The case of Madeleine McCann

[mike tesko]

Mike,yes,cadaver dogs do detect what they are trained for,and are pretty accurate,but-------------what they can't do is tell you whose body they've detected.

Not forgetting that two more families moved into 5a pretty soon after the McCanns vacated it to move to another apartment. It was during this time that blood had been found,but it didn't necessarily mean that it was from the McCanns'.

There was also a bloodied shoe print inside the hire car,which was left behind by the PJ who drove the car to the compound where it was then tested. Do we have the previous user of the hire car ? I very much doubt it.

Hi Lookout,

The way I see it, is that it would be too coincidental that another body was hidden in the same wardrobe, behind the same sofa, and amongst the shrubbery, on another occasion involving different people, and a totally different victim - it would mean something far more significant if Maddie disappeared from apartment 5A, and somebodyelse was killed there, and thier body concealed in the three aforementioned hiding places...

Considering that the apartment was the place where Maddie vanished from, and it being the focal point of police interest, I doubt that another killing took place at the same apartment, afterwards...

On the other hand, if such a killing had taken place there before Maddies disappearance, now that would be an extraordinary councidence...

[Alias]

DP certainly needs closer scrutiny imo,due to his and Kate's differing version of events relating to that early evening visit to 5a,the Gasper statements and the suspicion from the child protection lady.

I agree.

[mike tesko]

Cadaver dog and blood hound evidence is too significant to ignore, despite possible complications...

[mike tesko]

I have been around animals most of my life, and when you have you come to realise that an animals instincts, are always accurate, they can sense things, they are sensitive to mood changes of people in their environment, and loads of other things which we mere mortals have no understanding of - sense of smell to dogs is phenomenal...

Cadaver dog and blood hound evidence, is therefore good and accurate, as far as I am concerned...

[Roch]

Mike,yes,cadaver dogs do detect what they are trained for,and are pretty accurate,but-------------what they can't do is tell you whose body they've detected.

Are you suggesting that another person's corpse has been at some point stored in 5A prior to the cadaver dog's indications? 

There was also a bloodied shoe print inside the hire car,which was left behind by the PJ who drove the car to the compound where it was then tested. Do we have the previous user of the hire car ? I very much doubt it.

Are you implying that the PJ either deliberately or accidentally contaminated the hire car?

[mike tesko]

Lets deal with the matter of the cadaver dog and blood hound evidence, as though it was true prior to Maddie vanishing off the face of the earth by 10pm, when Kate McCann alerts everyone to the taking of her daughter. Who else would have gone to the trouble of concealing Maddies body in  the parents bedroom, moving it to behind the sofa in the lounge, then outside amongst the shrubs of the poolside garden...

[mike tesko]

On the other hand, if the Cadaver dog, and the blood hound evidence is post Maddies demise, then I cannot understand why her body would be brought back to apartment 5A and concealed in the wardrobe of the parents bedroom, behind the sofa of the lounge, and amongst the garden shrubs? 

Added to this, is the dogs reaction to the hire car, used by the McCanns after Maddie vanished...

[Roch]

Mike,yes,cadaver dogs do detect what they are trained for,and are pretty accurate,but-------------what they can't do is tell you whose body they've detected.

Are you suggesting that another person's corpse has been at some point stored in 5A prior to the cadaver dog's indications? 

On the other hand, if the Cadaver dog evidence is post Maddies demise, then I cannot understand why her body would be brought back to apartment 5A and concealed in the wardrobe of the parents bedroom, behind the sofa of the lounge, and amongst the garden shrubs? 

This is what I'm trying to say.  Even if it could be explained away regarding blood indications, for whatever reason, how likely is it that another cadaver other than that of Madeleine was present in the apartment on a separate occasion? 

Is it purely coincidence that one of the cadaver indications is behind the sofa, next to the window?  This is the very same window supposedly used by an abductor?  The abduction scenario that stems from the McCann parents.  They are the source.

[lookout]

Are you suggesting that another person's corpse has been at some point stored in 5A prior to the cadaver dog's indications? 

Are you implying that the PJ either deliberately or accidentally contaminated the hire car?

Not necessarily another persons' corpse,Roch,but the scent left behind from someone,which could have been on the shoe or clothing such as the PJ who trod blood into the hire car which was on the sole/heel of his shoe. The officer could have come from a mortuary,we don't know,or even trod in animal blood,but one thing is not to jump to conclusions in this case.

Kate had attended 6 deaths before she went on holiday and no matter how much you bathe and shower,wash garments,etc,a cadaver dog can sniff out the smell days later. Kates' bible had the smell because she'd probably/obviously handled it when her patients died.

[Roch]

Not necessarily another persons' corpse,Roch,but the scent left behind from someone,which could have been on the shoe or clothing such as the PJ who trod blood into the hire car which was on the sole/heel of his shoe. The officer could have come from a mortuary,we don't know,or even trod in animal blood,but one thing is not to jump to conclusions in this case.

Kate had attended 6 deaths before she went on holiday and no matter how much you bathe and shower,wash garments,etc,a cadaver dog can sniff out the smell days later. Kates' bible had the smell because she'd probably/obviously handled it when her patients died.

The thing is Lookout, even if Kate had attended six deaths, or even if a PJ SOC had trod in a dead person's blood or on a corpse, how would that explain the specific locations for cadaver scent in the apartment?   Do you think it is purely coincidence that there is a cadaver indication behind the sofa, between sofa and window?  The McCann parents are the source of an abduction scenario, involving the same window.

[nugnug]

those dogs sense of smell is so good they can pick up the scent of blood that has been there for ages.

[lookout]

The thing is Lookout, even if Kate had attended six deaths, or even if a PJ SOC had trod in a dead person's blood or on a corpse, how would that explain the specific locations for cadaver scent in the apartment?   Do you think it is purely coincidence that there is a cadaver indication behind the sofa, between sofa and window?  The McCann parents are the source of an abduction scenario, involving the same window.

Roch,I'm of the belief that neither Gerry nor Kate had any part whatsoever in the disappearance of Madeleine.
The scent which was detected might not have had anything to do with cadavers. It may well have been a source of anything to do with bodily fluids from either animal or human carried in via footwear or even distributed in some way from a human. A dog,whether cadaver trained or not will pick up a scent of where something or someone has been.
Even in dogs who are " trained " to detect cancer,is in someway a myth,as ALL dogs can sniff out a sore on a person,or even a scent which to them isn't of the norm when they persist in sniffing. An example was when a dog my daughter had, insisted sniffing an area on my body until I was diagnosed,and sure enough,it was an ulcerated area which needed attention and two years ago,the area was lanced and the offending " thing " was sent for testing,which gladly resulted in it being benign,but nevertheless,it could well have turned out a lot differently and only because of the dogs' persistence in " greeting " me this way was I able to breathe easy.
What I'm saying is that because of this particular incident,I could have convinced myself that it was cancer,all because the dog seemed intent on sniffing. The same as the result of the cadaver dogs' response in thinking it was a cadaver scent. See what I mean ? It can be misconstrued so easily.

[lookout]

If you were to drag a body along a floor,then remove it,ANY dog would " show interest " in the scent and automatically follow it. It's what dogs do. Even a cut finger will arouse interest in a family pet.

[mike tesko]

My pet dog Misty, has a habit of sniffing and licking the front part of my head, and the outside edges of my feet, which are locations in my body, where (a) I have a brain tumour, and (b) numbness in my little toes, due to diabetic condition...

[lookout]

 Mike,a pet can smell a wound a mile off,and they're pretty accurate at knowing where " you hurt ".