Jeremy's Alibi...

[grahameb]

As i see it grahame most of the views on jeremy are contained at a point in time, to put my chips on the table  how on earth he has not gone insane i will never know sometimes i feel the death penalty is more humane.

Yes I think long sentences are inhumane as well. They rob people of a vital element of humanity. Personality, individuality and freedom. But of course that ios what they are calculated to do.

[Caroline R]

WELL DONE MARTIN!!!!!  The only thing steve left out of that appalling piece of literary, I don't think so, drivvle is the part where "He clasped her to his manly bosom and smiled sardonically. She looked up at him, her innocent eyes liquid with hope and longing."!!!!!!!

 

[susan]

Hi april  you should have been on the stage

[Caroline R]

Julie Mugford was not out for all she could get. She first met Jeremy at a London bar in November 1983 where they were both working and they felt a mutual attraction. It wasn't until a few months later that she realized the farming connection,and at that time Jeremy didn't even have the cottage at Goldhanger. Here is Jeremy back from his working holiday in New Zealand,not wanting to enter the farming way of life,feeling his way around maybe at a bit of a loss,whereupon he meets Julie.

I won't bother pasting the rest - This 'rubbish' conjures up the image of JB in a top hat and cloak, sporting a heavily waxed moustache, whilst a fast paced tune is played frantically on the piano as he ties Mugford to the railway track 

[susan]

Caroline R   

[grahameb]

I won't bother pasting the rest - This 'rubbish' conjures up the image of JB in a top hat and cloak, sporting a heavily waxed moustache, whilst a fast paced tune is played frantically on the piano as he ties Mugford to the railway track 

Could be made into a silent movie I suppose?

[Patti]

No Jeremy used Julie;he used her for sex,he used her as an excuse to have a ladies' bicycle at Goldhanger,and he used her as a confidant,which was his undoing. Of course he may have had relationships with women in the past but he didn't understand their psychology unlike Brett who sensed what Julie was after when after the murders he proposed a toast to "Jeremy and his future bride". Jeremy had realized for several months that he didn't want to marry Julie;he felt awkward with her in the company of his parents possibly because she was not of their social class,and like a servant he paid her off with £400 and thought that he could keep her sweet in the future with his money and the threat of her being an accessory to murder.

Hi Steve.  2 years is a long time to be in a relationship. Jeremy could have had any girl he wanted too, with his looks.  Julie her self was in love with this guy, she even quoted that he was  loving and romantic with her. This is hardly a man who didn't know how to love. He spent a great deal of money on her and she took it...she also took 25k form the New of the World. Was that not blood money?

Even after they broke up, he gives her £400 pounds, because the guy had promised to help her pay for an holiday, plus it was her 21st birthday. He could have been nasty and gave her nothing, but being kind hearted, he wanted to give it to her, so that she could away.  It was no pay off, I think he felt a lot about her...Not once did he slag her off in his statements or say anything nasty about her...

About the marriage that never was....if you read his statement it was his mother that had wanted them to get married....and because of that he did the opposite as Jeremy always did...If his mother hadn't have mentioned it all the time, Jeremy says he would have married Julie....

You say he used her....it works both ways Steve...maybe they used each other, or maybe they were just a couple in love....and her life changed when she found out he was seeing an old flame from the past....She was bitter, she placed a pillow over his face and she smacked him hard across the face....What does Jeremy do? He asks her why did she do that.....She said, and she admits saying it....If I can't have you, no one else can....When she hits him, she says he twisted her arm...well any other man, would have hit her back....He may have twisted her arm and pushed her back on the bed, but this was to stop her.....When she smashed the mirror, what does he do...he goes running to her for he thought she had hurt herself......Well, a man who has psychopathy would not do that...he wouldn't care, he wouldn't care if she went on holiday or not.....he wouldn't defend her mother.....he wouldn't cry like a baby when his dog got run over...would he? psychopaths have no feeling for animals....Anyway, I am babbling on......I suspect I know who you are, but I will keep quiet....Ha! 

