Author Topic: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...  (Read 117534 times)

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Offline mike tesko

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #480 on: May 09, 2012, 09:28:PM »
How could Sheila be on the bed with this solitary wound to her neck, and then later be photographed on the bedroom floor with two wounds to her neck, and Jeremy Bamber be guilty of killing his sister and stage managing her body on the bedroom floor to try to make out that she had taken her own life?
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline ajross

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #481 on: May 09, 2012, 10:20:PM »
How could Sheila be on the bed with this solitary wound to her neck, and then later be photographed on the bedroom floor with two wounds to her neck, and Jeremy Bamber be guilty of killing his sister and stage managing her body on the bedroom floor to try to make out that she had taken her own life?
Have you had any joy getting hold of that other photo yet Mike? You said in another thread that you thought June fought with Ralph, where would that fit in with the sequence of events in your opinion, was Sheila ever a 'body' spotted in the kitchen? Or do you believe that when the police arrived on the scene with JB she was on the bed with a non-fatal gun shot wound?

Offline curiousessex

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #482 on: May 10, 2012, 12:16:AM »
I apologise for the condition of the edited photograph I am posting but for the purpose of giving everyone an idea of what the wound on Sheila's neck looks like, this brings the point home:-

Mike

In my opinion it would be a lot better if you were to post a copy of the alleged photograph as opposed to a mock up.

From the mock up it appears the single gun shot wound was not bleeding. Is this correct?

Offline mike tesko

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #483 on: May 10, 2012, 05:14:AM »
Mike

In my opinion it would be a lot better if you were to post a copy of the alleged photograph as opposed to a mock up.

From the mock up it appears the single gun shot wound was not bleeding. Is this correct?

In the mock up image which represents the single shot to the neck of Sheila on the bed, the single shot in question had stopped bleeding altogether, all that was left was the vertical trail beneath the entry wound as depicted (unedited) in the mock photograph.  If the two shots were inflicted to Sheila within moments of each other as alleged by the prosecutions case, how could the lower entry wound stop bleeding, and then start bleeding again, so that when it started bleeding again blood presumably ran in a different direction than it had originally, and parallel with the blood which ran from the second entry wound above? If you study the mock image which as I say shows how the solitary wound was upon Sheila's neck before the second wound was inflicted, you can see that blood which originally ran from the wound, had stopped running altogether, and dried. Since the direction of this blood trail is vertical Sheila must have been upright in position when it was inflicted to the right side of her neck, with the angle of the weapon at about a 45 degree angle when it was offered up into positioned to fire the shot...

This is in stark contrast to the characteristics of the second upper entry wound, which was inflicted with the weapon flush to the body so that the barrel of the gun ended up beneath the chin...

I believe that there are clear features present here, to enable us to make an accurate guess that the two wounds upon Sheila's neck were not inflicted within moments of each other, since blood which trailed from the first lower entry wound had managed to dry before the upper second wound was inflicted. Not only that but the angle at which each wound was inflicted is vastly different. For example, the upper fatal wound beneath the chin, was inflicted with the gun flush to the body and this is consistent with it going off accidentally through mishandling by the police. This mishandling came at a time when police were present inside the building, and the victims had already been pronounced as being dead by the police surgeon, Dr Craig. It must follow, that iof at 8:44am when Craig pronounced Sheila as being dead she only had a solitary wound to her neck, that the second shot must have been and was inflicted afterwards, and of course, prior to the taking control of the scene by SOC at 10am...

