Jeremy Bamber Forum

DISCLAIMER AND FORUM RULES => Disclaimer and forum rules and guidelines => Topic started by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 02:43:PM

Title: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 02:43:PM
In relation to the " forum spats" last night

* Ngb came on the forum and agreed with Roch's

* I disagreed with Roch's post or Ngb"s or both - can't remember

* Ngb referred to the forum atmosphere as "almost tribal" and said he "hates bullying" - who doesn't?

* Caroline observed the forum numbers went up


Who are the bullies and what is being done about it? And where is the "almost tribal" atmosphere coming from?



I have used the below as examples


Adam
Yesterday at 07.47 PM
Can the moderators show consistancy in their moderating.
I complained when David put up a poster saying I make things up. However was told it would not be removed.
If Lookout is untouchable on here, just tell the forum why.

David
Yesterday at 07.57 PM
I doubt it. If she was ever obsessing over someone having a shower, it would be none other than her one and only Caroline.

Kaldin
Yesterday 08.50 PM
Why on earth would she be moderated for that? Don't be silly.

Caroline
Yesterday at 08.06 PM
Not really - you're acting like a 3 year old. Anyone working on a farm all day would have a shower and you know it. You went on and on about the bible cover and ended up being wrong, the same with the rifle angles - now you're arguing over this. I was perfectly polite to you but if you want want to start that BS. then I give ans good as I get!

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.08 PM
You're the one who's answering for other posters, and you don't even know who you're speaking to some of the time.

It's just nonsense to assume that Jeremy would have had a shower that time of night, but you keep on and on insisting that he must have had one. Don't bother to threaten me - I'm not a shrinking violet myself.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.12 PM
Are you speaking for yourself or for Caroline now? It's difficult to tell

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.12 PM
Oh please - you know I'm not an idiot.  ^-^
Why does saying that Jeremy didn't necessarily have a shower mean I'm not a fence sitter? Are we judging his guilt or innocence on whether he showers at night or not now?

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.16 PM
Haha! You and your two mates spend hours discussing other posters.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.22 PM
Don't tell me what I thought. You're the one being absurd - insisting that someone would have had a shower is ridiculous.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 8.23 PM
No I didn't. I was merely discussing the issue of a shower or no-shower, and you and Jane got all arsy.

Jane J
Yesterday at 08:27 PM
All of which makes rather more sense than Kaldin dragging out something they appear to have absolutely no interest in other than amusement value.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.37 PM
Do you have a point to make or are your eyes stuck?

Maggie
Yesterday at 08.45 PM
Maybe he just feels he needs to make a point, can't see that he's doing any harm. :-)

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08:30 PM
You see who's chucking the abuse around? It's you.

Maggie:
Yesterday at 08:34 PM 
I have to say I am with kaldin Jane, I am not emotionally involved in this case anymore.  My only hope is that JB is where he should be because if he is innocent it is beyond tragic.
If he's guilty and he's in prison why should I care?  He deserves to be where he is. :-X

Maggie
Yesterday at 08:42 PM »
I sense things may be getting personal.
Can posters please stick to the debate rather than attacking the poster.  cheers

Maggie
Yesterday at 09:42 PM »
I have locked this thread until I have time to sort it out.
Maybe it's time you all changed the subject.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 09.53 PM
Who rattled your cage? You seem very bitter.

Roch
Yesterday at 10:22 PM
Kaldin was treated with relative respect, until it became abundantly clear they were robustly questioning the guilty arguments (as canvassed by the guilt favouring members and the prosecution evidence). Then the insolence began

Ngb1066
Yesterday 10.32pm
As an administrator here I try to stand back from this Roch and avoid getting involved in forum spats, but I have to say I agree with you.  I am increasingly concerned at the general forum atmosphere.  It is becoming almost tribal, and that is not good.  I hate bullying and I am afraid that is what I am increasingly seeing here now.  I really wish it would stop.

Maggie
Yesterday at 11:01 PM »
I am locking this thread and if posters continue their bullying on another thread I shall start banning. It's gone far  enough



How do we move forward from this?

