PC John Manners statement - 23/09/1985

[Jackiepreece]

Shona JB is so confident but I know Ngb thinks it very serious what's going on with Essex Police at the moment and on the back of what's happening I said to him yesterday be careful.  So he said to me he's fine he's fit and strong and he will be fine and I said I wasn't worried too much about everyday but if Essex Police are that worried you don't really know what could happen.
If you think about it there could be a number of policeman going to prison and big pensions lost anything could happen.  Someone has already been murdered in JB s prison this year

Essex Police are going full steam ahead to stop JB s case getting referred to the court of appeal

[shonapugs]

Blimey, Jack, that's bit massive. Could Essex police really have covered up this case for 26 years? The mind boggles.

[shonapugs]

Whatever I believe, when I read stuff like that, Jack, I understand why you fight.

[Enigma]

Pipe dreams Shona, just pipe dreams. Bamber will be in prison and
'confident' in 25 years time if he doesn't become one of the murdered!

[shonapugs]

I hate to admit it, but there will always be an element of doubt. Jackie's an intelligent woman, and she fights on.

[Enigma]

I hate to admit it, but there will always be an element of doubt. Jackie's an intelligent woman, and she fights on.

I hate to admit it Shona The Brave every word of that post is just wrong!
 

[shonapugs]

At least I'm not Shona the radio rental anymore. But Jackie is intellligent, tenacious and loyal. We could learn a lot.

[andrea]

shes very loyal. a reet terrier is jack!!

[grahameb]

Blimey, Jack, that's bit massive. Could Essex police really have covered up this case for 26 years? The mind boggles.

Yes Shona and several other people are sure oif it as well including ngb. Recent events concerning JB have I am afraid confirmed our suspicions that t5hey are in fact hiding something big and it may go all the way to the top.

[andrea]

if people can conspire to muder the most powerful man on the planet (jfk).

Then im sure this country could stitch up smallfry like jeremy bamber.

[grahameb]

I hate to admit it, but there will always be an element of doubt. Jackie's an intelligent woman, and she fights on.

I hate to admit it Shona The Brave every word of that post is just wrong!
 

That shows just how inconsistent you are. In one breath you call her Shona the Brave and in the next breath you disagree with her. This should be a warning to all those tempted to be friends with you.

[Enigma]

I didn't call her Shona The Correct! Since when have brave and wrong been mutually oppossing adjectives?   

[smiffy]

thinking of Sheila being carried by 2 or more policemen in the bedroom...
they move June as her body was in the way etc as blood from Sheila may drip on her...as they carry Sheila's body they have to round the bed...ie turn the corner.....it is at this point of turning  that they will move slower as they have to turn 90 degrees... at which also Sheila's body may tip a little allowing blood to spill from her in the turning point area.

Now looking at one of the bedroom photographs there appears to be a rectangle of carpet that has been cut out in this relevant area of turning where blood may have spilled from Sheila.
Was this section cut out due to whose blood it was and what it may show if tested or was its appearance so distinctly different from other blood spots on the floor to make it stand out as unusual?

The cut out bit of carpet I refer to is not near the door by June but not too far from where Sheila's feet were depicted in the photographs....
I would like to add that there must have been some great urgency and reason for the police to have cut out this sample of carpet prior to photographs being taken...why was it a priority...it makes no sense if it was an innocent act...but lots of sense if it threatened the cover up. In my view that rectangle of carpet was cut out so it did not appear in photographs.

[grahameb]

thinking of Sheila being carried by 2 or more policemen in the bedroom...
they move June as her body was in the way etc as blood from Sheila may drip on her...as they carry Sheila's body they have to round the bed...ie turn the corner.....it is at this point of turning  that they will move slower as they have to turn 90 degrees... at which also Sheila's body may tip a little allowing blood to spill from her in the turning point area.

Now looking at one of the bedroom photographs there appears to be a rectangle of carpet that has been cut out in this relevant area of turning where blood may have spilled from Sheila.
Was this section cut out due to whose blood it was and what it may show if tested or was its appearance so distinctly different from other blood spots on the floor to make it stand out as unusual?

The cut out bit of carpet I refer to is not near the door by June but not too far from where Sheila's feet were depicted in the photographs....
I would like to add that there must have been some great urgency and reason for the police to have cut out this sample of carpet prior to photographs being taken...why was it a priority...it makes no sense if it was an innocent act...but lots of sense if it threatened the cover up. In my view that rectangle of carpet was cut out so it did not appear in photographs.

The purpose of taking photographs is so that the crime scene can be recorded. Therefore it is imperative that the crime scene is preserved as it is BEFORE any photographs are taken. In other words those photographs are a permanent record of the crime scene and should not vary in any way. Well, you may say that Sheila committed suicide and therefore it was not crucial to be accurate in recording the scene. No that is not true. It was still a crime scene and the utmost care should have been taken by the police in preserving things for the enquiry. You cannot excuse the police for the errors they made and then go off and say that JB is still guilty. If that crime scene was interfered with in any way then any evidence that was gathered should have been made null and void. Because of these brave errors the police had everything to lose both collectively and individually. So they had a real motice in covering things up.

[smiffy]

Manners and Woodcock were both in the firearms team and went up the main stairs..Both mention Collins using a mirror to check the bedroom out before proceeding up to it.
Neither Manners nor Woodcock report seeing any bloodstained wallpaper in the stairs/hallway area.
This may lead to the suggestion that no bloodstains were on the wallpaper when they were there.

There was a big pool of Ralphs blood on the kitchen floor. It would not take  much effort by those wishing to cover up what really happened to use that source of blood to make stains on the wallpaper.
With no stains on an appropriate bit of carpet to back up the later mentioned bloodstains on the wallpaper then it does look dodgy. There also seems an intent in the cover up to have Ralph shot initially in the bedroom and any deliberate bloodstaining added to the wallpaper may have been part of the cover up attempts.