US-Israel Attacks Iran

[Bubo bubo]

Well Marco Rubio says its a case of wiping out the current Iranian regime before they can develop nuclear weapons, Bubo! he says it would be impossible to stop them if this was to happen, I mean, there is no doubt that Iran is funding terrorist groups and terrorist attacks all over the world at the moment. Can such a regime be left to develop long range nuclear weapons in future?
Anyway,I saw a good post on Twitter today, someone pointed out that if the Iranian people were against the war why haven't the government re-connected the internet to show this?

That does not equate to an imminent threat and therefore create a licence to instigate an unprovoked attack. Trump said he was doing what earlier presidents failed to do. However they could see the turmoil and lives to be lost of innocent subjects and went for containment. An agreement and monitoring system was in place until Trump tore it up during his first term. Iran also faced and still does face wide ranging sanctions.

I think he was over confident following the Maduro kidnap and was egged on by Netanyahu who has had more sessions in the Whitehouse than any other leader.

[snow66!]

That does not equate to an imminent threat and therefore create a licence to instigate an unprovoked attack. Trump said he was doing what earlier presidents failed to do. However they could see the turmoil and lives to be lost of innocent subjects and went for containment. An agreement and monitoring system was in place until Trump tore it up during his first term. Iran also faced and still does face wide ranging sanctions.

I think he was over confident following the Maduro kidnap and was egged on by Netanyahu who has had more sessions in the Whitehouse than any other leader.

OK, thanks, Bubo! Lets see what unfolds in the coming weeks or months!
Anyway, what about the Iranian people being oppressed and murdered, can that be legal grounds to start a war?

[David1819]

Aftermath of U.S. or Israeli strikes on another artillery ammunition depot near Isfahan, Iran.


https://iran.liveuamap.com/en/2026/1-april-19-aftermath-of-us-or-israeli-strikes-on-another

[gringo]

OK, thanks, Bubo! Lets see what unfolds in the coming weeks or months!
Anyway, what about the Iranian people being oppressed and murdered, can that be legal grounds to start a war?

    From Wiki below on Gaza;

"As of 21 February 2026, at least 75,227 people (73,188+ Palestinians[4] and 2,039+ Israelis)[7][8][9][10] have been reported killed in the Gaza war according to the Gaza Health Ministry (GHM) and Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, including 248 journalists and media workers,[11] 120 academics,[12] and over 224 humanitarian aid workers, a number that includes 179 employees of UNRWA.[13] Scholars have estimated 80% of Palestinians killed were civilians.[6][5][14] A study by OHCHR, which verified fatalities from three independent sources, found that 70% of the Palestinians killed in residential buildings or similar housing were women and children.[15][16]


     Take in the above, snow. Those deaths are a minimum number and all verified. There are still an unknown and untold number under rubble. Hospitals, water infrastructure, aid have all been deliberately targeted. The numbers above are also according to Israeli Ministry of Affairs. Yet genocide is denied by those who currently believe that Iran have murdered 30,000/50,000 (the number changes daily) protesters in a matter of days. All of the Gaza victims are verified with names, video and evidence. All of these clear Israeli crimes are documented and verified.
     Where are the names and pictures of the 60,000/70,000 Iranians "murdered by their own regime"? There are none, on account of the story being evidence free propaganda designed to fool those who lack the intellectual curiosity to ask tough questions into supporting illegal wars of aggression. David, Steve and yourself are examples of the success of this propaganda.
      You could do with learning a little about, at least, the recent history of Iran. From the start of the 20th century is enough to inform you of the real reasons for the current western aggression against them. Nuclear weapons and "oppressive theocratic regime" is just propaganda to keep the incurious onside.
        An easily checkable factual comparison for you which should at least trigger some further questioning, snow. In 1979, the year of the revolution and overthrowing of the oppressive and brutal western imposed regime of Shah Reza Pahlavi, literacy rates in Iran were just 37% for all Iranians over 15. The discrepancies between male (48%) and female (24%) were huge. The Islamic government have made education a mainstay of the revolution. Literacy is effectively universal now and Iran also now ranks 5th worldwide in STEM graduates (335,000 annually), 70% of those STEM graduates are women.
       Only one in four women could read under the regime that westerners want to re-impose on Iran, for women's freedom, you understand  The "regime" they want to overthrow has achieved full literacy and is churning out highly educated females in world beating numbers. No matter your opinion or beliefs, the above are facts. You can ignore them and carry on in your half informed ignorance, but they are still facts and they clash with your world view. Opinions should follow facts, otherwise it is not opinion, just knee jerk bigotry.

