why dident the boys wake up

[tyler]

I know it is going off topic a little,but something occured to me today.
We are always wondering why June,after being wounded,appeared to make her way round to the other side of the bed and back again.We always assume that she may have been trying to get to the twins room.Is it possible that June went around to Nevills side of the bed in an attempt to retrieve the shotgun that Nevill normally kept under his bed? The blood trail appears to stop at that very location.
Just a thought........

[clifford]

I dont see any reason why they would have woke up.  I dont see any reason why June or the kids would have heard any commotion downstairs, if Ralf and Sheila were down in the kitchen, there bedroom doors could have been closed and the kitchen door also closed.

Looking at it from a different angle IF there was a hitman I think out of all 3 adults SC would have been the one to put up a fight, I dont think for a minute that she would have complied, and would have fought for her life and that of her kids and family.

thats assuming they dident shoot her before she could.

No Nugnug, the only one that was capable of fighting was NB.

[OnceSaid]

I dont see any reason why they would have woke up.  I dont see any reason why June or the kids would have heard any commotion downstairs, if Ralf and Sheila were down in the kitchen, there bedroom doors could have been closed and the kitchen door also closed.

Looking at it from a different angle IF there was a hitman I think out of all 3 adults SC would have been the one to put up a fight, I dont think for a minute that she would have complied, and would have fought for her life and that of her kids and family.

But the truth is that the 2nd world war pilot was the only one to put up a fight.

Thats one of the reasons I dont think there was any hitman.

[nugnug]

well if sheila wasn't capable of fighting i don't see how anyone can have down as the killer.

[OnceSaid]

I dont see any reason why they would have woke up.  I dont see any reason why June or the kids would have heard any commotion downstairs, if Ralf and Sheila were down in the kitchen, there bedroom doors could have been closed and the kitchen door also closed.

Looking at it from a different angle IF there was a hitman I think out of all 3 adults SC would have been the one to put up a fight, I dont think for a minute that she would have complied, and would have fought for her life and that of her kids and family.

thats assuming they dident shoot her before she could.

Had she been shot in the back, stomache or head I may have considered that, however I dont think there was a hitman and if there was I doubt if he would have messed around trying to make it look like a suicide.

[nugnug]

I know it is going off topic a little,but something occured to me today.
We are always wondering why June,after being wounded,appeared to make her way round to the other side of the bed and back again.We always assume that she may have been trying to get to the twins room.Is it possible that June went around to Nevills side of the bed in an attempt to retrieve the shotgun that Nevill normally kept under his bed? The blood trail appears to stop at that very location.
Just a thought........

are so he kept a shotgun under the bed but he never thought of taking it downstairs with him.

[OnceSaid]

well if sheila wasn't capable of fighting i don't see how anyone can have down as the killer.

It is 2 completely different scenarious. 

One as a victim, one as the murderer.

[clifford]

I dont see any reason why they would have woke up.  I dont see any reason why June or the kids would have heard any commotion downstairs, if Ralf and Sheila were down in the kitchen, there bedroom doors could have been closed and the kitchen door also closed.

Looking at it from a different angle IF there was a hitman I think out of all 3 adults SC would have been the one to put up a fight, I dont think for a minute that she would have complied, and would have fought for her life and that of her kids and family.

thats assuming they dident shoot her before she could.

Had she been shot in the back, stomache or head I may have considered that, however I dont think there was a hitman and if there was I doubt if he would have messed around trying to make it look like a suicide.

Then what happened to the Pargeter BRNO rifle that jeremy listed to the police as part of the fire arms that were in WHF. Remembering of course that Pargeter said that his BRNO rifle was always kept in it's case. Trouble is the case wasd found at WHF.

[Alias]

Perhaps they were shot first - and perhaps they just slept through the commotion. Kids don´t wake up easily at night.
I am far from being a kid , but I can still sleep through almost anything - people can walk on me, I won´t wake up.
I once slept for two hours before waking up with a JACKHAMMER in the basement of our house. It had been at it for TWO HOURS before I woke up. When I did, I asked myself, how could I sleep through THIS noise?!
I don´t think it proves anything one way or the other that Daniel and Nicholas didn´t wake up.
Thank God they didn´t.

