Author Topic: The window Jeremy used for entry  (Read 26942 times)

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Online Steve_uk

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #285 on: July 18, 2023, 06:28:PM »
It is clear that they were creating escape routes. You are suggesting Taff's missed these but it is much more likely that he checked with the TFG as to which windows they had opened. Good that you admit to getting the wrong room. However it does not explain why they used the kitchen window theory based on the families porky pies rather than blame Taff's who had died and could not provide the truth. Nor does your straw clutching explain why all involved agreed with Taff's in the first instance. I am sorry but your answers as you predicted are not good enough IMO
Maybe because he was their boss.

Offline snow66!

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #286 on: July 18, 2023, 08:20:PM »
Seems we still have disagreement about the windows,so let us take a look at the evidence.
Now,ILB calls the topic'The window Jeremy used for entry',well the ALLEGED window was the sash window in the downstairs shower room.The prosecution case claims JB locked this window behind him after entry and exited by the kitchen window after his task was completed.

Now,the kitchen window had two openings in it,a small top hinged part sometimes referred to as a fanlight and a side hinged opening secured by a side handle and bottom catch. Now I may be wrong but going by Wilkes book and AEs statements I think initially the relatives were talking about JB exiting by the top fanlight opening.AE talks of setting the catch which then falls into place when the window is banged shut,there is no mention of a 'side handle' or a 'bottom latch'

Yes,I know it is the side opening part of the kitchen window that the campaign team are talking about in their podcast video but that is because it was this opening that Barlow tested when he visited the WHF
on his own.The relatives never spoke of the bottom latch on the window,but Barlow did,he even said that AE might have to show him how she secured the window,'how it was done'.

I think Barlow was testing the side opening,while the relatives were testing the top opening or fanlight,
 as it is referred to throughout Wilkes's book.

I dont think RWB would have been content with simply securing the handle on the side opening window,he would have wanted the bottom latch on its peg too,dont you think? And remember,they talk of Bamber wriggling out of the window,not climbing out.

BUT,thats just how I read it,will be glad to view any evidence where any of the relatives specifically mention the side opening of the kitchen window and not the fanlight or top hinged opening.

Anyway,back to the argument about whether Taff checked if all the downstair windows were secure.
A few points here,as we have said,it seems unlikely that Taff would check the dairy window inside and out so thoroughly and simply glance at the others as claimed by Jane. Adam says that Taff suspected JB from the start,so why lie about checking that all the downstiar windows were secured?
Once JB was arrested why didn't Taff admitt that he didn't check all the windows,if no one admitted to opening the shower room window this was the chance to put the pressure on to JB and accuse him of using it to enter and exit the farm.
Yet,in his october statement Taff maintains that he checked all down stair windows.Now,there is severe pigheadedness and then there is perverting the course of justice.

Would Taff really have continued to claim to have checked the windows if he hadn't?
Would he really risk a maniac getting off and shooting someone else? Would he really help a killer evade justice because of hot headed stubornness?

Now Zoso asks why didn't  Taff mention the dining room window being opened by the raid team and why JB didnt tell the TFG how to enter the WHF through a window and rescue any survivors?

Well,again we can only assume that Taff was told that the TFG had opened the dining room window as an escape route,after all some of them were still around when Taff arrived,which member of the TFG made safe the rifle and helped to bag the bodies,was that Collins? Will check later.

As for JB telling the TFG how to enter the WHF through a window,this wasn't actually an option.
As far as the police were concerned it was a potential siege situation,and when they did decide to go in it had to be through a door for speed,several men at the same time to cover one another.

Why do you think the police always knock a door in to enter a building? They cant risk climbing in through windows and getting knifed or shot one at a time while they are vulnerable on their hands and knees.They knock the door off its hinges and charge in,taking the occupants by surprise while covering each others back.

Why would the police pay for a new house door if they didn't have to.Even without JBs help,all they had to do was break ONE pane of glass in ANY window and reach in to unlock the catch if they wanted to.
A lot cheaper replacing a pane of glass than a front door,but the police had no intention of entering through a window no matter what JB might have told them.

And what was this Golding guy, or whoever it was, checking the security of the house for later on anyway?

No,I think common sense tells us that Taff did indeed check all the down stair windows,I dont think he would have lied about this once JB was arrested if it wasn't true,he even helped interview JB,why would he help to question him about exiting through the kitchen window if he thought the shower room window was found unsecured? I dont think so.


Offline Zoso

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #287 on: July 18, 2023, 08:28:PM »


Quite simple, who opened and closed the window without locking the catch? If you don't know, you can't say it wasn't open all along.