Isn't it down to each and everyone of us to regulate our forum behaviours and emotions; including past and present mods
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 10, 2017, 02:51:PM
Seriously it's time for you to go, you are just here to cause trouble

Maggie has supported you so much in the past and you just turn on her
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 02:57:PM
Seriously it's time for you to go, you are just here to cause trouble

Maggie has supported you so much in the past and you just turn on her


You are projecting Jackie

Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 02:58:PM
This is how grown ups debate


Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 03:00:PM
Seriously it's time for you to go, you are just here to cause trouble

Maggie has supported you so much in the past and you just turn on her

How can we bring harmony to the forum Jackie

Who's behaviour needs regulating
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Hartley. on October 10, 2017, 03:27:PM
How can we bring harmony to the forum Jackie

Who's behaviour needs regulating

We could ban Hartley, Mike, Maggie, Nugnug, Susan, Buddy, Steve, Justice, Jackie, Lucy, Jane, Sherlock, David, Lookout, Reader, Caroline, NGB, Stephanie, Adam & Kaldin.

It might do the trick.  :-\

Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 03:45:PM
We could ban Hartley, Mike, Maggie, Nugnug, Susan, Buddy, Steve, Justice, Jackie, Lucy, Jane, Sherlock, David, Lookout, Reader, Caroline, NGB, Stephanie, Adam & Kaldin.

It might do the trick.  :-\

The thing is Hartley ngb's post doesnt seem to have made a whole lot of difference (other than inflate Roch's ego  ;D), the bullying didn't stop and the atmosphere didn't seem to change. Roch by his own admittance, isn't here often. What has Roch based his observations on exactly? The few times he posts? I was here when Kaldin joined in 2011, so were you. What's that got to do with anything anyway?



Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 04:22:PM
The thing is Hartley ngb's post doesnt seem to have made a whole lot of difference (other than inflate Roch's ego  ;D), the bullying didn't stop and the atmosphere didn't seem to change. Roch by his own admittance, isn't here often. What has Roch based his observations on exactly? The few times he posts? I was here when Kaldin joined in 2011, so were you. What's that got to do with anything anyway?

Who appears to be the "bully" in my edited post above?

I've no idea what posts ngb read when he came on the forum last night nor indeed Roch for that matter in order for him to post what he did when he did. My observation was that Roch was stirring the pot.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Hartley. on October 10, 2017, 04:38:PM
I'm sure either side of the coin thinks the other's at fault.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: David1819 on October 10, 2017, 04:43:PM
How do we move forward from this?

You leaving would be a start.

The forum was much more peaceful before you returned. 
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 04:46:PM
I'm sure either side of the coin thinks the other's at fault.

Let's hope it can be resolved one way or another Hartley.  I don't know about you but I'm far too busy to keep up with it all.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 04:46:PM
You leaving would be a start.

The forum was much more peaceful before you returned.

Interesting




http://flyingmonkeysdenied.com/2015/11/26/narcissists-flying-monkeys-blame-shifting-traumatizes-victims/
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 10, 2017, 04:58:PM
This is how grown ups debate

I hadn't intended to get involved with this, but I think Steph's points are valid. Spats come, spats go. Each individual believes themselves to be in the 'right' corner. This wasn't the first and it won't be the last. I went through the whole thread twice this morning. I'm not sure I'd have called ALL of what was going on "bullying" but there was a hell of a lot of needling in play, fueled, I have no doubt, by a lot of individual agendas.

Not for the first time, in recent days, we had a conversation which was going round in circles from which it felt as if there was no escape. From what I saw, when I read through this morning, the object appeared to be to keep the circle going by switching between the point in question, being relevant and irrelevant. There were personal taunts. At the time I felt it to be provocative. This morning I remained convinced it was deliberate, something being said sounding like information passed on. I confess to allowing this to continue rather than walking away from it, however, I wasn't the only one being targeted. It also provided space for those with their own, and other agendas to jump on the bandwagon. It became a feeding frenzy.

However, I will point out one piece of bullying in particular. Since David has chosen to single me out as the recipient of his particular brand of 'humour', I've had him on ignore. I never address him, I never respond to him, but from time to time I get to see what he says when his post is quoted  -it's ALWAYS personal and usually consists of sexual innuendo. To the best of my knowledge, unless it's been done by pm, this has been ignored- last night, he overstepped the mark. His comment was SEXUALLY OFFENSIVE in it's implication.