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SE.ADT.LITR.FE.ZS?locations=IR

[gringo]

There are other factors beyond national boundaries. Blood ties are strong in the region and many of these nation states were set up by the west after the fall of the Ottoman empire. Here are a few. Kurds, Arabs, Berbers, Jordanians, Persians, Palestinians etc etc. This process was also used in Africa where tribes were split between different countries. Whilst not being a major source of all wars they frequently provide an undercurrent to hostilities. Look at the breakup of Yugoslavia. We are where we are and if nations cannot live together in peace such shocks will continue in the future. India Pakistan the lists go on. Armenia Azerbaijan. Our fore fathers have a lot to answer for in the way the past colonisations were distributed.

Despite this there was no good reason to unleash a war against Iran and no evidence to suggest this was necessary. It is illegal and war crimes have been committed

   All of the above is ignored through ignorance by Steve, David and Snow. Their whole world view ignores huge chunks of history and context.

[snow66!]

    From Wiki below on Gaza;

"As of 21 February 2026, at least 75,227 people (73,188+ Palestinians[4] and 2,039+ Israelis)[7][8][9][10] have been reported killed in the Gaza war according to the Gaza Health Ministry (GHM) and Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, including 248 journalists and media workers,[11] 120 academics,[12] and over 224 humanitarian aid workers, a number that includes 179 employees of UNRWA.[13] Scholars have estimated 80% of Palestinians killed were civilians.[6][5][14] A study by OHCHR, which verified fatalities from three independent sources, found that 70% of the Palestinians killed in residential buildings or similar housing were women and children.[15][16]


     Take in the above, snow. Those deaths are a minimum number and all verified. There are still an unknown and untold number under rubble. Hospitals, water infrastructure, aid have all been deliberately targeted. The numbers above are also according to Israeli Ministry of Affairs. Yet genocide is denied by those who currently believe that Iran have murdered 30,000/50,000 (the number changes daily) protesters in a matter of days. All of the Gaza victims are verified with names, video and evidence. All of these clear Israeli crimes are documented and verified.
     Where are the names and pictures of the 60,000/70,000 Iranians "murdered by their own regime"? There are none, on account of the story being evidence free propaganda designed to fool those who lack the intellectual curiosity to ask tough questions into supporting illegal wars of aggression. David, Steve and yourself are examples of the success of this propaganda.
      You could do with learning a little about, at least, the recent history of Iran. From the start of the 20th century is enough to inform you of the real reasons for the current western aggression against them. Nuclear weapons and "oppressive theocratic regime" is just propaganda to keep the incurious onside.
        An easily checkable factual comparison for you which should at least trigger some further questioning, snow. In 1979, the year of the revolution and overthrowing of the oppressive and brutal western imposed regime of Shah Reza Pahlavi, literacy rates in Iran were just 37% for all Iranians over 15. The discrepancies between male (48%) and female (24%) were huge. The Islamic government have made education a mainstay of the revolution. Literacy is effectively universal now and Iran also now ranks 5th worldwide in STEM graduates (335,000 annually), 70% of those STEM graduates are women.
       Only one in four women could read under the regime that westerners want to re-impose on Iran, for women's freedom, you understand  The "regime" they want to overthrow has achieved full literacy and is churning out highly educated females in world beating numbers. No matter your opinion or beliefs, the above are facts. You can ignore them and carry on in your half informed ignorance, but they are still facts and they clash with your world view. Opinions should follow facts, otherwise it is not opinion, just knee jerk bigotry.

