bible and, we can't see if there are any large amounts of blood underneath her body...But, we do have the evidence from the pathologist that says blood fell to the right hand side of her body that congealed under her right arm and that she was likely to have been in a sitting position or kneeling position at the time she received the shots.  It was unlikely she was in a standing position because the blood did not fall downward on to her nightdress....

[susan]

Thank you Patti for a very informative post did not know about the blood etc but do think the body was staged managed why this was done I am not sure at all as I have never thought the police shot Sheila nor that she was found downstairs in the kitchen.  Somethings we will never know

[killingeve]

Hello Patti

I don't believe the police shot Sheila not sure where the body was found I seem to think AE mentioned she was told Sheila was found on the bed.  Where do you think Sheila died downstairs or upstairs.  Not sure about the phone call to the police but keep an open mind as I do with all the silencers only one silencer seemed to count in this case.  Maybe we will have a clearer picture of events when Mason Doyle's book is published shortly.

Hi Susan

I agree with Patti's initial post on this thread.  I remain open minded on most aspects but very sceptical about the police shooting SC, NB's call to police, multiple silencers and any photo of SC on the bed with one wound. 

I'm unsure about SC's final resting place ie bed or floor.  If bed then how come no blood on the front of her nightie and more elsewhere?  Unless the police lifted her off gently to apply CPR. I don't think SC shot herself in the kitchen and then moved upstairs due again to the lack of blood on her nightie and elsewhere.  I think I'm right in saying that the pathologists's report states after the first shot SC could have survived for a short time ie not long enough for the first wound to form a plug to prevent blood getting onto her nightie and elsewhere.  Anything is possible.  The nightie looks very frumpy as though it might have belonged to June.  The police could have changed it extremely unlikely though.

[susan]

Hello N/N  so confusing but if Sheila was shot upstairs why was her body staged for photo's as they appear to have been done what would be he point if everything was above board and why would EP try to hide anything where have all the missing items gone and why was so much destroyed this could have held the answer to the truth.

[Patti]

Thank you Patti for a very informative post did not know about the blood etc but do think the body was staged managed why this was done I am not sure at all as I have never thought the police shot Sheila nor that she was found downstairs in the kitchen.  Somethings we will never know

Hi Susan.  I do believe her arm was moved, I have no doubts about that.. Regarding the whole body I am like you, perhaps we will never know.  There was a time, when I thought her body had been carried and placed there, because in that area it lacks a large surface of blood....but this might be because the s blood fell to her right side, the large surface of blood might be underneath her, so you might be right we don't know. 

I have blown up the left hand side of the bed (Neville's side) and there are marks on the pillow and just below, but I can't determine what those dark marks are. 

[susan]

Patti would I be correct in thinking that June was shot on the bed.  I missed so much with the Dial Up connection but now I am cooking with gas and have access to much more information