A tale of two Cuckoos?

[grahameb]

So, Keira. Why are you bringing all this up about the Howies. What connection have they got with what happened at WHF?

[chochokeira]

So, Keira. Why are you bringing all this up about the Howies. What connection have they got with what happened at WHF?

Betty Howie played her part in the events of that period, didn't she? Was it Betty and her husband who stood bail for Jeremy - assuming that this claim is true? It was Betty who told AE that there was something very wrong at WHF on 7/8/85. I wasn't sure who Betty was, so I've been having a look at this.

Remember too that I'm researching the history and people of a number of the Blackwater estuary villages: Goldhanger, the Tolleshunts, the Tothams and Osea island, also neighbouring villages on Tiptree Heath -  Messing, Tiptree, Inworth and so on for a book that I'm writing. The stories of the old farming families of the district, not least because of their fascinating interconnections, are a rich resource for me.

It's all the more interesting to me too because my family and ancestors lived in these lovely little villagers for centuries.

[chochokeira]

So, Keira. Why are you bringing all this up about the Howies. What connection have they got with what happened at WHF?

There are so many unanswered questions to this case too, aren't there? I'm a great believer in looking at such puzzles from different angles.

[chochokeira]

Mike, you asked about Jeremy and Sheila's birth parents.

We know that Sheila’s natural mother was Christine Jay, the daughter of Canon Eric Jay, a one-time senior chaplain to the then Archbishop of Canterbury. Her father was an unknown cleric or theology student, someone of that sort.

For me, part of what's interesting about Sheila's parents is:

1. Sheila's father's identity seems to have remained a well kept secret. I imagine Sheila learned who he was when she met her birth mother for the first time shortly before her death? Yet little or nothing ever seems to have leaked out about him. I wonder why? Was he considered a bad chapter that was best kept firmly shut? Or was this to protect him and his reputation? There are lots of unanswered questions about thsi man. Was his name on Sheila's birth certificate - was he even aware of her birth, let alone her death? Did her attend her funeral? A number of people let poor Sheila down, was her birth father one of them?

2. Sheila's maternal grandfather, Cannon Eric George Jay, was the son of a hosiery assistant who lived in Tiptree. Eric was born in Tiptree in 1907 and lived just 10 minutes drive from WHF where Sheila died. I wonder did he know the Bambers and religion obsessed June in particular? Did he know of Sheila's death and did he attend her funeral?

3. Sheila was adopted anonymously via the children's society yet, there's her grandfather, born and living just up the road from the Bambers. Sheila was also born in Gloucester, where Robert Woodiwis Boutflour lived and worked and where Nevill had been a student.

it's a small world, isn't it?

[grahameb]

It seems also that Jeremy was let down by those who should have been there for him, including his own father who apparently preferred to believe the family'd version of events before Jeremy's? I would endeavour never to let my sons down, but will stand by them whatever they might do.

[H]

It seems also that Jeremy was let down by those who should have been there for him, including his own father who apparently preferred to believe the family'd version of events before Jeremy's? I would endeavour never to let my sons down, but will stand by them whatever they might do.

Would you hand them into the police if they were rioting in London? I know I wouldn't (I'd deal with them myself), but that seems to be what is happening. 

With regards to JB's biological parents, it seems to me (my opinion only here) that they are more interested in how they are perceived by other people than anything else, they probably have the view that even JB being accused would shed them in a bad light and damage their perceived reputation. Washing their hands of him is the only thing they were ever going to do as they had done previously.

[grahameb]

It seems also that Jeremy was let down by those who should have been there for him, including his own father who apparently preferred to believe the family's version of events before Jeremy's? I would endeavour never to let my sons down, but will stand by them whatever they might do.

Would you hand them into the police if they were rioting in London? I know I wouldn't (I'd deal with them myself), but that seems to be what is happening. 

With regards to JB's biological parents, it seems to me (my opinion only here) that they are more interested in how they are perceived by other people than anything else, they probably have the view that even JB being accused would shed them in a bad light and damage their perceived reputation. Washing their hands of him is the only thing they were ever going to do as they had done previously.

