Louis Theroux

[killingeve]

Very much so.

Sheila's first shot was very damaging & would have knocked her out instantly & killed her over time. The second shot was only around an inch from the first shot & killed her instantly.

So the CT say the police shot Sheila.

Apologies I meant has the podcast been the subject of discussion here?

I though the pathologist was unable to determine murder or suicide?  In any event claims of the police shooting Sheila seem somewhat far fetched    Is police issued ammunition the same as the ammunition used in the shootings?  If not how what explanation do these people put forward to explain this?

[lookout]

But we know from his own evidence that he could bypass the need for keys to White House Farm when necessary.

If only it had been proven that he entered/exited in this way 

[Steve_uk]

Pathetic post as usual. You are questioning the information given by a highly experienced barrister re the summing up. I know who I believe. Tomorrow I will post the typed summary of the podcast re the silencer and the grey hair. It also relates to the summing up and is quite damming

I hope Julie Mugford is as worried as David Boutflour is about there future

He didn't give any information because there wasn't any.

If my post is pathetic it's about as pathetic as your grammar.

[Steve_uk]

Apologies I meant has the podcast been the subject of discussion here?

I though the pathologist was unable to determine murder or suicide?  In any event claims of the police shooting Sheila seem somewhat far fetched    Is police issued ammunition the same as the ammunition used in the shootings?  If not how what explanation do these people put forward to explain this?

Cambridge it's Mike's theory. I doubt the theory has many adherents, even on this site.

[Roch]

I hope Julie Mugford is as worried as David Boutflour is about there future

None of the ones on telly look that worried at all. It's not possible to know how worried people might be behind the scenes. But if I was one of them (somebody who had turned a blind eye to testimony being changed, or even worse perhaps), I would have in mind that there's safety in numbers. They can't arrest all of us. And if I get arrested, I've already got a plan on who to blame for whatever I'm questioned about. Unless the authorities want a really messy never-ending, headline-grabbing saga about who did what and who turned a blind eye to what, then they are going to be tempted to side with the majority of people involved in some way or form in the convictions. Police, relatives, judiciary, etc etc. Like I said, safety in numbers.

[lookout]

Apologies I meant has the podcast been the subject of discussion here?

I though the pathologist was unable to determine murder or suicide?  In any event claims of the police shooting Sheila seem somewhat far fetched    Is police issued ammunition the same as the ammunition used in the shootings?  If not how what explanation do these people put forward to explain this?

The thing which has bugged me from the start was why no temperatures were ever taken of the deceased. I'm 100% certain that had this simple procedure been carried out----as it should have been, that the murderer would have been within and not sitting outside in a police car.
This should have been the very first thing that should have taken place before anything else. Any police doctor knows this.

[lookout]

Doctor Craig would almost certainly have had a rectal thermometer in his bag when told of the circumstances of his vist.

[Rob_]

Yes, but it's also that he left the silencer in situ after shooting his family.  I suppose the official theory is that he did this because he had not expected to have to remove the silencer from the rifle, so he had to think quickly and decided it would be better to return the silencer to the gun cupboard rather than take it with him, so that it would not be missed. 

I accept that this is plausible, but I personally would have thought the more natural thing to do would be to simply leave the silencer by Sheila's body.  That way, the police find it immediately and the explanation is obvious, and then it's much harder to incriminate Jeremy.

Why didn't he do that (assuming he is guilty)?  If I were a convinced guilter, I would need to satisfy myself on that point.  There must be a reason.  Maybe he just panicked?

The alternatives are you either clean the silencer there and then and return it to the gun cupboard, or you take the silencer with you. 

The last of those three options is adequate but risks suspicion being cast on him due to somebody noticing the silencer is missing.  But then you have to ask: How would the police know the silencer is missing?  Does the firearms certificate held by Nevill record it?  I'll have to check, but would the police be that thorough or make the connection?  Really?  It would be a bit of a stretch.  All Jeremy would need to do in this situation is ensure he took custody of the farmhouse after the police left.

Instead, he leaves the family to take custody of the farmhouse and the crucial evidence he has left there - part of the murder weapon.