I forgot to add, that June offered to buy Julie a flat. 

[Steve_uk]

Hi Steve.  2 years is a long time to be in a relationship. Jeremy could have had any girl he wanted too, with his looks.  Julie her self was in love with this guy, she even quoted that he was  loving and romantic with her. This is hardly a man who didn't know how to love. He spent a great deal of money on her and she took it...she also took 25k form the New of the World. Was that not blood money?

Even after they broke up, he gives her £400 pounds, because the guy had promised to help her pay for an holiday, plus it was her 21st birthday. He could have been nasty and gave her nothing, but being kind hearted, he wanted to give it to her, so that she could away.  It was no pay off, I think he felt a lot about her...Not once did he slag her off in his statements or say anything nasty about her...

About the marriage that never was....if you read his statement it was his mother that had wanted them to get married....and because of that he did the opposite as Jeremy always did...If his mother hadn't have mentioned it all the time, Jeremy says he would have married Julie....

You say he used her....it works both ways Steve...maybe they used each other, or maybe they were just a couple in love....and her life changed when she found out he was seeing an old flame from the past....She was bitter, she placed a pillow over his face and she smacked him hard across the face....What does Jeremy do? He asks her why did she do that.....She said, and she admits saying it....If I can't have you, no one else can....When she hits him, she says he twisted her arm...well any other man, would have hit her back....He may have twisted her arm and pushed her back on the bed, but this was to stop her.....When she smashed the mirror, what does he do...he goes running to her for he thought she had hurt herself......Well, a man who has psychopathy would not do that...he wouldn't care, he wouldn't care if she went on holiday or not.....he wouldn't defend her mother.....he wouldn't cry like a baby when his dog got run over...would he? psychopaths have no feeling for animals....Anyway, I am babbling on......I suspect I know who you are, but I will keep quiet....Ha! 

I forgot to add, that June offered to buy Julie a flat. 

Whether you believe Jeremy had a hand in the murders or not he undoubtedly felt a huge sense of relief and freedom as he looked around and pondered his future. He had inherited the Maida Vale flat which he made his new base and he was living the playboy lifestyle as rumour got round that this farmer's son had come into money. It was in this context that Jeremy declined to go on holiday with Julie as he had promised her as a gift for her 21st birthday: he tried to justify himself by offering to pay for her to go to Malta but he wasn't paying for Danielle to accompany her.

June had offered to buy Jeremy and Julie a flat,possibly out of the proceeds of selling the Goldhanger cottage,if they would both move out of the area and thereby quell the rumours that were circulating in the village. To be fair to Julie I doubt that any young woman would have been good enough in June's eyes for her Jem,but it shows the hypocrisy of that class that appearance counts for more than substance. As for Jeremy marrying Julie,I doubt that was ever in his plans,whatever did or did not emanate from his mother. If a man wants to marry a woman he will normally move heaven and high earth to bring that state of affairs about.

[Patti]

Whether you believe Jeremy had a hand in the murders or not he undoubtedly felt a huge sense of relief and freedom as he looked around and pondered his future. He had inherited the Maida Vale flat which he made his new base and he was living the playboy lifestyle as rumour got round that this farmer's son had come into money. It was in this context that Jeremy declined to go on holiday with Julie as he had promised her as a gift for her 21st birthday: he tried to justify himself by offering to pay for her to go to Malta but he wasn't paying for Danielle to accompany her.

June had offered to buy Jeremy and Julie a flat,possibly out of the proceeds of selling the Goldhanger cottage,if they would both move out of the area and thereby quell the rumours that were circulating in the village. To be fair to Julie I doubt that any young woman would have been good enough in June's eyes for her Jem,but it shows the hypocrisy of that class that appearance counts for more than substance. As for Jeremy marrying Julie,I doubt that was ever in his plans,whatever did or did not emanate from his mother. If a man wants to marry a woman he will normally move heaven and high earth to bring that state of affairs about.