[mertol22]

This is quite a raw thread and there is really no way around it, i have to dismiss a hitman, because the shots would have been cleaner less messy with a hitman ralph would have not put up any fight he would be dead very quickly,
the twins were still infants 1 shot each would have been enough, im sure the twins were shot 1st, i can see Sheila scratching Ralph fighting for the gun back, i do not see Jeremy been there on that night how would he know who was up and their location in the house.And that opened bible.

[Alias]

This is quite a raw thread and there is really no way around it, i have to dismiss a hitman, because the shots would have been cleaner less messy with a hitman ralph would have not put up any fight he would be dead very quickly,
the twins were still infants 1 shot each would have been enough, im sure the twins were shot 1st, i can see Sheila scratching Ralph fighting for the gun back, i do not see Jeremy been there on that night how would he know who was up and their location in the house.And that opened bible.

You bring up an interesting point. What need was there for a hitman or Jeremy to shoot the twins three and five times each? None.
If Sheila did it, she was in essence performing an "exorcism", since she, in her bewildered mind, thought that they were possessed by the Devil. That would more logically explain all the shots to two little boys sleeping in their beds!

[Steve A]

I dont see any reason why they would have woke up.  I dont see any reason why June or the kids would have heard any commotion downstairs, if Ralf and Sheila were down in the kitchen, there bedroom doors could have been closed and the kitchen door also closed.

Looking at it from a different angle IF there was a hitman I think out of all 3 adults SC would have been the one to put up a fight, I dont think for a minute that she would have complied, and would have fought for her life and that of her kids and family.

thats assuming they dident shoot her before she could.

Had she been shot in the back, stomache or head I may have considered that, however I dont think there was a hitman and if there was I doubt if he would have messed around trying to make it look like a suicide.

Then what happened to the Pargeter BRNO rifle that jeremy listed to the police as part of the fire arms that were in WHF. Remembering of course that Pargeter said that his BRNO rifle was always kept in it's case. Trouble is the case wasd found at WHF.

Was the case found? Do you know where it's mentioned, or if it had an exhibit number assigned to it?

[chochokeira]

This is quite a raw thread and there is really no way around it, i have to dismiss a hitman, because the shots would have been cleaner less messy with a hitman ralph would have not put up any fight he would be dead very quickly,
the twins were still infants 1 shot each would have been enough, im sure the twins were shot 1st, i can see Sheila scratching Ralph fighting for the gun back, i do not see Jeremy been there on that night how would he know who was up and their location in the house.And that opened bible.

You bring up an interesting point. What need was there for a hitman or Jeremy to shoot the twins three and five times each? None.
If Sheila did it, she was in essence performing an "exorcism", since she, in her bewildered mind, thought that they were possessed by the Devil. That would more logically explain all the shots to two little boys sleeping in their beds!

Another excellent point, Abs. I believe it's well documented that when deranged mothers, or parents, kill their children they tend to do it in a ferocious manner, using far more violence than is necessary to kill.

[grahameb]

Where has Tyler gone?

[smiffy]

There seems to be no evidence Nevill put up a fight at all so it seems strange in the absence of evidence to suggest he put up a fight.
A fight would be a contest but going by no real fight injuries being seen on JB or Sheila then he was unable to land a single blow. There were no abrasions/scrapes or bruising it seems to his knuckles to suggest a fight took place. The assault upon Nevill was very one sided.

Looking at it sensibly ...Sheila plays up and Nevill is disturbed and gets up and goes down to the kitchen with Sheila to try calming her down etc...maybe having a cup of coffee each etc. Sheila gets more incensed and enraged and goes off on one throwing things around in the kitchen , tipping things over.
Nevill continues to try calming and restraining Sheila but she breaks free (possibly by gouging his right arm). Sheila goes and gets the rifle. Nevill is becoming worried by the escalating rage Sheila is in and decides to call JB for assistance. While he is on the phone Sheila swipes him hard with a rifle or stool , stunning Nevill and injuring him but catching him a bit unawares.  The attack proceeds and Nevill suffers more blows and is never able to defend himself properly after the first blow landed. 


One can understand Nevill not calling June to assist as June would probably have made things worse. Prior to the assualt, Nevill would not have wanted much noise and would be doing his best to keep things as quiet as possible. He would not want to disturb the boys or June and have them witness Sheila behaving as she was.


The bullet cases in the bedroom were placed there by police...or falsely claimed to be there to place the attack on Nevill in the bedroom as part of the cover up to support the false contention that Nevill did not phone JB when in fact he did.