Author Topic: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-  (Read 14986 times)

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chochokeira

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #45 on: September 28, 2011, 02:10:AM »
Then surely they would have shared certain traits? Abandonment, insecurity, disloyalty? Why did JB steal from the caravan park, knowing how much it would upset Ralph?


Jeremy was a rebel who was able to resist June's control, partly, I believe, because he was male and, as Colin said, had a strong sense of identification with his father. Though this wasn't without its problems. Nevill was a control freak too in his own way - for goodness sake, he would have turned Jeremy into the English equivalent of one of the 40 year old farm boys of County Clare if he'd had his way! You've said as much yourself, Shon'. Yet Nevill wasn't loopy. Identification with Nevill gave Jeremy a grounding in reality which Sheila could not and did not get from June.

Sheila's role model was her religious obsessive mother who had deep psychological issues of her own.

I think the theft from the caravan park was an understandable, subconscious attempt by Jeremy to assert his own independent identity. My son and daughter behaved in very similar ways. The limpet like suckers of smothering parents are only detached from their almost adult children by a very painful process, one which forces parents to dislike and reject their children for a time.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2011, 09:33:AM by chochokeira »

chochokeira

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #46 on: September 28, 2011, 02:14:AM »
Why did he keep, and spend the money? His Dad's money?

Already explained (above).

tyler

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #47 on: September 28, 2011, 09:15:AM »
Keira,I didnt think Neville had any interest in the caravan park.The shares were owned by June,Jeremy,Pamela and Ann? So in effect,Jeremy stole from himself when he burgled the caravan park?

Newbury1

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #48 on: September 28, 2011, 09:26:AM »
Choc / Shona +1 each for a well delivered and balanced debate  :-*

chochokeira

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #49 on: September 28, 2011, 09:34:AM »

Keira,I didnt think Neville had any interest in the caravan park.The shares were owned by June,Jeremy,Pamela and Ann? So in effect,Jeremy stole from himself when he burgled the caravan park?


Good point, Tyler.

Offline OnceSaid

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #50 on: September 28, 2011, 09:52:AM »
What is Colin inferring when he says that Nicholas has a L shape scar on his cheek above his jawline, and that Sheila had a scar on her right hand?

chochokeira

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #51 on: September 28, 2011, 09:57:AM »
Choc / Shona +1 each for a well delivered and balanced debate  :-*


Thank you Nick. Have one back. +1 too for Shona, Grahame, Tyler and Andea.

chochokeira

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #52 on: September 28, 2011, 09:58:AM »
Colin's statement of the 11th september makes no mention of any photos of Sheila at all.
He does make on mention of photographs and that being old ones of JB on a shooting party or similar to do with gun useage.
I do wonder as to whether Colin was keeping hush on the photos(slides of Sheila) he is supposed to have discussed with JB on the 7th of september at Sheila's flat.

Colin  seemed concerned that JB had cleared out stuff from Sheila's and had not waited for him. However Colin had gone off on holiday for 2 weeks only returning on the 6th september. It would have been unreasonable to expect JB to wait and not act  and refrain from doing anything at Sheila's flat as Colin was away for 2 weeks.
Colin only comes "home" as such for a week as he then reports going away again yet again on the 13th september.
Colin here seems unreasonable in regards to JB doing things that needed to be done.  Colin hardly seemed to be making any real effort even if it was unpleasant or due to grief over losing his sons.

So Colin is told of the slides and is even given one set of slides on the 7th of september...yet whatever concerns he had he failed to mention this at all in his statement several days later on the 11th september.

Good points, Smiffy +1

Offline OnceSaid

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #53 on: September 28, 2011, 10:00:AM »
The scar was on the child left cheek.  Now I have read it again he is probably only describing distinquishing marks, as he was not prepared to identity the bodies.

I'm suprised that he can not be 100% sure as to whether Sheila was right or left handed.

Much was made of JB going on holiday after the murders but yet nothing was said about Colin doing the same.

As for the photographs that Colin took of Sheila, I would expect them to be tasteful, even if they were in a state of undress.  If they were not I think I would change my views re Colin.

Offline smiffy

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #54 on: September 28, 2011, 10:08:AM »
So we have Colin having an affair when with Sheila.
Obviously that says something about his honesty and how much trust could be put into things he claimed in his statements.
In my view he has not been honest about the risque slides(photos) of Sheila and certainly not about how he claimed to have disposed of the said slides.