A lot happened inside whf between 8:44am and 10 am that morning which Essex police do not want anyone to know about, events which involved firearms officers carrying out a training exercise with the bodies still in situ. It was whilst these training exercises were being carried out inside whf between 8:44am and 10am, that the second shot was fired which injured and killed Sheila. What appears to have happened is that a loaded rifle was left atop Sheila's body and a member of the team which took part in the training exercise handled the weapon whilst it was on Sheila's body activating the trigger not thinking that anyone had checked and made it safe. It now turns out that one of the original members of the raid team which forced entry into the premises at around 7:30am (PS Woodcock) removed the rifle and made it safe at around 11.15am. If true no-one had previously checked to see if the gun was in a safe condition, unless you accept what DI Cook had to say about how the rifle in photograph 23 ended up to be leaning against the bedroom window? If what Cook says took place regarding how the rifle transmigrated from Sheila's body to the bedroom window is true, then what Woodcock says happened is not true. If the rifle was not made safe, or checked to see if it was still loaded until 11:15am, by Woodcock, then Cook has lied, or and he handled the rifle on Sheila's body at a time when it still could have been loaded. If Cooks version of events is true, did he shoot Sheila whilst in the process of moving her right hand and arm upon and around the gun? Did he shoot Sheila whilst removing the rifle from her body to stand it against the bedroom window?

Worse still...

If Cook removed the rifle from Sheila's body and placed it against the bedroom window, who put it back onto Sheila's body, in time for Woodcock to come along and make the rifle safe at 11:15am?

There is another twist...

According to PI Montgomery, he removed the rifle from Sheila's body and made it safe...

So, it begs the question, did Montgomery accidentally shoot Sheila whilst he was removing the rifle from atop Sheila's body?

One thing remains clear, and that is depending upon which version of events you choose to believe, the rifle was removed from Sheila's body on no less than three separate occasions, by Cook, Montgomery and Woodcock. All three were present at the scene when the training exercises took place and when Sheila was shot for the second time...

Finally...

as if to hit the nail on the head, so to speak, there was and is no mention of any member of the firearms team checking the rifle and making it safe during the initial entry into the premises. It appeares as though the rifle was left well alone by everuone concerned, and perhaps this was why Sheila ended up getting shot for the second time, long after she had already been pronounced as being dead by the police surgeon, Dr Craig at 8:44am...
« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 05:15:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Patti

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #484 on: May 10, 2012, 09:27:AM »
Hi Mike I am just reading Woodcock's statement. I am slightly confused where the white side meets the green side and the stairs?

He says upon breaking entry to the external door, was a door inside on the right leading into the kitchen, opposite that was a another door facing the black side and, along side this door was a set of stairs...Where do these stairs lead too? :)

So the back stairs door was closed according to Woodcock, these are the stairs we see in the pictures.

He also says the 12 bore was in the cupboard in the office. Not according to Bird's photo's it was it was cocked upon the wall....who moved that?

This bit re the office and the gun cupboard is important.....Because the so called moderator was found in that cupboard and there were no signs of blood on the floor or on the box or bag it was in and that door was bolted. :)
« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 09:35:AM by Patti »

Offline Patti

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #485 on: May 10, 2012, 09:43:AM »
I'm confused with this office door because it was bolted from the inside. No blood in this office, no trace of anyone that had been in a crime scene who must have had blood on them and their feet having been in that office where the moderator was found......

Have I got the right office, which is at the opposite side of the white side?

Why did I think it was the back stairs from the kitchen that led to the main bedroom??????? This is not so is it?

It was the stairs that we have in the archives that shows the gun leaning on the window....I'm so thick....lololol

« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 09:49:AM by Patti »

Offline Patti

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #486 on: May 10, 2012, 09:53:AM »
How can a dog get under the main bedroom bed? It looks like the bed was very close to the ground, except for a few inches...???

Offline Patti

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #487 on: May 10, 2012, 10:01:AM »
Hi Mike I am just reading Woodcock's statement. I am slightly confused where the white side meets the green side and the stairs?

He says upon breaking entry to the external door, was a door inside on the right leading into the kitchen, opposite that was a another door facing the black side and, along side this door was a set of stairs...Where do these stairs lead too? :)

So the back stairs door was closed according to Woodcock, these are the stairs we see in the pictures.

He also says the 12 bore was in the cupboard in the office. Not according to Bird's photo's it was it was cocked upon the wall....who moved that?

If the magazine in the gun was empty and no bullet left in the breech.  Then surely the magazine was not filled up to it's 10 capacity.