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SE.ADT.LITR.FE.ZS?locations=IR

OK, thanks, gringo! I will do some more research about the history of Israel and Iran before commenting further!

[David1819]

Trumps latest post.

[gringo]

Aftermath of U.S. or Israeli strikes on another artillery ammunition depot near Isfahan, Iran.


https://iran.liveuamap.com/en/2026/1-april-19-aftermath-of-us-or-israeli-strikes-on-another

    A destroyed AWACS at Prince Sultan Base

https://x.com/DD_Geopolitics/status/2038067588752867634

      Satellite imagery of destroyed US bases

https://x.com/Krieg2026/status/2039441615736184976

      Do you understand the significance of strategic depth? Iran have lots of strategic depth and the US in their destroyed and vulnerable bases don't. Iran can take and survive way more damage than the US middle eastern bases and Israel.

[gringo]

OK, thanks, gringo! I will do some more research about the history of Israel and Iran before commenting further!

    https://www.palquest.org/

     Above is a link to an interactive encyclopaedia of Palestine/Israel. It is excellent and gives a comprehensive time line of events, snow. It gives much to research further also as you see fit. In terms of Iran. Western meddling in Iran goes back to the beginning of 20th century in its current manifestation. Oil was discovered in commercial quantities in Iran in 1908. It was this that led to creation of the Anglo Persian Oil Company (APOC) later to become BP (British Petroleum).
      To keep it as brief as possible, 1953 is a good starting point with this earlier knowledge in mind. In 1951 Iran elected as Prime Minister, the socialist Mohammed Mossadegh who nationalised the Iranian oil industry. This led to a coup by US CIA and UK MI6 in 1953 to overthrow the democratically elected Mossadegh and restore Pahlavi as an absolute monarch. The infamous SAVAK (secret police) quashed all opposition in brutal ways. Mossadegh remained under house arrest after a prison sentence until his death in 1967. He remained and remains a national hero in Iran until today. The 1979 revolution didn't happen in a vacuum. Arguably the reason the Islamists rather than socialists took over after the popular revolution against the Shah and his Savak was because the left parties and political groups were brutally dealt with by the Savak being seen as more dangerous to the capitalists behind the Shah than a bunch of Islamist Imams and the Ayatollah. The left had been utterly splintered and destroyed by the Savak. Consequently the Islamists were more organised and prepared. Ironically the Islamic Government fully re-nationalised the oil and gas industry anyway. Turns out the Ayatollahs have overlaps with socialism.
      This leads you, snow, to the 1980-88 western funded and supported war against Iran by Saddam Hussein's Iraq. Iraqi forces as is well known by now, used western supplied chemical weapons against the Iranians killing and injuring tens of thousands, including Prof.Mohammed Marandi. Iran did not use chemical weapons back but insteaad the Ayatollah issued a fatwa against the development or use of chemical/biological/nuclear weapons as un-Islamic. The western countries who supplied the chemical weapons and targeting later hypocritically used these justifications to overthrow Hussein. Their own role as co-conspirators conveniently ignored.
      Since then sanctions have been the preferred tool but the end game remains the same. The reason for invading/regime changing Iran is to recover "BP's oil" from those Iranians who happen to be sitting on it. Nuclear weapons, killing their own people, 50,000, 80,000 , women's rights, they're gonna get a nuke in two months/two weeks blah blah is bullshit noise to convince the uninformed proles that their illegal war for bankers and corporate interests is somehow justified.