Knowing there was violence and infidelity in the relationship but that despite this Sheila still wanting to be with Colin does suggest Sheila had considerable self esteem issues. People like this (sometimes described as "doormats") are prone to accept behaviour that others would term intolerable and they tend to have a willingness to please their partner way beyond normal boundaries. Abusive partners may exploit this in various ways that may include  more extreme sexual practises even if they were uncomfortable or reluctant to try them. In 1985 taking risque or pornographic photographs was much harder for the individual  as it was prior to the digital camera age..remember polaroid cameras?
Someone such as Sheila with her low self esteem was much more open to be manipulated by persons wishing to take nude or pornographic photos of her than say an average female of the time would have been. However if she was uncomfortable with this it could well have played on her mind and contributed to her mental health issues.

Hartley

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #55 on: September 28, 2011, 10:18:AM »
Much was made of JB going on holiday after the murders but yet nothing was said about Colin doing the same.

Even though I believe him to be guilty, I think that's just something to stick the boot in after the fact. Had he not been convicted or even been a suspect then people wouldn't give it much thought, but because he was convicted it's a big sensational headline "Jeremy murders family, then jets off to live the high life".


Offline smiffy

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #56 on: September 28, 2011, 10:24:AM »
Choc's Sheila timeline has Colin taking nude photos of Sheila in 1974 when she was just 17 and Colin was 21.

Though this seems to not be a commercial thing (nude models would need to be at least 18) it would still ask questions about what its effects were on a naive and vulnerable Sheila. It could well have made it easier for others to exploit her years later in taking pornographic photos.
In fact such photos as Colin took , due to her age , would come under a pornographic label these days (dont know how law stood at the time). As he claims they were put onto slides this suggests no polaroid camera was used and that therefore by 21 he had sought out a suitable developing service which would handle such photos as many places would not have handled them. This seems to make what appears to be casually taken nude photographs to be a somewhat far less casual thing.

Offline Lilibet

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #57 on: September 28, 2011, 03:48:PM »
Bob,

I in no way meant to offend.
If I did, I'm very sorry.

Its just that the statement by Colin struck me as odd and I was looking for some insight on it. I admit my wording wasn't that great.
I did go back and edit my statement.

Lilibet

Offline Lilibet

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #58 on: September 28, 2011, 04:01:PM »
Because it sure don't say loving Mother to me.
You nasty minded person  :(


Lilibet's an overseas newbie, Bob, it would be good if we could show her what a respectful forum we can be, do you not think?

I hope that Lilibet has the time and passion to truly delve deeply into all aspects of this case.



I'm reading everything I can get my hands on.
 I'm open to any and all suggestions, sources and advice.
And I mean that from both sides.
Sometimes the best education (for myself) has come from others who have not held the same views as me. It forces me to educate myself.

 I can't get this case out of my mind.
I tried to forget it for a few months before joining this forum.
However, I'm first to admit I have a very long way to go.


**
Lilibet

Hartley

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Re: Colin Caffell - witness statements:-
« Reply #59 on: September 28, 2011, 04:38:PM »
I'm reading everything I can get my hands on.
 I'm open to any and all suggestions, sources and advice.
And I mean that from both sides.
Sometimes the best education (for myself) has come from others who have not held the same views as me. It forces me to educate myself.

 I can't get this case out of my mind.
I tried to forget it for a few months before joining this forum.
However, I'm first to admit I have a very long way to go.


**
Lilibet

Apologies if these have already been suggested, or you've already read through them, but the following are worth a look:

David Shaw's 'An Innocent Man'
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1268.0.html

The Dickinson Report
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1168.0.html#lastPost

The 2002 Appeal Judgement
http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Crim/2002/2912.html

The various witness statements contained in this thread:
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1119.0.html

Also there are various published books:
Scott Lomax (Jeremy Bamber ISBN0750950625)
Roger Wilkes (Mammoth Book of CSI ISBN1845294785) Only a small section, Blood Relations is better.
Roger Wilkes (Blood Relations ISBN0140242007)
Colin Caffell (In Search of Rainbows End ISBN0340617454)


I'm sure other people will be able to offer a few other suggestions.