I find it very hard to believe JB would have left the silencer in the gun cupboard, and if he did he had every opportunity to cover his tracks. He must have assumed the police would do a thorough search and find it?

Simply leaving it by the body or as you say just taking it away would be the obvious thing to do?

But what also troubles me is how did he get Sheila to just lie down and take the shot?

[lookout]

None of the ones on telly look that worried at all. It's not possible to know how worried people might be behind the scenes. But if I was one of them (somebody who had turned a blind eye to testimony being changed, or even worse perhaps), I would have in mind that there's safety in numbers. They can't arrest all of us. And if I get arrested, I've already got a plan on who to blame for whatever I'm questioned about. Unless the authorities want a really messy never-ending, headline-grabbing saga about who did what and who turned a blind eye to what, then they are going to be tempted to side with the majority of people involved in some way or form in the convictions. Police, relatives, judiciary, etc etc. Like I said, safety in numbers.

Which reminds me of the old saying " There's no honesty among thieves ".

[JackieD]

None of the ones on telly look that worried at all. It's not possible to know how worried people might be behind the scenes. But if I was one of them (somebody who had turned a blind eye to testimony being changed, or even worse perhaps), I would have in mind that there's safety in numbers. They can't arrest all of us. And if I get arrested, I've already got a plan on who to blame for whatever I'm questioned about. Unless the authorities want a really messy never-ending, headline-grabbing saga about who did what and who turned a blind eye to what, then they are going to be tempted to side with the majority of people involved in some way or form in the convictions. Police, relatives, judiciary, etc etc. Like I said, safety in numbers.

David Boutflour was worried, seriously in a state worried. This series was worse than the last series for the relatives and like QC said it needs a serious documentary maker to question the facts in this case. This is right up Piers Morgan’s street. Can you imagine David Boutflour handling Piers.

If you lie, if you are greedy, if you mislead juries you run the risk of the truth coming out

30 plus years on and you are still looking over your shoulder
Those lies have broken David Boutflour

[lookout]

I find it very hard to believe JB would have left the silencer in the gun cupboard, and if he did he had every opportunity to cover his tracks. He must have assumed the police would do a thorough search and find it?

Simply leaving it by the body or as you say just taking it away would be the obvious thing to do?

But what also troubles me is how did he get Sheila to just lie down and take the shot?

One thing laughs at another here Rob. If Sheila was compliant with a request to lie down, then surely she understood when someone was shooting her children that her immediate reaction would have been to dial 999 ?

[Steve_uk]

I find it very hard to believe JB would have left the silencer in the gun cupboard, and if he did he had every opportunity to cover his tracks. He must have assumed the police would do a thorough search and find it?

Simply leaving it by the body or as you say just taking it away would be the obvious thing to do?

But what also troubles me is how did he get Sheila to just lie down and take the shot?

She was exhausted by the activity of the preceding days (parties, caring for the children, accompanying June on her social errands), had Haloperidol in her system and was taken by surprise. You just need to see how calm she looked and the state of the nightdress to realize she was woken up and led to her death in seconds like a lamb to the slaughter and did not engage in any nocturnal activities the Bamberettes accuse her of.

[killingeve]

I thought perhaps I had misunderstood.  I will have to listen again as I was sort of multi-tasking at the time.  Here's the podcast https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEf2WCKkT1M&t=114s  Has it been the subject of discussion here?

What are the objectives of this podcast and who is it aimed at?

[lookout]

David Boutflour was worried, seriously in a state worried. This series was worse than the last series for the relatives and like QC said it needs a serious documentary maker to question the facts in this case. This is right up Piers Morgan’s street. Can you imagine David Boutflour handling Piers.

If you lie, if you are greedy, if you mislead juries you run the risk of the truth coming out

30 plus years on and you are still looking over your shoulder
Those lies have broken David Boutflour

I hope one day that DB does laugh on the other side of his face----he deserves to.

[Steve_uk]

What are the objectives of this podcast and who is it aimed at?

To trawl over old ground, targeting the gullible.