Hi Steve, I could say the same to you about who you think is responsible for the murders that took place that night.  One of the first lies Julie told was that M. Mcdonald had murdered them...and JB had paid him 2k.

I don't think he felt a sense of relief at all, that his family had been killed, I can't understand why anyone would think that..let alone say it...To me the lad was in shock, he did not want to believe it had happened.....he called Jones a hard bastard, when he asked him if he shot his family....he told Jones he did not want to hear things about what had happened to them, he also talked in the present tense, which psychologically means that he hadn't excepted that they were dead....Sometimes, when you lose loved ones, it does not hit you for a long while....

I lost both my parents together 7 years ago and I am now undergoing bereavement counselling 7 years on....It was difficult for me to grieve; every time I went to cry, I couldn't because of the pains in my head, so this caused me to stop grieving.  Not everyone grieves in the same way Steve....You can't judge a man because he sold some stuff after the funerals; he had to take control, not only the farm, but everything else....his mind must have been a wreck....valium and injections....drugs mixed with drink....this is how he grieved.......I will tell you this...if Jeremy had been found not guilty, he would have had hell of a fight on his hands regarding the wills and estate...just as much as there was a long drawn out legal battle when Jeremy was found guilty.....it was not to be straight forward for his extended family either.   

he had just lost his family and had funerals to pay for.  Don't forget his friends were at hand to help him all the way and to cheer him up....get him to go out and go on holiday. One has to wonder if the friends used Jeremy, thinking he was the rich kid and tagged along to see what they could get out of it.....The hotel in Amsterdam where Julie Brett and Jeremy stayed was a one bedroom affair....it wasn't the 5 star luxury that was reported in the press.....

I am not saying that Jeremy didn't like the high life at all....Julie loved it too...otherwise she wouldn't have been with him....she could have refused, but she didn't did she....no matter what her regrets are today, she certainly never regretted it at the time...

[mertol22]

Hi Steve.  2 years is a long time to be in a relationship. Jeremy could have had any girl he wanted too, with his looks.  Julie her self was in love with this guy, she even quoted that he was  loving and romantic with her. This is hardly a man who didn't know how to love. He spent a great deal of money on her and she took it...she also took 25k form the New of the World. Was that not blood money?
Hello Patti i trust the storm brought no wet stuff, interesting that you say from a quote i think that JM saying if i cant have you ,no one can , hence her statement not before but after the shootings, i take no gloat from slating the legal system then and now what moron jury bought that.

Even after they broke up, he gives her £400 pounds, because the guy had promised to help her pay for an holiday, plus it was her 21st birthday. He could have been nasty and gave her nothing, but being kind hearted, he wanted to give it to her, so that she could away.  It was no pay off, I think he felt a lot about her...Not once did he slag her off in his statements or say anything nasty about her...

About the marriage that never was....if you read his statement it was his mother that had wanted them to get married....and because of that he did the opposite as Jeremy always did...If his mother hadn't have mentioned it all the time, Jeremy says he would have married Julie....

You say he used her....it works both ways Steve...maybe they used each other, or maybe they were just a couple in love....and her life changed when she found out he was seeing an old flame from the past....She was bitter, she placed a pillow over his face and she smacked him hard across the face....What does Jeremy do? He asks her why did she do that.....She said, and she admits saying it....If I can't have you, no one else can....When she hits him, she says he twisted her arm...well any other man, would have hit her back....He may have twisted her arm and pushed her back on the bed, but this was to stop her.....When she smashed the mirror, what does he do...he goes running to her for he thought she had hurt herself......Well, a man who has psychopathy would not do that...he wouldn't care, he wouldn't care if she went on holiday or not.....he wouldn't defend her mother.....he wouldn't cry like a baby when his dog got run over...would he? psychopaths have no feeling for animals....Anyway, I am babbling on......I suspect I know who you are, but I will keep quiet....Ha! 

