Police Fitting Up Suspects

[Bubo bubo]

Again unlike you i do my research, i can't always find it straight away, but

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=5671.0;attach=37475;image

I don't always just rely on one piece of Evidence, i do try to cross check things before i post, but i do try to check that if someone posts something, the evidence is there

Then the evidence is contradictory between what JM  and SB said in their August statements and what SBJ says on 17/09/85. Who are we to believe?

[Hardy Boy]

This Post you put up denying SJ AND DC CLARK went for luch, Anne's is talking about the 7th of august when JM and DB went to fetch luch.

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12325.0;attach=60228;image

The post from Dickinson what you said was Crock of Shit is  backed up by Stan and what i refered to is two day's after the murder, the 8th of August, 7TH and 8th;

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1168.0;attach=19644;image

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1168.0;attach=19645;image

[Hardy Boy]

Then the evidence is contradictory between what JM  and SB said in their August statements and what SBJ says on 17/09/85. Who are we to believe?

ME

[Jane]

Read parts from D to F. Jones states he did leave and he returned and Bamber had gone, he returned to speak to the relatives and to speak to JM.

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=417.0;attach=22790;image

Now be educated

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4596.0;attach=33744;image

DS Jones and DC cLark, 1.45pm leave head street and Lunch at Chequers Goldhanger, discussing Jeremy's reaction, in a nutshell it had changed from the day before, Oh and wait for it, over lunch Stan Say's he's going to interview Julie on her own, meaning Jeremy had gone to the Solicitors and this was his chance to have a go at Julie, ...............later he say's 2.30pm, i interviewed Julie about the Phone calls she had recieved from Jeremy ETC..............................Oh but wait, after he interviewed Julie at 3.30pm. he gets on the Phone and calls DC Miller, he tells Miller he couldn't speak on the phone but, he was unhappy...............And guess what it matches exactly what the Dickenson report Say's, you know the piece of evidence you like to trash.

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4596.0;attach=33748;image

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1168.0;attach=19645;image

I ask anyone to read both pieces of evidence and see if i am making things up, it's obvious to me Bubo is well out of his League and does't have a clue, yet he try's to pull posters up giving their HONEST and not made up opinion. 

I'm certain, if TAFF hadn't called it Suicide straight away, the investigfation would have been carried out differently, he stopped the process of a murder investigation and changed it into a formallity, he didn't in my opinion do Jeremy Bamber any favours whatsoever, he probably lost evidence that could have cleared Jeremy and he left the scene then to be contaminated.

Bubo calls what i am relying on  a Crock of Shit, i refute that and i try to post in a honest way and do do my research thoroughly, as good as any other Poster, i might not know it all, but i do Know what was said,  TAFF never conducted a thorough investigation to what this tragic murder/suicide deserved, TAFF handed the keys back to the relatives and gave them Carte Blanche and he is to blame.

And I still maintain it can be traced back to one person, and one person only, namely JB. So if we take another look at what you say, and I'm certain you're correct, "....if Taff hadn't called it suicide straight away, the investigation would have been carried out differently..........." I believe it can be concluded that he'd been heavily influenced by JB's chapter and verse on Sheila's life, mental instability, hospitalization on two occasions, previous suicide attempts, and expertise with firearms. It matters not that it was probably passed down to him by other officers, the power of suggestion works, especially when suggested/implied by a well spoken, public school educated, urbane young gentleman. JB's words were all he needed to hear to convince him his conclusion was correct. Why waste unnecessary time on digging deeper?

[Hardy Boy]

And I still maintain it can be traced back to one person, and one person only, namely JB. So if we take another look at what you say, and I'm certain you're correct, "....if Taff hadn't called it suicide straight away, the investigation would have been carried out differently..........." I believe it can be concluded that he'd been heavily influenced by JB's chapter and verse on Sheila's life, mental instability, hospitalization on two occasions, previous suicide attempts, and expertise with firearms. It matters not that it was probably passed down to him by other officers, the power of suggestion works, especially when suggested/implied by a well spoken, public school educated, urbane young gentleman. JB's words were all he needed to hear to convince him his conclusion was correct. Why waste unnecessary time on digging deeper?

