Channel 5 documentary 8th June 9.00 pm - 10.30 pm

[Steve_uk]

The soc evidence supports NB leaving the phone on the counter and and going upstairs where he sustained his facial gunshot wounds with SC in the bedroom having shot June.  Presumably NB heard the sound of gunshot and/or June calling out.  Not a long distance between the kitchen and main bedroom. 

We have to go on what the soc evidence tells us.  NB was in the kitchen, making the tel call to JB, and June was evidently lying in bed.

I doubt any cries from the master bedroom would have been heard from the kitchen. June was shot in bed, pinned to the pillow, so how much noise would emanated from her is debatable. As for Nevill, conveniently there is no telephone upstairs, and also conveniently for the Defence no blood on the kitchen telephone.

[Adam]

I doubt any cries from the master bedroom would have been heard from the kitchen. June was shot in bed, pinned to the pillow, so how much noise would emanated from her is debatable. As for Nevill, conveniently there is no telephone upstairs, and also conveniently for the Defence no blood on the kitchen telephone.

But CC says the SOC evidence shows Sheila is the killer.

[Steve_uk]

But CC says the SOC evidence shows Sheila is the killer.

Yes, but has she published any of it in detail?

[Cambridgecutie]

Yes, but has she published any of it in detail?

We have been over it numerous times.  Gun crime, especially one involving 25/26 gunshots, creates a mountain of data which can be reconstructed to locate the position of the victim and perpertrator at the point the perpertrator discharges the firearm and the victim sustains their gunshot wound.  The totality of this data: blood stains on flooring, casings, distance of shots, trajectories and wound tracks.  In this case it has not been reconstructed by experts.  I have put together my own reconstruction and it shows a very different picture to the one painted at trial.

This in and of itself is unlikely to be strong enough for a referral to CoA but it is certainly a very strong point and is the type of evidence that needs pursuing.  But instead we are getting a lot of stuff that is not even capable of getting off the starting blocks let alone passing through the CCRC and onto the CoA. 

[Rob_]

I doubt any cries from the master bedroom would have been heard from the kitchen. June was shot in bed, pinned to the pillow, so how much noise would emanated from her is debatable. As for Nevill, conveniently there is no telephone upstairs, and also conveniently for the Defence no blood on the kitchen telephone.

June made it out of bed round to Nevil's side and back so we can safely assume she would have been screaming the house down!

there is no blood on the telephone as no shots had yet been fired when he called JB.

[Steve_uk]

June made it out of bed round to Nevil's side and back so we can safely assume she would have been screaming the house down!

there is no blood on the telephone as no shots had yet been fired when he called JB.

But there are finger marks in blood on the blue and white chequered worktop. It suggests to me that the telephone in the kitchen wasn't in situ during the perpetration of the crime.

[Rob_]

But there are finger marks in blood on the blue and white chequered worktop. It suggests to me that the telephone in the kitchen wasn't in situ during the perpetration of the crime.

Yes maybe Steve, or a copper wiped it before stupidly dialing out. Though not sure which phone was used?

[Steve_uk]

Yes maybe Steve, or a copper wiped it before stupidly dialing out. Though not sure which phone was used?

The whole scene was staged by Jeremy, with the tipping out of the ammunition onto the blue and white chequered table, the amount of bullets left not matching with his subsequent story. In any case, with Pamela's call being taken in the kitchen due to the absence of the telephone in the master bedroom June would have cleared the bullets away with the twins being in residence ready for breakfast the following day.

[Adam]

June made it out of bed round to Nevil's side and back so we can safely assume she would have been screaming the house down!

there is no blood on the telephone as no shots had yet been fired when he called JB.

So that's why the twins remained sleeping.

[Cambridgecutie]

So that's why the twins remained sleeping.

It is a scientific fact that children, 6 yoa, sleep long and deeply.

[Adam]

It is a scientific fact that children, 6 yoa, sleep long and deeply.

Seems everyone was sleeping 'like a log' that night. Except Nevill and Sheila. Who were both bare footed in the kitchen.

[Cambridgecutie]

Seems everyone was sleeping 'like a log' that night. Except Nevill and Sheila. Who were both bare footed in the kitchen.

Well we don't know that June was sleeping 'like a log' only that she way lying flat in bed when she sustained her initial gunshot wounds.

[Zoso]

I am not talking about a 999 call I am simply saying there is a difference between a phone being "engaged" and a "phone being off the hook"

So please don't post misinformation that suits your point of view.

You seem to imply they are one and the same thing they are not.

If the phone has not been put back on the cradle - it is the SAME as engaged! Also, for a person calling, they would have no clue whether it was engaged or off the hook. I'm not sure what point you're 'trying' to make, other than to create an argument that isn't even relevant to the case or the 999 call? I'm happy to argue or discuss the case - makes no odds to me but make it clear what you prefer?

[Adam]

Well we don't know that June was sleeping 'like a log' only that she way lying flat in bed when she sustained her initial gunshot wounds.

It's lucky Jeremy had switched his AM off. He was sleeping 'like a log' & would have remained so if the AM took Nevill's call after a few rings.

[Cambridgecutie]

It's lucky Jeremy had switched his AM off. He was sleeping 'like a log' & would have remained so if the AM took Nevill's call after a few rings.

I am not getting sucked into your mad world of answering machines.  There's no evidence JB had one at Bourtree PRE 7th Aug.