Mindset of Jeremy Bamber, at time he was informed, that all his family was dead

[Adam]

Hello Maggie

I agree the hacksaw played no part in this case at all.  I do tend to think that maybe Caroline was right Jeremy was in the house and did not have the need to enter through a window making his exit would have been easy using a window just my thoughts as I am not really sure how he got in or out

Jeremy was not in the house. Or did he hide under the settee while June was doing the washing up ? But then how could he phone Julie ?

The Foakes's saw him drive off. The police passed him driving to WHF.

Jeremy testified he used the hacksaw to gain access through the bathroom window. After the massacre. Seems easier to just ask for the keys. The judge in his summing up asked whether he could have used it before the massacre. The hacksaw was part of the prosecution case. Saying it plays no part is just opinion.

[susan]

Hi suze, yes I agree that is a possibility and makes more sense than the window stuff.  Have always wondered about this but he had to take his car home so quite how it worked I'm not sure. Maybe someone else took his car home?

Maggie Caroline did suggest he took his own car home, phoned Julie and made it back on foot through the fields to collect the last trailer.  It is feasible but I know flaws exist in this as well.

[Adam]

Hi suze, yes I agree that is a possibility and makes more sense than the window stuff.  Have always wondered about this but he had to take his car home so quite how it worked I'm not sure. Maybe someone else took his car home?

I just chuckled. Who took his car home ?

[maggie]

Hi Adam

I have had dogs all my life and at the slightest noise in the dead of the night the dogs would have been alerted to that noise. Dogs have very sensitive ears. 

If a window latch was being filed, by an hacksaw blade it would have generated some sort of noise.

I feel positive that the dog outside would have been on his guard and would have barked first having heard footsteps around the outside of the farm house.

One has to remember that the windows had just been painted and were stiff to open, again this could have generated more noise.  The window evidence is clear that the outside and inside of the bathroom window was clean and that the window was locked from the inside.  After two intensive forensic examination of that window they found nothing to support that it had been used.

Once inside the house it would be very difficult not to have alerted Crispy.......

The other thing is that the main bedroom window was open, so if the black lab barked I feel sure Nevill and June would have heard it....but, if it was usual for the Lab to bark then I can imagine they would sleep through it and people do when a cock crows....

If it was Jeremy he could have easily gone upstairs during that evening and had a look where the children were sleeping and looked where Sheila things were.  He was fully aware of the layout of the house. Note that all lights were on, so I don't think any of the murders were done in the dark.

The main bedroom light was on, yet the officers that had arrived first reported that there was no lights on at the front of the house....A raid team officer is quite clear in his description that the main bedroom light was on.  One has to ask who put this light on for all the other reports only say that lights were on on the white side. 

Hi Patti, I agree we were told several lights were on, I was just going by Adams belief of complete darkness to argue his point.
It's hard to be sure if lights were switched on and off while Jeremy was outside with the police or whether various police had inaccurate memories as some would explain it
So many different scenarios can be suggested, only Scorpio knows all the answers

[Adam]

Hi Adam

I have had dogs all my life and at the slightest noise in the dead of the night the dogs would have been alerted to that noise. Dogs have very sensitive ears. 

If a window latch was being filed, by an hacksaw blade it would have generated some sort of noise.

I feel positive that the dog outside would have been on his guard and would have barked first having heard footsteps around the outside of the farm house.

One has to remember that the windows had just been painted and were stiff to open, again this could have generated more noise.  The window evidence is clear that the outside and inside of the bathroom window was clean and that the window was locked from the inside.  After two intensive forensic examination of that window they found nothing to support that it had been used.

Once inside the house it would be very difficult not to have alerted Crispy.......

The other thing is that the main bedroom window was open, so if the black lab barked I feel sure Nevill and June would have heard it....but, if it was usual for the Lab to bark then I can imagine they would sleep through it and people do when a cock crows....

If it was Jeremy he could have easily gone upstairs during that evening and had a look where the children were sleeping and looked where Sheila things were.  He was fully aware of the layout of the house. Note that all lights were on, so I don't think any of the murders were done in the dark.

The main bedroom light was on, yet the officers that had arrived first reported that there was no lights on at the front of the house....A raid team officer is quite clear in his description that the main bedroom light was on.  One has to ask who put this light on for all the other reports only say that lights were on on the white side. 

Yes the bathroom window was locked. Perhaps Jeremy shut it after he entered.

[Patti]

Yes the bathroom window was locked. Perhaps Jeremy shut it after he entered.

He did he admitted he did. 

[Adam]

Hi Patti, I agree we were told serious lights were on, I was just going by Adams belief of complete darkness to argue his point.
It's hard to be sure if lights were switched on and off while Jeremy was outside or whether various police had inaccurate memories.
So many different scenarios can be suggested, only Scorpio knows all the answers

Jeremy had two options -

Trust that everyone was inside WHF. He was there only four hours earlier when this was the case. Then go straight to the main bedroom.

Double check each room upon entrance.

In my view these could be done with the lights off or on. However lights may have been on anyway. People often leave lights on when going to bed.

[maggie]

I just chuckled. Who took his car home ?

I don't know!!  I'm not saying I believe it but all things are possible just a suggestion but you dontvthink outside the box, you just repeat, repeat unproven scenarios etc.
Would be great if you tried to discuss instead of just insisting you are always right.

[maggie]

Jeremy had two options -

Trust that everyone was inside WHF. He was there only four hours earlier when this was the case. Then go straight to the main bedroom.

Double check each room upon entrance.

In my view these could be done with the lights off or on. However lights may have been on anyway. People often leave lights on when going to bed.

There is no doubt lights were on all night as testified but exactly which lights and if the same lights were on all the time the police were outside cannot be proven because different police saw different lights on in hindsight.

[Adam]

I'm sorry I just can't see someone pretending to be Jeremy, driving his car home at 10pm. While Jeremy hid under the settee.

[Patti]

Hi Patti, I agree we were told several lights were on, I was just going by Adams belief of complete darkness to argue his point.
It's hard to be sure if lights were switched on and off while Jeremy was outside with the police or whether various police had inaccurate memories as some would explain it
So many different scenarios can be suggested, only Scorpio knows all the answers

Hi Maggie

I agree let Scip deal with it...I bet he is fast on. 

[susan]

I'm sorry I just can't see someone pretending to be Jeremy, driving his car home at 10pm. While Jeremy hid under the settee.

Adam where has this information come from why would he hide under the settee WHF was his home.

[Jan]

Thanks Scipio. He made a statement that Jeremy couldn't remember her surname when he telephoned Police initially. http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,5895.30.msg263145.html#msg263145

yes but they had been separated for ages so perhaps she went back to using her maiden name.

[nugnug]

I'm sorry I just can't see someone pretending to be Jeremy, driving his car home at 10pm. While Jeremy hid under the settee.

could elbrate on that one please adam.

[lookout]

yes but they had been separated for ages so perhaps she went back to using her maiden name.

I'd have said it's damned hard to remember anything when you're taken unawares.