New Yorker podcast

[Hardy Boy]

It's woodcock's statement of 20/09/85 Bubo it may be innocent but looks strange to me? 

Look at the "g" for example.

Yes you got this from Mike.   Could be innocent like you said, that page could have been rewritten after and because Woodcock was happy about something on there, I know I’ve done lots of Statements for Accidents in the mine, it never comes back with what or how you said it anyway?

[Cambridgecutie]

It's strange Steve Taff was regarded as a excellent detective with some officers who worked with him unhappy at how he was portrayed and made to be a scapegoat.

He must have been pretty certain it was murder suicide. 

DCI Jones was one of the last to arrive at SOC.  Chief Sup Harris, along with police surgeon Dr Craig, had already concluded murder/suicide This was before DCI Jones arrived and obviously before he checked all the windows and found them secured from within.

[Cambridgecutie]

Changes  was made to policing after the Bamber case…….issues with police handling of the Jeremy Bamber case led to an official review and the introduction of tightened national procedures for major investigations and crime scene preservation.
The initial police investigation into the 1985 White House Farm murders, where five members of the Bamber family were killed, was widely criticized for a "bungled" approach and significant errors, primarily because the scene was initially treated as a MURDER SUICIDE and not secured as a potential murder scene.
Key problems identified included:
The senior investigating officer (TAFF) wrongly concluding it was a murder-suicide, which meant normal murder case procedures were not followed.

Following a report on the investigation, the Home Secretary ordered a review of police procedures, and Her Majesty's Chief Inspector of Constabulary conducted a separate review, resulting in 18 recommendations for the police service and reinforcing standard procedures for managing major inquiries. These steps led to improved protocols for handling evidence and securing crime scenes.

When Taff told and briefed Cook it was suicide and gave him the run down of Bambers phone call from his Father, he was already relying and bought into Bamber’s account that Sheila had “gone crazy with a gun.” Having accepted that and what Bamber had told them, This acceptance obviously shows with his brief twenty five minute cameo visit and this then filtered down to those under his command. 

It should be obvious to anyone with half a brain the investigation was seriously lacking,   a multiple homicide/murder of this scale should never be approached with tunnel vision, its basic Management progress and the thing I was taught in the mines, tunnel vision is replaced with funnel vision!

DCI Jones was one of the last to arrive at SOC.  Chief Sup Harris, along with police surgeon Dr Craig, had already concluded murder/suicide This was before DCI Jones arrived and obviously before he checked all the windows and found them secured from within.

[Hardy Boy]

DCI Jones was one of the last to arrive at SOC.  Chief Sup Harris, along with police surgeon Dr Craig, had already concluded murder/suicide This was before DCI Jones arrived and obviously before he checked all the windows and found them secured from within.

Not  disputing that, he went in with the mind set of murder suicide, he was the senior officer in charge and had authority to conduct a proper investigation.  If you think it was handled well by Taff, that’s your opinion, I don’t think it was, not only for the murdered Family, but also for Bamber himself and it’s why we’re here now!

[Cambridgecutie]

This is one of the things that really baffles me about this case...the importance placed on the role of DCI Jones at the SOC on the morning of 7th Aug.  It is a complete and utter myth that DCI Jones wrote the SOC off as murder/suicide.  In reality DCI Jones was one of the last officers to arrive at SOC.  By the time he arrived it had long been designated murder/suicide by Chief Sup Harris supported by police surgeon Dr Craig.  What is difficult to accept and understand about this?  Why is it a myth perpetuated to eternity?

[Hardy Boy]

Not  disputing that, he went in with the mind set of murder suicide, he was the senior officer in charge and had authority to conduct a proper investigation.  If you think it was handled well by Taff, that’s your opinion, I don’t think it was, not only for the murdered Family, but also for Bamber himself and it’s why we’re here now!

DCI 'Taff' Jones was heavily criticised
The trial judge, Mr Justice Drake, formally expressed concern about the "less than thorough investigation". Subsequently, the Home Secretary in 1989 stated that "errors were made in the early stages of the police investigation contrary to existing force practice". Jones was later removed from the case, and attention shifted to Jeremy Bamber, who was arrested a month after the murders and eventually convicted based on new evidence, including testimony from his ex-girlfriend Julie Mugford.

[Hardy Boy]

This is one of the things that really baffles me about this case...the importance placed on the role of DCI Jones at the SOC on the morning of 7th Aug.  It is a complete and utter myth that DCI Jones wrote the SOC off as murder/suicide.  In reality DCI Jones was one of the last officers to arrive at SOC.  By the time he arrived it had long been designated murder/suicide by Chief Sup Harris supported by police surgeon Dr Craig.  What is difficult to accept and understand about this?  Why is it a myth perpetuated to eternity?

Woodcock states he came out after a 25 mins cameo appearance and addressed Miller, Cook and Jones, it’s Suicide. Draw your own conclusions from that!  He then went into detail about what Bamber had given them?  He told Cooke he didn’t want a full house search.