I forgot to add, that June offered to buy Julie a flat. 

[maggie]

Hi Steve, I could say the same to you about who you think is responsible for the murders that took place that night.  One of the first lies Julie told was that M. Mcdonald had murdered them...and JB had paid him 2k.

I don't think he felt a sense of relief at all, that his family had been killed, I can't understand why anyone would think that..let alone say it...To me the lad was in shock, he did not want to believe it had happened.....he called Jones a hard bastard, when he asked him if he shot his family....he told Jones he did not want to hear things about what had happened to them, he also talked in the present tense, which psychologically means that he hadn't excepted that they were dead....Sometimes, when you lose loved ones, it does not hit you for a long while....

I lost both my parents together 7 years ago and I am now undergoing bereavement counselling 7 years on....It was difficult for me to grieve; every time I went to cry, I couldn't because of the pains in my head, so this caused me to stop grieving.  Not everyone grieves in the same way Steve....You can't judge a man because he sold some stuff after the funerals; he had to take control, not only the farm, but everything else....his mind must have been a wreck....valium and injections....drugs mixed with drink....this is how he grieved.......I will tell you this...if Jeremy had been found not guilty, he would have had hell of a fight on his hands regarding the wills and estate...just as much as there was a long drawn out legal battle when Jeremy was found guilty.....it was not to be straight forward for his extended family either.   

he had just lost his family and had funerals to pay for.  Don't forget his friends were at hand to help him all the way and to cheer him up....get him to go out and go on holiday.....The hotel in Amsterdam where Julie Brett and Jeremy stayed was a one bedroom affair....it wasn't the 5 star luxury that was reported in the press.....

I am not saying that Jeremy didn't like the high life at all....Julie loved it too...otherwise she wouldn't have been with him....she could have refused, but she didn't did she....no matter what her regrets are today, she certainly never regretted it at the time...

Well said Patti, really sensitive post.  It isn't a sin to enjoy the high life when you're 24, neither is it unusual for people suffering from severe trauma to behave in all sorts of strange ways.  Many people react by laughing when they learn their relative or close friend has died, it's a coping mechanism but Jeremy actually didn't laugh, he cried.  I would think it really wouldn't have mattered how he had behaved, the tabloid press etc were out to get him.

[mertol22]

JM saying if i cant have you no one can surely there is the link to the fate of jeremy , from a person who has sunk as low as you can get , with a life sentence for a love she cant have.

[Patti]

Mertol

No storm, thank goodness, the black cloud passed and is heading south....like the geese will be soon...lol

I've just had an apple and bit my lip.... 

Mertol I thought about that awful day all day yesterday, from the moment I woke up....Are you watching Dallas tonight? 

[Patti]

Well said Patti, really sensitive post.  It isn't a sin to enjoy the high life when you're 24, neither is it unusual for people suffering from severe trauma to behave in all sorts of strange ways.  Many people react by laughing when they learn their relative or close friend has died, it's a coping mechanism but Jeremy actually didn't laugh, he cried.  I would think it really wouldn't have mattered how he had behaved, the tabloid press etc were out to get him.

Hi maggie....the press had a field day, i would never believe what they write....their only goal is to sell newspapers. You are right maggie, do you also think men in particular handle death in a different way to women? Not a nice question...

[mertol22]

Mertol

No storm, thank goodness, the black cloud passed and is heading south....like the geese will be soon...lol

I've just had an apple and bit my lip.... 

Mertol I thought about that awful day all day yesterday, from the moment I woke up....Are you watching Dallas tonight? 

Hi patti, yes im watching Dallas about 9ish the 2 bottles of french bier will be chilled then, i also was thinking about yesterday, a year ago the very night i was driving at 2am on the A1  coming back from bedford, i was also thinking of colin caffell too, ive emailed jackie a little earlier im sure she also was thinking of that night, i even think of what JM was thinking .