I agree jane, what i'm getting at, if he had done a proper Job, the silencer would have been found by the Police, then it clears the relatives [although Cutie say's Stan climbed through the window] it clears without Doubt that there was no tampering and it does save the public money in the long run, Appeals and CCRC and Court of Appeals on this subject, and because TAFF never did a thorough investigation on that first and second day  and treat it as a murder, it allows Bamber to exploit this weakness?  On the other hand, if there wasn't blood in the silencer when The Police find it, it clears Bamber, because JM coming forward on her own wouldn't have been enough to get the conviction?

[Jane]

I agree jane, what i'm getting at, if he had done a proper Job, the silencer would have been found by the Police, then it clears the relatives [although Cutie say's Stan climbed through the window] it clears without Doubt that there was no tampering and it does save the public money in the long run, Appeals and CCRC and Court of Appeals on this subject, and because TAFF never did a thorough investigation on that first and second day  and treat it as a murder, it allows Bamber to exploit this weakness?  On the other hand, if there wasn't blood in the silencer when The Police find it, it clears Bamber, because JM coming forward on her own wouldn't have been enough to get the conviction?

JM and the silencer made a convincing 'team', but when it comes down to which was more convincing, I think I'm inclined, now, to be in JM's corner. Only because she was visual to the jury as she told her story, which, despite the judge suggesting they may choose not to believe her, they clearly did. I can't say whether or not I'd have believed her. I wasn't there, but I think I'd probably have taken in what she said more than what was said about the silencer.

[BarefootDanC]

I agree jane, what i'm getting at, if he had done a proper Job, the silencer would have been found by the Police, then it clears the relatives [although Cutie say's Stan climbed through the window] it clears without Doubt that there was no tampering and it does save the public money in the long run, Appeals and CCRC and Court of Appeals on this subject, and because TAFF never did a thorough investigation on that first and second day  and treat it as a murder, it allows Bamber to exploit this weakness?  On the other hand, if there wasn't blood in the silencer when The Police find it, it clears Bamber, because JM coming forward on her own wouldn't have been enough to get the conviction?

I agree with your general point, but I actually think the fact that the sound moderator was found by the family makes it even less likely to be fabricated than had it been found by the police. Surely if the police fabricated it for no reason in early August, they wouldn't have planted it in the house and then left it for the relatives to embarrass them with a find, or even not find it or report it. The police would have simply announced that they found it.

Of course, the argument then becomes "the family fabricated it", but they didn't have access to Sheila's blood, at least not in substantial quantities and although Robert Boutflour was also a match, they had no knowledge of this fact.

[Hardy Boy]

I agree with your general point, but I actually think the fact that the sound moderator was found by the family makes it even less likely to be fabricated than had it been found by the police. Surely if the police fabricated it for no reason in early August, they wouldn't have planted it in the house and then left it for the relatives to embarrass them with a find, or even not find it or report it. The police would have simply announced that they found it.

Of course, the argument then becomes "the family fabricated it", but they didn't have access to Sheila's blood, at least not in substantial quantities and although Robert Boutflour was also a match, they had no knowledge of this fact.

That's is not my Suggestion DAN, that is Cutie's suggestion, she say's Stan climbed through a window and Fabricated it before the Family found it.  My argument is, Taff not doing his Job Properly, allwowed the Family Carte Blanche in the house, so it made the Family look Suspicious.

The Family finding it would hold more suspicion than the Police finding it, the family had more to lose?

[Hardy Boy]

JM and the silencer made a convincing 'team', but when it comes down to which was more convincing, I think I'm inclined, now, to be in JM's corner. Only because she was visual to the jury as she told her story, which, despite the judge suggesting they may choose not to believe her, they clearly did. I can't say whether or not I'd have believed her. I wasn't there, but I think I'd probably have taken in what she said more than what was said about the silencer.

My worry about JM on her own, she carried some serious Baggage Jane, i'm not convinced the CPS would take it to trial with just her on her own, it's his word against her word then?  Having the silencer on it's own would still be hard,  the downside of the family finding it, might have been the stumbling block, but it slightly edges it for me over JM on her own.  Both together they become stronger like you say.