[Cambridgecutie]

Not  disputing that, he went in with the mind set of murder suicide, he was the senior officer in charge and had authority to conduct a proper investigation.  If you think it was handled well by Taff, that’s your opinion, I don’t think it was, not only for the murdered Family, but also for Bamber himself and it’s why we’re here now!

Who is he?  Chief Sup Harris or DCI Jones? 

DCI Jones was one of the last officers to arrive at SOC.  If he went in with the mindset of murder/suicide why did he bother checking all the windows?  Why did he bother examining the soc and writing notes in his pocket book about the soc? 

I accept a pathologist, ballistics and biologist should have been called to soc but all the relevant physical  evidence was captured.  If you disagree with the latter what was lost? 

The ultimate reason we are here now is because of corruption and incompetence at FSS. 

[Hardy Boy]

This is one of the things that really baffles me about this case...the importance placed on the role of DCI Jones at the SOC on the morning of 7th Aug.  It is a complete and utter myth that DCI Jones wrote the SOC off as murder/suicide.  In reality DCI Jones was one of the last officers to arrive at SOC.  By the time he arrived it had long been designated murder/suicide by Chief Sup Harris supported by police surgeon Dr Craig.  What is difficult to accept and understand about this?  Why is it a myth perpetuated to eternity?

It would baffle you, that’s not hard anyway.  You want to believe that Taff called it right.  I say it was a piss  poor investigation backed up by the home office and the trial Judge, it was lead by the senior detective in charge Taff jones, it doesn’t matter what he was told by Harris or anyone else, the buck stops with him as to how the investigation progressed, seniors above him hide behind his mistakes anyway.

[Hardy Boy]

Who is he?  Chief Sup Harris or DCI Jones? 

DCI Jones was one of the last officers to arrive at SOC.  If he went in with the mindset of murder/suicide why did he bother checking all the windows?  Why did he bother examining the soc and writing notes in his pocket book about the soc? 

I accept a pathologist, ballistics and biologist should have been called to soc but all the relevant physical  evidence was captured.  If you disagree with the latter what was lost? 

The ultimate reason we are here now is because of corruption and incompetence at FSS.

Your not forgetting Stan Jones surely are you?  Why are you leaving him out all of a sudden?

[Cambridgecutie]

Woodcock states he came out after a 25 mins cameo appearance and addressed Miller, Cook and Jones, it’s Suicide. Draw your own conclusions from that!  He then went into detail about what Bamber had given them?  He told Cooke he didn’t want a full house search.

Who is he?

The conclusions I draw are from the ws's of Chief Sup Harris and police surgeon Dr Craig.  The pair formed the opinion, based on decades of experience, that the soc was murder/suicide long before DCI Jones arrived.

[Cambridgecutie]

Your not forgetting Stan Jones surely are you?  Why are you leaving him out all of a sudden?

I used the word "ultimate".  JB's conviction is based on claims of a flake of blood.  This 'evidence' came about from the FSS. 

[Hardy Boy]

Who is he?

The conclusions I draw are from the ws's of Chief Sup Harris and police surgeon Dr Craig.  The pair formed the opinion, based on decades of experience, that the soc was murder/suicide long before DCI Jones arrived.

Dont talk stupid, Craig arrived at 8.30amn he finished certifying death  at 8,50am Taff arrived at 9.00am, where’s he got time to go over forensic analysis with Harris before Taff Arrived, this is the level of investigation you accept!  It was a murder scene that needed in depth investigation and not Cameo appearances.  Fking  long before my Arse!  Craig experienced to conduct a SOC  murder investigation in 25 mins, don’t make me laugh 😂😂😂😂

[Cambridgecutie]

Dont talk stupid, Craig arrived at 8.30amn he finished certifying death  at 8,50am Taff arrived at 9.00am, where’s he got time to go over forensic analysis with Harris before Taff Arrived, this is the level of investigation you accept!  It was a murder scene that needed in depth investigation and not Cameo appearances.  Fking  long before my Arse!  Craig experienced to conduct a SOC  murder investigation in 25 mins, don’t make me laugh 😂😂😂😂

Did I say any of what you have claimed above?  Comprehension is clearly not your strong point.

I said Chief Sup Harris along with Dr Craig designated the soc murder/suicide long before DCI Jones arrived. 

[Hardy Boy]

Dont talk stupid, Craig arrived at 8.30amn he finished certifying death  at 8,50am Taff arrived at 9.00am, where’s he got time to go over forensic analysis with Harris before Taff Arrived, this is the level of investigation you accept!  It was a murder scene that needed in depth investigation and not Cameo appearances.  Fking  long before my Arse!  Craig experienced to conduct a SOC  murder investigation in 25 mins, don’t make me laugh 😂😂😂😂

From Harris, he had a brief discussion with Taff when he arrived,  and they had an appointment at Chelmsford Head Post Office at 10.30am  so left the scene with Detective Chief Inspector JONES at
9.34am.  Great detective work of a major crime scene and I I must apologise looks like Taffs cameo was 34mins and not 30 mins.