I think I'm talking to myself here...lol  I'd best stop before I'm escorted to the funny farm...:)

This bit re the office and the gun cupboard is important.....Because the so called moderator was found in that cupboard and there were no signs of blood on the floor or on the box or bag it was in and that door was bolted. :)

Woodcock says he made the gun safe at 11:10
« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 10:05:AM by Patti »

Offline Patti

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Offline Reader

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #489 on: May 10, 2012, 11:57:AM »
I am just reading Woodcock's statement. I am slightly confused where the white side meets the green side and the stairs?

He says upon breaking entry to the external door, was a door inside on the right leading into the kitchen, opposite that was a another door facing the black side and, along side this door was a set of stairs... Where do these stairs lead too? :)

This bit re the office and the gun cupboard is important..... Because the so called moderator was found in that cupboard and there were no signs of blood on the floor or on the box or bag it was in and that door was bolted. :)
The front of the house is denoted Red, and the side with the kitchen is denoted White. Opposite Red and White are Green and Black respectively. The statement of WPc Julia Jeapes seems to reference colours incorrectly.

On entry via the external door on the White side, there was a door to the kitchen on the right (Red) and a door (not bolted) to the room with the gun cupboard to the left (Green). Straight ahead, there was apparently visible a third external door (bolted) on Black side. The nearby staircase provides access to the upstairs office and a storeroom. The police couldn't go via that storeroom to the rest of the house, as the connecting door was secured on Red side. The main staircase (to the bedrooms) can be accessed from the front door (on Red side). The kitchen has a second door to a corridor that leads to the main staircase and front door. The kitchen also has doors to a room (on Black side) behind the kitchen (the pantry) and to a third staircase, which also provides access to the main first floor.

elphick

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #490 on: May 10, 2012, 12:21:PM »
Mike

In my opinion it would be a lot better if you were to post a copy of the alleged photograph as opposed to a mock up.


Since it's now been almost 3 weeks, I would have thought that providing a copy of the photograph, rather than this mock up would have been much more helpful. Hopefully the forum would be united in wanting this as a priority.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2012, 12:32:PM by elphick »

Offline haughton

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #491 on: May 10, 2012, 03:49:PM »
 I have read that a hacksaw blade was found at the scene by a relative sometime after the murders.
I am wondering why the EP didn't find it at the time, also, why was it left lying about!. If JB had used it to gain access to the house to commit the crime, would he have left it there?
Why was it left to the relatives to produce it along with the moderators ?

                      notice on the inside of the cubicle door of a public convenience

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Offline lookout

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #492 on: May 10, 2012, 03:56:PM »
I too read about that Haughton,and yes,how strange that the relatives seem to find what everyone else can't.!!!
Along with that, i also read about the fuss and palava over Sheila's knickers,as apparently,when she was found,she wasn't wearing any. They were soaking in a bucket,to which Anne Eaton took them back to her house.????? 

Offline Patti

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #493 on: May 10, 2012, 03:59:PM »
I have read that a hacksaw blade was found at the scene by a relative sometime after the murders.
I am wondering why the EP didn't find it at the time, also, why was it left lying about!. If JB had used it to gain access to the house to commit the crime, would he have left it there?
Why was it left to the relatives to produce it along with the moderators ?

                      notice on the inside of the cubicle door of a public convenience

                        BEWARE OF LIMBO DANCERS

Hi Haughton: I'read that too, but also that it was rusty? Did anyone do a test on that blade to see if it had been used? I doubt they just took everything the extended said and booked him...on their evidence alone.....

Would they be female or Male limbo dancers? lol :)

Offline Patti

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Re: How I Iost the photo` of Sheila on the Bed...
« Reply #494 on: May 10, 2012, 04:08:PM »
I too read about that Haughton,and yes,how strange that the relatives seem to find what everyone else can't.!!!
Along with that, i also read about the fuss and palava over Sheila's knickers,as apparently,when she was found,she wasn't wearing any. They were soaking in a bucket,to which Anne Eaton took them back to her house.?????

Interesting lookout. Why would someone who is contemplating on suicide put her knickers to soak, put a clean nightie on, yet no clean knickers, then shoot herself after she has shot her family?

It has been suggested that she showered to cleanse herself of her sins....? :)