Daniel and Nicholas Caffell: 22 June 1979-7 August 1985

[Caroline R]

Presumably in broad daylight and sans wetsuit.

Over his clothes!!

[lookout]

He'd probably been dosing himself up with rhino horn and chasing the wife around the bedroom,but she wasn't having any so he shot her.

[maggie]

He'd probably been dosing himself up with rhino horn and chasing the wife around the bedroom,but she wasn't having any so he shot her.

[Jane]

He only got 15 months for murdering his wife.? He also dealt in Rhino horn and was charged with that as well,so it ran concurrently with his already murder charge. Nice man,eh.?
I wonder if Neville was attending that little charge.?

lookout, I think he was given much longer than 15 months. Latterly he was in Norwich prison where he ran the library and I believe, some kind of antique business. A friend of mine who is a priest used to visit him regularly. He was released fairly recently, well within the last 7 years but died shortly afterwards.

[Steve_uk]

Another interesting thread. If Sheila is ranting and raving akin to her reported Maida Vale episodes the twins would surely have been roused.http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1407.0.html

[lookout]

Another interesting thread. If Sheila is ranting and raving akin to her reported Maida Vale episodes the twins would surely have been roused.http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1407.0.html

The twins probably did wake up at times,Steve,,hence their lack of concentration and tiredness at school,,on which their lifestyle reflected.
At WHF,,the little chaps would have been killed first.

[Caroline R]

Another interesting thread. If Sheila is ranting and raving akin to her reported Maida Vale episodes the twins would surely have been roused.http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1407.0.html

Tragically, they were probably shot first.

[maggie]

The twins probably did wake up at times,Steve,,hence their lack of concentration and tiredness at school,,on which their lifestyle reflected.
At WHF,,the little chaps would have been killed first.

I do wonder if the drawings by the twins were specifically about WHF.  They may very well have been their take on 'home' with their mother.  Sheila was a sick woman and the result of that must have been massive insecurity for the children.  If she lived in a psychotic world it is quite possible she did behave bizarrely at times and the boys could very well have been neglected imo.

[lookout]

I do wonder if the drawings by the twins were specifically about WHF.  They may very well have been their take on 'home' with their mother.  Sheila was a sick woman and the result of that must have been massive insecurity for the children.  If she lived in a psychotic world it is quite possible she did behave bizarrely at times and the boys could very well have been neglected imo.

I think those little boys were left to their own devices at times,,such as getting themselves ready for school and getting their own breakfasts,,as Sheila would have found it difficult to get up in the morning,,particularly as paranoid schizophrenics have difficulty in sleeping at night anyway.
There was obviously something not as it should have been for the social workers to have intervened albeit for a short period. Why they didn't give support I'll never know,,as they saw Sheila ( smoking a cigar ) but what they said or did beyond that,I don't know. There must have been health visitors around then,as they too would have given some sort of support to all of them,,as well as keeping an eye on Sheila,,making sure she took her meds,etc.
Those little chaps must have been nervous wrecks at times between their mother and grandmother.They should have had their own little friends instead of being surrounded by adults all the time.

[tyler]

Tyler I'd have thought that would have been obvious. I believe Bamber to be guilty and therefore would - like anyone else who believes the same thing - to challenge the evidence and arguments of those that think otherwise. Just like you have done; copiously.

Copiously? lol,I have been a member of the forum for years!
Challenge the evidence? And what evidence might that be?
Of course you are free to voice your opinions,but as with most of the "guilters" that have frequented the forum in the past,relying on Roger Wilkes' opinions (from his book) is not really challenging the evidence imo.
 You believe JB to be guilty and that is your prerogative,but do you have answers for the following -:
How did 2 bodies found upon entry,become only 1 body?
A member of the raid team described Sheila,when he first saw her,as having blood running down the sides of her mouth.Dead bodies do not bleed hours after death do they?
How come Sheila's body was not in full rigor,as was the rest of the victims,if she had died hours earlier?

[maggie]

Copiously? lol,I have been a member of the forum for years!
Challenge the evidence? And what evidence might that be?
Of course you are free to voice your opinions,but as with most of the "guilters" that have frequented the forum in the past,relying on Roger Wilkes' opinions (from his book) is not really challenging the evidence imo.
 You believe JB to be guilty and that is your prerogative,but do you have answers for the following -:
How did 2 bodies found upon entry,become only 1 body?
A member of the raid team described Sheila,when he first saw her,as having blood running down the sides of her mouth.Dead bodies do not bleed hours after death do they?
How come Sheila's body was not in full rigor,as was the rest of the victims,if she had died hours earlier?

Hi tyler. love your 'copious' well thought out and knowledgeable posts, never offensive..........you go girl ;Dx

[susan]

Morning Maggie  I agree tyler brillant poster Daniel could learn so much from her if he is here to learn and debate

[maggie]

Morning Maggie  I agree tyler brillant poster Daniel could learn so much from her if he is here to learn and debate

Good morning Susie 

[lookout]

We can always rely on tyler with her well thought out,straight to the point and non-offensive posts.
Well done girl,,you're a credit to the forum.

[killingeve]

I do wonder if the drawings by the twins were specifically about WHF.  They may very well have been their take on 'home' with their mother.  Sheila was a sick woman and the result of that must have been massive insecurity for the children.  If she lived in a psychotic world it is quite possible she did behave bizarrely at times and the boys could very well have been neglected imo.

Morning Maggie

CC discusses the drawings in his book as the twins discussed them with CC's mother, Mrs Brencher.  I read the book very quickly and really need to read it again but off the top of my head Mrs Brencher with hindsight, always a wonderful thing as we know, felt that the twins were trying to alert her to various issues.  My partner currently has the book at his office so when I recover it I will post up the interpretation.  Perhaps this will then shed some light on whether the drawings were about WHF or as you put it "their take on 'home' with their mother".

There is much evidence to show that family dysfunction is cyclical and imo this can be evidenced here too:

June

Mental illness - according to Dr F caused by her decision to adopt.
Unintentional neglect of SC leading up to her hospitalisation '59?
Insecurity for SC?

SC

Mental illness - root cause unknown - possibly connected to June above?
Unintentional neglect of twins as stated in CC's letter intended for NB
Insecurity for twins?