It doesn't matter whether the RT would have USED the window, the point is that Bamber didn't offer it up!
« Last Edit: July 18, 2023, 08:31:PM by Zoso »

Offline ILB

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #288 on: July 18, 2023, 09:06:PM »
Pretty obvious all windows were secured and checked. Taffs statement as senior officer reflecting as which.

Windows were probably opened. The mantra was murder suicide
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Offline ILB

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #289 on: July 18, 2023, 09:06:PM »
Quite simple, who opened and closed the window without locking the catch? If you don't know, you can't say it wasn't open all along.

It doesn't matter whether the RT would have USED the window, the point is that Bamber didn't offer it up!

Offer what up ?
If yesterday you hated me. Then today you can not stop the love that binds from me to you. And you to me

Offline Zoso

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #290 on: July 18, 2023, 09:32:PM »
Pretty obvious all windows were secured and checked. Taffs statement as senior officer reflecting as which.

Windows were probably opened. The mantra was murder suicide

It's not obvious at all. 'Probably' isn't good enough, it certainly isn't good enough when argued from a guity perspective.

Offline Zoso

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #291 on: July 18, 2023, 09:32:PM »
Offer what up ?

The information that he knew how to get through the bathroom window.

Offline Rob_

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #292 on: July 18, 2023, 09:36:PM »
Not long now Jeremy my old mucka

And Adam will get all the glory for showing the world how weak the case against JB was!

Offline snow66!

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #293 on: July 18, 2023, 09:46:PM »
Found some info about officer Golding in the Dickinson report.
Now this officer was apparently sent to secure the farm[perimeter too??] after everyone else had gone on the 7th Aug.What he 'allegedly' found was the fanlight window open in the kitchen[the relatives exit of choice for JB???] and the shower room window unlatched.

Now,the thing is,Golding apparently took it on himself to secure these windows but made no note of doing so,and only reported his actions ONCE AINSLEY HAD TAKEN OVER.

SO,isn't it funny that our attention is drawn to the shower room window and the kitchen window by Goldings statement? The very windows JB would be accused of using, and evidence that was not mentioned until AFTER Ainsley had taken over.

Golding gave evidence about the windows in court also,obviously hinting that this was how JB entered and exited the house.
I ask you!

Dickinson report points 183-185
« Last Edit: July 18, 2023, 10:54:PM by snow66! »

Offline ILB

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #294 on: July 18, 2023, 10:47:PM »
It's not obvious at all. 'Probably' isn't good enough, it certainly isn't good enough when argued from a guity perspective.

It's a senior officer. The main man. It was taffs case

Jeremy Bamber was a grieving relative at that point in time
« Last Edit: July 18, 2023, 10:48:PM by ILB »
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Offline ILB

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #295 on: July 18, 2023, 10:47:PM »
The information that he knew how to get through the bathroom window.

Why should he?
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Offline ILB

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #296 on: July 18, 2023, 10:52:PM »
And Adam will get all the glory for showing the world how weak the case against JB was!

A release at this stage in Jeremy's life is not a win for him any event Rob.

His life has been ruined from the age of 24.

Can't get back those years


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Offline Zoso

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #297 on: July 18, 2023, 11:07:PM »
Why should he?

Wouldn't you? I know I would.

Offline Zoso

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #298 on: July 18, 2023, 11:09:PM »
Found some info about officer Golding in the Dickinson report.
Now this officer was apparently sent to secure the farm[perimeter too??] after everyone else had gone on the 7th Aug.What he 'allegedly' found was the fanlight window open in the kitchen[the relatives exit of choice for JB???] and the shower room window unlatched.

Now,the thing is,Golding apparently took it on himself to secure these windows but made no note of doing so,and only reported his actions ONCE AINSLEY HAD TAKEN OVER.

SO,isn't it funny that our attention is drawn to the shower room window and the kitchen window by Goldings statement? The very windows JB would be accused of using, and evidence that was not mentioned until AFTER Ainsley had taken over.

Golding gave evidence about the windows in court also,obviously hinting that this was how JB entered and exited the house.
I ask you!

Dickinson report points 183-185

Oh I see, another conspiracy?  ;D

Offline ILB

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Re: The window Jeremy used for entry
« Reply #299 on: July 18, 2023, 11:11:PM »
Wouldn't you? I know I would.

If my father had told me my sister had gone crazy with a gun and I drove to the scene of events why would I be saying to police officers ways I could enter the farmhouse?
If yesterday you hated me. Then today you can not stop the love that binds from me to you. And you to me