[Bubo bubo]

I agree jane, what i'm getting at, if he had done a proper Job, the silencer would have been found by the Police, then it clears the relatives [although Cutie say's Stan climbed through the window] it clears without Doubt that there was no tampering and it does save the public money in the long run, Appeals and CCRC and Court of Appeals on this subject, and because TAFF never did a thorough investigation on that first and second day  and treat it as a murder, it allows Bamber to exploit this weakness?  On the other hand, if there wasn't blood in the silencer when The Police find it, it clears Bamber, because JM coming forward on her own wouldn't have been enough to get the conviction?

100% agree. But I argue they did find an SM on the day

[Rob_]

And I still maintain it can be traced back to one person, and one person only, namely JB. So if we take another look at what you say, and I'm certain you're correct, "....if Taff hadn't called it suicide straight away, the investigation would have been carried out differently..........." I believe it can be concluded that he'd been heavily influenced by JB's chapter and verse on Sheila's life, mental instability, hospitalization on two occasions, previous suicide attempts, and expertise with firearms. It matters not that it was probably passed down to him by other officers, the power of suggestion works, especially when suggested/implied by a well spoken, public school educated, urbane young gentleman. JB's words were all he needed to hear to convince him his conclusion was correct. Why waste unnecessary time on digging deeper?

Cook says he kept an open mind when going about his duties at WHF:

[snow66!]

Cook says he kept an open mind when going about his duties at WHF:

Well done Rob!

[Hardy Boy]

Cook says he kept an open mind when going about his duties at WHF:

Correct Rob, he was leading the Soco investigation, he did keep an open mind, it was very much open to TAFF'S call Murder/suicide,  he left WHF at 1.15pm the day of the murders and never returned that day.

 He only returned to the murder scene, 4.30pm the next day on the 8th,  he went back for the meeting with SJ and Taff at WHF,  or he wouldn't have gone back that day either.

 SO yes, your right, he was very open, he was open to it being Murder Suicide and nothing else because he was following TAFF'S instructions.  Cooke was working under the DIRECTIVE of the senior officer, and in this case it was DCI Jones who had directed to Cook it was a murder suicide at 9.30am that very morning.




I'm trying to back Bamber here, the scene wasn't investigated properly like a crime scene of this Magnitude required, TAFF the senior crime investigation officer leading such investigation, he spent 30 mins at the crime scene on the very first day on a Quick Walkabout, he only went back the next day for a meeting on the 8th and he only went back the day after on the 9th late that evening to Hand the Key's over to the relatives and show Anne around WHF with Stan.

He never looked at the crime scene objectively, it was impossible to Draw such conclusions so early with a 25 minute walkaround that it was murder/suicide,  doesn't matter who told him it was murder/suicide, it's not his job to say such until all inquiries are carried out, and a thorough investigation had taken place.  He never listened to other officers concerns  he never called in the experts,  and if he had done his job correctly,  Who Knows, Bamber might not even have gone to trial.   

[Hardy Boy]

Cook says he kept an open mind when going about his duties at WHF:

Cook is Lying his backside off, Woodcock raised these concerns, he raised the fact something was not right  and did not look like murder suicide, Woodcock raised concerns to both TAFF and Cook............Sheila was Too clean to have carried out these murders, There was no bullett cases visible around her body [later found underneath Sheila where her head had been, he also questioned the fact there was two bullet shots to Sheila and the rifle being Semi automatic,  he raised these concerns to Taff on his walkabout, and he pointed out the same concerns to Cook after Taff had gone. 

All these things Woodcock had concerns about and put  to Taff and Cook, became part of the case against Bamber, and this say's it all about the level of investigation took by the leading senior Crimes inspector Taff and his Merry men.  Taff's call of Murder suicide put the Blinkers on the rest.

Cook will try and cover his own Back, as a Soco investigator he should have looked at the crime scene Objectively, he didn't, he didn't even know what crime scene evidence was taken on the 7th/8th and 9th,

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2081.0;attach=24079;image

[ILB]

That's is not my Suggestion DAN, that is Cutie's suggestion, she say's Stan climbed through a window and Fabricated it before the Family found it.  My argument is, Taff not doing his Job Properly, allwowed the Family Carte Blanche in the house, so it made the Family look Suspicious.

The Family finding it would hold more suspicion than the Police finding it, the family had more to lose?

I think it was Jeremy Bamber himself who allowed the relatives to be carte blanche in the house. He gave permission