PC John Manners statement - 23/09/1985

[chochokeira]

Hartley, can you make out the couple of sentences that have been crossed out?

Hi Shona, I read the crossed out paragraph as:

read it as:

"The Kitchen was in general disarray, chairs (upturned?) and breakfast dishes and food stuffs on the floor. There were also bloodstains on the floor."

Might Manners have crossed that section out on being told that officers ahead of him had knocked all of that stuff over?

[shonapugs]

Thanks, Choch.

[Hartley]

Can we get one thing clear here please. The highlighting and crossing out was done by Mike Teskowski, we have enough conpiracy theories already thank you.

[shonapugs]

Oh, right. I actually find that more puzzling.

[Hartley]

Oh, right. I actually find that more puzzling.

Maybe, but lets see it as he highlighted things to make notes, after he made the notes he crossed the highlight out, nothing more sinister than that.

[shonapugs]

OK, Harts. The voice of reason, as ever!!

[Newbury1]

I find the comment by PC John Manners interesting where he states "Mrs Bamber was clothed in a nightdress.... I remember that the blood on her legs was smudged as if she had been dragged by the legs"!

So we have NB perched on an overturned chair with his head placed in a coal scuttle, SC "staged" in a most obvious way, in a "not quite right" position next to the bed (on a non-bloodstained rug), and now a suggestion by Manners that June appears to have been dragged across the floor.

Why would JB (or SC) do these things 

In my mind (and my mind like everyones is limited) I can only see the murderer shooting them and then leaving them dead in the position they were killed.

All this "repositioning" is very disturbing 

[smiffy]

Thinking here...June moved..hmm...she was in the way a bit in the pictures by the doorway...
If Sheila was carried from the kitchen to where the police placed her..Junes body would be in the way and if carried over June...blood could drip onto June from Sheila and this may blow the cover up.
So June is moved out the way when Sheila is carried into the bedroom and put back into position afterwards.
Now on another thread one officer or another reports June in a different position to that depicted in the photographs....hmmm this adds support to this scenario being credible and correct in its basis.

[Enigma]

Smiffy your posts are as effective as a chihuahua chewing a tank.
I am going to ask the DPP to gag you with a PII; now that would
be in the public interest. 

[grahameb]

Smiffy your posts are as effective as a chihuahua chewing a tank.
I am going to ask the DPP to gag you with a PII; now that would
be in the public interest. 

He actually makes a pretty good point. The have already admitted moving Sheila's arm so they could photograph the boodstain on her night dress (It baffles me as to why they wanted a good picture of blood?) Mike also claims thay he has seen a picture of Sheila on the bed instead of on the floor. And I believe him. So why would it not be reasonable to suppose that June's body had also been "manipulated" into that position?

[Hartley]

Smiffy your posts are as effective as a chihuahua chewing a tank.
I am going to ask the DPP to gag you with a PII; now that would
be in the public interest. 

He actually makes a pretty good point. The have already admitted moving Sheila's arm so they could photograph the boodstain on her night dress (It baffles me as to why they wanted a good picture of blood?) Mike also claims thay he has seen a picture of Sheila on the bed instead of on the floor. And I believe him. So why would it not be reasonable to suppose that June's body had also been "manipulated" into that position?

That is simple. Sheila's manipulation is documented and photographed, I don't believe Mike has seen a photograph of Sheila on the bed, I think he is lying.
There is no documentation that June has been manipulated, if there are drag marks then it's just as likely that she dragged her own injured body to that position before being shot between the eyes.

[grahameb]

Smiffy your posts are as effective as a chihuahua chewing a tank.
I am going to ask the DPP to gag you with a PII; now that would
be in the public interest. 

He actually makes a pretty good point. The have already admitted moving Sheila's arm so they could photograph the boodstain on her night dress (It baffles me as to why they wanted a good picture of blood?) Mike also claims thay he has seen a picture of Sheila on the bed instead of on the floor. And I believe him. So why would it not be reasonable to suppose that June's body had also been "manipulated" into that position?

That is simple. Sheila's manipulation is documented and photographed, I don't believe Mike has seen a photograph of Sheila on the bed, I think he is lying.
There is no documentation that June has been manipulated, if there are drag marks then it's just as likely that she dragged her own injured body to that position before being shot between the eyes.

Possible. The bit about June I mean. I don't think that Mike is lying about the photograph.

[smiffy]

thinking of Sheila being carried by 2 or more policemen in the bedroom...
they move June as her body was in the way etc as blood from Sheila may drip on her...as they carry Sheila's body they have to round the bed...ie turn the corner.....it is at this point of turning  that they will move slower as they have to turn 90 degrees... at which also Sheila's body may tip a little allowing blood to spill from her in the turning point area.

Now looking at one of the bedroom photographs there appears to be a rectangle of carpet that has been cut out in this relevant area of turning where blood may have spilled from Sheila.
Was this section cut out due to whose blood it was and what it may show if tested or was its appearance so distinctly different from other blood spots on the floor to make it stand out as unusual?

[Hartley]

Unfortunately not possible, there is very little blood in the doorway itself, Junes body could not have been in the door way. I can post a photograph if you like but be warned it is a bit graphic and not particularly pleasant.

[Jackiepreece]

I believe Mike has seen Sheila on the bed what reason would he have to lie about that point?