Julie, Colin And Thoughts On Death

[Rob_]

I have never seen a dead body close up. But I guess you could in some cases you can tell if they died piecefully or not.

I am not saying always David but my experience is you can, and I won't listen to anybody no matter how eminent who say's you can't.

[Jane]

I am not saying always David but my experience is you can, and I won't listen to anybody no matter how eminent who say's you can't.

Surely, how one appears in death, is dependent, to a degree, on how one died. My adored late partner didn't look any different from how he'd looked when he fell asleep on the settee. However, he'd been terminally ill, and when 'help' was offered, he'd accepted.

 Now, if we look at the expressions of both June and Sheila, to me, there's no perceptible difference, yet we're asked to believe that Sheila chose death, and June had death, terrifyingly and torturously, inflicted on her. Take away the evidence of their injuries
and I don't believe it's possible to know, from their expressions, what horrors either were subjected of prior to dying.

[Rob_]

Surely, how one appears in death, is dependent, to a degree, on how one died. My adored late partner didn't look any different from how he'd looked when he fell asleep on the settee. However, he'd been terminally ill, and when 'help' was offered, he'd accepted.

 Now, if we look at the expressions of both June and Sheila, to me, there's no perceptible difference, yet we're asked to believe that Sheila chose death, and June had death, terrifyingly and torturously, inflicted on her. Take away the evidence of their injuries
and I don't believe it's possible to know, from their expressions, what horrors either were subjected of prior to dying.

I have seen pictures where you know from the person's facial expression they died violently for example Bonnie and Clyde. My own experience is you can, maybe it depends on how quick death occurred I don't know.

[Jane]

I have seen pictures where you know from the person's facial expression they died violently for example Bonnie and Clyde. My own experience is you can, maybe it depends on how quick death occurred I don't know.

With Bonnie and Clyde, perhaps it was their already violent lives which had become etched on their faces? I have to ask, do you see any evidence, on the faces of either June or Sheila, who we're led to believe died different deaths, to suggest the violence they saw/were part of/subjected to/experienced, prior to?

[Rob_]

With Bonnie and Clyde, perhaps it was their already violent lives which had become etched on their faces? I have to ask, do you see any evidence, on the faces of either June or Sheila, who we're led to believe died different deaths, to suggest the violence they saw/were part of/subjected to/experienced, prior to?

I don't like looking at pictures of the victims to be honest, the only one I have seen of June does not look right to me her arm looks all wrong?

If you see a picture of Clyde you will know it was a violent end.

[killingeve]

I do not want to go into details but my own personal experience tells me otherwise, so I respectively disagree.

Contact Bamber and recommend he adds it to his next submission.  Its sure to impress the commission and coa even if it doesn't cut the mustard here.

[killingeve]

I have never seen a dead body close up. But I guess you could in some cases you can tell if they died piecefully or not.

Contact Bamber and recommend he adds it to his next submission.  Its sure to impress the commission and coa even if it doesn't cut the mustard here.

[killingeve]

I am not saying always David but my experience is you can, and I won't listen to anybody no matter how eminent who say's you can't.

Contact Bamber and recommend he adds it to his next submission.  Its sure to impress the commission and coa even if it doesn't cut the mustard here.

[killingeve]

My experiences too Rob.

Contact Bamber and recommend he adds it to his next submission.  Its sure to impress the commission and coa even if it doesn't cut the mustard here.

[Rob_]

Contact Bamber and recommend he adds it to his next submission.  Its sure to impress the commission and coa even if it doesn't cut the mustard here.

Stop being silly, there are many instances where you can tell someone met a violent end. It's not just a person's facial expression position of limbs etc.

Lookout was a nurse her view should at least be respected, I have seen myself so I know.

[Jane]

I don't like looking at pictures of the victims to be honest, the only one I have seen of June does not look right to me her arm looks all wrong?

If you see a picture of Clyde you will know it was a violent end.

I appreciate that it's distressing to look at, but the position of June's arm is unlikely to have effected her facial expression.

As far as Clyde is concerned, I think it would have been a shock, to many, to learn that the real Clyde Barrow in no way resembled the good looking actor who portrayed him, and whose screen death was sanitized. The real CB experienced a death which reflected his life -ugly. The ugliness of June and Sheila's deaths wasn't a reflection of their lives.

I understand that you've drawn your conclusions from personal experience -as have I. I have to conclude that our experiences are different.

[killingeve]

Stop being silly, there are many instances where you can tell someone met a violent end. It's not just a person's facial expression position of limbs etc.

Lookout was a nurse her view should at least be respected, I have seen myself so I know.

Correct and they are identified and recorded as such in pathology reports. 

A nurse is not a pathologist. 

[Jane]

Stop being silly, there are many instances where you can tell someone met a violent end. It's not just a person's facial expression position of limbs etc.

Lookout was a nurse her view should at least be respected, I have seen myself so I know.

Possibly with some, such is possible, but don't you think having prior knowledge of how someone died might colour our views. I don't think there's any hardfast right or wrong about this. Scientifically, we know that muscles relax in death which could eliminate their experiences prior to it...............but no one has ever come back to tell us.

[lookout]

Correct and they are identified and recorded as such in pathology reports. 

A nurse is not a pathologist.

Nor a two-bit spammer a crackshot at investigating either !

[killingeve]

Nor a two-bit spammer a crackshot at investigating either !

Thought you likened your detective capabilities to Vera's?