Jeremy Bamber: the Prelude, the Tragedy and the Aftermath

[JackiePreece]

Sorry lookout but I  disagree with your opinion on adoption. It is an accepted fact that the emotional wound known as the Primal Wound is  inflicted before a baby is conscious of it. This cannot be denied and it does cause difficulties and emotional pain which is often not recognised by the sufferer because how can anyone be aware of what are not normal feelings. 

It's true many people have very hard love less childhoods in natural families but babies adopted in the first two years of life and who go on to have a hard love less  childhood are disadvantaged from the start.

Children adopted over 2 years of age have different problems, many of these have conscious memories of hideous abuse and rejection and are damaged in ways which are easier to understand.

Because I quote a book about the effects of baby adoption, an area which has only recently begun to be explored, doesn't downgrade the horrors  and cruelty inflicted on natural children or the more 'acceptable, heavy handed parenting' which can be so damaging to a little child.

I actually think Jane is very brave to voice her feelings about her childhood as you have been in the past.

I am very aware that I was massively lucky in my upbringing and always appreciate that.

Maggie primal scream sounds like sudo science to me.  What about the case where two French baby girls were accidentally swapped at birth?  Do they have primal screams?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/families-of-two-women-accidentally-switched-at-birth-awarded-14million-in-ruling-by-french-court-10036285.html

The Queen left her children with nannies when they were babies for months on end to go on tours.  Do Charles, Ann, Andrew, and Edward suffer primal screams?  100 or so years ago many women died in childbirth what about all these babies did they suffer primal screams? 

Caroline has a degree in psychologies and good spatial awareness I would be interested in what she has she got to say about primal screams?

I am convinced a loving family home conquers all.

[Steve_uk]

The father found it difficult to accept the non-biological daughter and he separated from his wife. The Royal Family is buttressed in many ways, though not it seems enough for three of the four children to have experienced failed marriages.

[maggie]

Maggie primal scream sounds like sudo science to me.  What about the case where two French baby girls were accidentally swapped at birth?  Do they have primal screams?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/families-of-two-women-accidentally-switched-at-birth-awarded-14million-in-ruling-by-french-court-10036285.html

The Queen left her children with nannies when they were babies for months on end to go on tours.  Do Charles, Ann, Andrew, and Edward suffer primal screams?  100 or so years ago many women died in childbirth what about all these babies did they suffer primal screams? 

Caroline has a degree in psychologies and good spatial awareness I would be interested in what she has she got to say about primal screams?

I am convinced a loving family home conquers all.

I think you have your phrases mixed up Jackie as the name of the book is The Primal Wound.

I agree that a truly loving well bonded familyholds a family together but it doesn't help with outside influences which we all have to overcome.

What do I know about the psychology of the children of the Queen ? It is believed that premature babies put into incubators and not held and bonded with the mother will suffer for some extent from separation, and loss of part of themselves.

Don't know what Caroline would say about any of it but strange how so many people with no experience of adoption think they have all the answers.  Wish I had all the answers.

[JackiePreece]

The father found it difficult to accept the non-biological daughter and he separated from his wife. The Royal Family is buttressed in many ways, though not it seems enough for three of the four children to have experienced failed marriages.

Steve isn't that how it came to light, the father of one of the girls suspected something wasn't right?

Many people have failed marriages.  The queen had four children and 3/4 ended in failure    But Ann and Charles are now happily married as far as anyone knows.

What about all the thousands of women who died in childbirth 100 or so years ago.  Their babies were brought up by others.  Did they all suffer primal screams?

Prisons are stuffed full with people brought up in care homes not people adopted by middle class families.

[JackiePreece]

I think you have your phrases mixed up Jackie as the name of the book is The Primal Wound.

I agree that a truly loving well bonded familyholds a family together but it doesn't help with outside influences which we all have to overcome.

What do I know about the psychology of the children of the Queen ? It is believed that premature babies put into incubators and not held and bonded with the mother will suffer for some extent from separation, and loss of part of themselves.

Don't know what Caroline would say about any of it but strange how so many people with no experience of adoption think they have all the answers.  Wish I had all the answers.

What book?

[Jane]

Steve isn't that how it came to light, the father of one of the girls suspected something wasn't right?

Many people have failed marriages.  The queen had four children and 3/4 ended in failure    But Ann and Charles are now happily married as far as anyone knows.

What about all the thousands of women who died in childbirth 100 or so years ago.  Their babies were brought up by others.  Did they all suffer primal screams?

Prisons are stuffed full with people brought up in care homes not people adopted by middle class families.

Hardly surprising as there are many more who have been bought up in care homes than those who have been adopted by middle class families.

[JackiePreece]

Hardly surprising as there are many more who have been bought up in care homes than those who have been adopted by middle class families.

Do you have any evidence to back this up?

[maggie]

Hardly surprising as there are many more who have been bought up in care homes than those who have been adopted by middle class families.

Very true.

[JackiePreece]

Very true.

If its true provide the evidence.

[Jane]

If its true provide the evidence.

If you're that bothered, you provide it to the contrary.

[JackiePreece]

If you're that bothered, you provide it to the contrary.

I'm not that bothered but if you want to argue the point then the obvious thing to do is provide some evidence by way of research, statistics, data. 

I can only assume you can't be bothered or you're not interested in the same way you've said you are about housework!

[lookout]

The father found it difficult to accept the non-biological daughter and he separated from his wife. The Royal Family is buttressed in many ways, though not it seems enough for three of the four children to have experienced failed marriages.

Like Sheila,Princess Diana had endured a stifled  and starchy existence and must have desperately searched for a way out at times. Love was what was lacking in the two of them up until the children came along in which both drew their love from the children until history repeated itself ( divorce ) and for Sheila it meant facing a lonely time when she didn't have the boys with her. What a Godforsaken miserable life for someone so young and not a decent friend to give her the time.     
Sheila must have felt that life wasn't worth living, though she hadn't indicated such but her mental health was testament to that,as was Diana's when she had eating problems then attempted to throw herself downstairs.   

[JackiePreece]

Maggie I saw the film about Steve Jobs.  It should be out on DVD now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs_%282015_film%29

[JackiePreece]

Like Sheila,Princess Diana had endured a stifled  and starchy existence and must have desperately searched for a way out at times. Love was what was lacking in the two of them up until the children came along in which both drew their love from the children until history repeated itself ( divorce ) and for Sheila it meant facing a lonely time when she didn't have the boys with her. What a Godforsaken miserable life for someone so young and not a decent friend to give her the time.     
Sheila must have felt that life wasn't worth living, though she hadn't indicated such but her mental health was testament to that,as was Diana's when she had eating problems then attempted to throw herself downstairs.

Excellent post Lookout. 

[Jane]

I'm not that bothered but if you want to argue the point then the obvious thing to do is provide some evidence by way of research, statistics, data. 

I can only assume you can't be bothered or you're not interested in the same way you've said you are about housework!

I don't recall saying I'm interested in housework.