[snow66!]

    https://www.palquest.org/

     Above is a link to an interactive encyclopaedia of Palestine/Israel. It is excellent and gives a comprehensive time line of events, snow. It gives much to research further also as you see fit. In terms of Iran. Western meddling in Iran goes back to the beginning of 20th century in its current manifestation. Oil was discovered in commercial quantities in Iran in 1908. It was this that led to creation of the Anglo Persian Oil Company (APOC) later to become BP (British Petroleum).
      To keep it as brief as possible, 1953 is a good starting point with this earlier knowledge in mind. In 1951 Iran elected as Prime Minister, the socialist Mohammed Mossadegh who nationalised the Iranian oil industry. This led to a coup by US CIA and UK MI6 in 1953 to overthrow the democratically elected Mossadegh and restore Pahlavi as an absolute monarch. The infamous SAVAK (secret police) quashed all opposition in brutal ways. Mossadegh remained under house arrest after a prison sentence until his death in 1967. He remained and remains a national hero in Iran until today. The 1979 revolution didn't happen in a vacuum. Arguably the reason the Islamists rather than socialists took over after the popular revolution against the Shah and his Savak was because the left parties and political groups were brutally dealt with by the Savak being seen as more dangerous to the capitalists behind the Shah than a bunch of Islamist Imams and the Ayatollah. The left had been utterly splintered and destroyed by the Savak. Consequently the Islamists were more organised and prepared. Ironically the Islamic Government fully re-nationalised the oil and gas industry anyway. Turns out the Ayatollahs have overlaps with socialism.
      This leads you, snow, to the 1980-88 western funded and supported war against Iran by Saddam Hussein's Iraq. Iraqi forces as is well known by now, used western supplied chemical weapons against the Iranians killing and injuring tens of thousands, including Prof.Mohammed Marandi. Iran did not use chemical weapons back but insteaad the Ayatollah issued a fatwa against the development or use of chemical/biological/nuclear weapons as un-Islamic. The western countries who supplied the chemical weapons and targeting later hypocritically used these justifications to overthrow Hussein. Their own role as co-conspirators conveniently ignored.
      Since then sanctions have been the preferred tool but the end game remains the same. The reason for invading/regime changing Iran is to recover "BP's oil" from those Iranians who happen to be sitting on it. Nuclear weapons, killing their own people, 50,000, 80,000 , women's rights, they're gonna get a nuke in two months/two weeks blah blah is bullshit noise to convince the uninformed proles that their illegal war for bankers and corporate interests is somehow justified.

Thanks, gringo!
Shame on Trump and the likes of Rubio if they are lying to us all!
I will read more from your encyclopedia link!

[gringo]

Thanks, gringo!
Shame on Trump and the likes of Rubio if they are lying to us all!
I will read more from your encyclopedia link!

   You're welcome. Enjoy your reading snow.

[snow66!]

   You're welcome. Enjoy your reading snow.

Will do, gringo! will do!

[David1819]

Trump said he was doing what earlier presidents failed to do.

This is an interesting interview from 1987

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNfrz3gO8KE

[David1819]

    A destroyed AWACS at Prince Sultan Base

https://x.com/DD_Geopolitics/status/2038067588752867634

      Satellite imagery of destroyed US bases

https://x.com/Krieg2026/status/2039441615736184976

      Do you understand the significance of strategic depth? Iran have lots of strategic depth and the US in their destroyed and vulnerable bases don't. Iran can take and survive way more damage than the US middle eastern bases and Israel.

A single hanger being destroyed does not equate to a "destroyed base" 

Its nothing compared to what has been destroyed in Iran

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74Hg4AYjsJQ

Its happened before, and its effect on the overall campaign has been nil

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_strikes_on_Saudi_Arabia

[gringo]

A single hanger being destroyed does not equate to a "destroyed base" 

Its nothing compared to what has been destroyed in Iran

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74Hg4AYjsJQ

Its happened before, and its effect on the overall campaign has been nil

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_strikes_on_Saudi_Arabia

    13 bases have been made uninhabitable according to even the New York Times. You sound like the Black Knight in Monty Python's Holy Grail after having all four limbs removed, "Tis but a scratch".