One thing is for sure they gave them up when they were born. I should think by judging a woman's nature in general that it was probably a lot more difficult for the women to give up their son/daughter than it was for the fathers, who seemed more concerned with their reputations and carears than their offspring?

[HMEssex]

It seems also that Jeremy was let down by those who should have been there for him, including his own father who apparently preferred to believe the family's version of events before Jeremy's? I would endeavour never to let my sons down, but will stand by them whatever they might do.

Would you hand them into the police if they were rioting in London? I know I wouldn't (I'd deal with them myself), but that seems to be what is happening. 

With regards to JB's biological parents, it seems to me (my opinion only here) that they are more interested in how they are perceived by other people than anything else, they probably have the view that even JB being accused would shed them in a bad light and damage their perceived reputation. Washing their hands of him is the only thing they were ever going to do as they had done previously.

One thing is for sure they gave them up when they were born. I should think by judging a woman's nature in general that it was probably a lot more difficult for the women to give up their son/daughter than it was for the fathers, who seemed more concerned with their reputations and carears than their offspring?

Especially in the 1950s - just think of all those babies who were adopted - the women would have had  little or no say in the matter.

[tyler]

I agree with Hartley.Im sure that the Howies did live in one of the cottages attached to the whf at the time of the murders.I think you will find also,that Betty Howies husband worked alongside Nevill at the farm for years too?

[Roch]

Hartley...

With regards to JB's biological parents, it seems to me (my opinion only here) that they are more interested in how they are perceived by other people than anything else, they probably have the view that even JB being accused would shed them in a bad light and damage their perceived reputation. Washing their hands of him is the only thing they were ever going to do as they had done previously.

My thoughts exactly.

[chochokeira]

It seems also that Jeremy was let down by those who should have been there for him, including his own father who apparently preferred to believe the family'd version of events before Jeremy's? I would endeavour never to let my sons down, but will stand by them whatever they might do.

Would you hand them into the police if they were rioting in London? I know I wouldn't (I'd deal with them myself), but that seems to be what is happening. 

With regards to JB's biological parents, it seems to me (my opinion only here) that they are more interested in how they are perceived by other people than anything else, they probably have the view that even JB being accused would shed them in a bad light and damage their perceived reputation. Washing their hands of him is the only thing they were ever going to do as they had done previously.

I think that's very true.

[chochokeira]

I agree with Hartley.Im sure that the Howies did live in one of the cottages attached to the whf at the time of the murders.I think you will find also,that Betty Howies husband worked alongside Nevill at the farm for years too?

Interesting, Tyler. Did you ever meet them? Also, do you know if Betty's husand was Thomas Lambie Howie, as appears to be the case? I have TL Howie at Wickes Manor Farm, Tolleshunt Major in 1980 on the telephone directory for that year. So assuming these are all the same person/people - and we're speaking of a rare name in very small villages, so I think that's likely - then they would have lived at WHF some time after 1980. Does all of that fit the knowledge you have of them?

[chochokeira]

The following is from the ships' passenger lists for 1957, the year of Sheila's birth.

Name: Eric G Jay
Date of Birth: 1 Mar 1907
Age: 50
Address: Lambeth Palace, London SE1
Profession: Clerk in holy orders
Country of intended future permanent residence: England
Port of Departure: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Date of Arrival: 20 Sep 1957
Port of Arrival: Liverpool, England
Ports of Voyage: Montreal
Ship Name: Carinthia
Shipping Line: Cunard Steamship Company Ltd
Official Number: 1963/01

Eric Jay was travelling alone, without his family.

I can't find Sheila's birth date, but believe it may have been prior to her grandfather's return.

[andrea]

the only member of sheilas natural family to attend her funeral was her uncle peter jay, so her natural father must have known sheila existed, im assuming because of the jay name. Peter must have been his brother, obviously.

[HMEssex]

the only member of sheilas natural family to attend her funeral was her uncle peter jay, so her natural father must have known sheila existed, im assuming because of the jay name. Peter must have been his brother, obviously.

Wouldn't that have been Christine's brother (Sheila's mother), as her name was Jay?