There is certainly more than enough hostility here at the moment. There is also cause and effect. Poke anyone long enough, hard enough, and slyly enough and they'll respond.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Roch on October 10, 2017, 05:09:PM
The thing is Hartley ngb's post doesnt seem to have made a whole lot of difference (other than inflate Roch's ego  ;D), the bullying didn't stop and the atmosphere didn't seem to change. Roch by his own admittance, isn't here often. What has Roch based his observations on exactly? The few times he posts? I was here when Kaldin joined in 2011, so were you. What's that got to do with anything anyway?

My ego remained deflated, as I was aware that other members would call the situation differently than I did (and would therefore feel aggrieved).  However I took heart from the fact that independently, Kaldin appears to be forming similar conclusions to my own, regarding this forum.

I called the situation as I genuinely saw it  - based upon the following two things:

An increase in hostile attitudes towards Kaldin, that seemed in direct proportion to Kaldin becoming more sceptical about the prosecution's case and the views of certain members on here.

My own previous experiences on here - including what I have either been involved in or just witnessed.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 10, 2017, 05:18:PM
My ego remained deflated, as I was aware that other members would call the situation differently than I did (and would therefore feel aggrieved).  However I took heart from the fact that independently, Kaldin appears to be forming similar conclusions to my own, regarding this forum.

I called the situation as I genuinely saw it  - based upon the following two things:

An increase in hostile attitudes towards Kaldin, that seemed in direct proportion to Kaldin becoming more sceptical about the prosecution's case and the views of certain members on here.

My own previous experiences on here - including what I have either been involved in or just witnessed.

You know Roch, if I believe, for a SINGLE moment, that Kaldin was genuinely skeptical, I wouldn't have taken the stance I did. I actually put that point to them, several times, last night. They wouldn't engage. You're free to read it for yourself. It wasn't the first time Kaldin had done this. The format over angles and the bible were exactly the same. They took the debate round in circles by resorting to something very similar to the child who keeps repeating "Why" after everything which is said to it. I experience no serious intention to debate.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 05:25:PM
Kaldin joined the forum here http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,217.msg609.html#msg609
without introduction (as per forum rules) though they may have done since 2011? I don't have time to look
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Hartley. on October 10, 2017, 05:50:PM
Kaldin joined the forum here http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,217.msg609.html#msg609
without introduction (as per forum rules) though they may have done since 2011? I don't have time to look

We didn't have any rules back then.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 10, 2017, 08:32:PM
We didn't have any rules back then.

Do we now
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: petey on October 11, 2017, 02:46:AM
We could ban Hartley, Mike, Maggie, Nugnug, Susan, Buddy, Steve, Justice, Jackie, Lucy, Jane, Sherlock, David, Lookout, Reader, Caroline, NGB, Stephanie, Adam & Kaldin.

It might do the trick.  :-\

I feel privileged to escape the cull :)
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: susan on October 11, 2017, 11:11:AM
I feel privileged to escape the cull :)

petey   :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :))
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 11:35:AM
And I'm " Untouchable "  ;D :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :)) :))------- ::) Paranoid or what ??????
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 02:05:PM
I hadn't intended to get involved with this, but I think Steph's points are valid. Spats come, spats go. Each individual believes themselves to be in the 'right' corner. This wasn't the first and it won't be the last. I went through the whole thread twice this morning. I'm not sure I'd have called ALL of what was going on "bullying" but there was a hell of a lot of needling in play, fueled, I have no doubt, by a lot of individual agendas.

Not for the first time, in recent days, we had a conversation which was going round in circles from which it felt as if there was no escape. From what I saw, when I read through this morning, the object appeared to be to keep the circle going by switching between the point in question, being relevant and irrelevant. There were personal taunts. At the time I felt it to be provocative. This morning I remained convinced it was deliberate, something being said sounding like information passed on. I confess to allowing this to continue rather than walking away from it, however, I wasn't the only one being targeted. It also provided space for those with their own, and other agendas to jump on the bandwagon. It became a feeding frenzy.

However, I will point out one piece of bullying in particular. Since David has chosen to single me out as the recipient of his particular brand of 'humour', I've had him on ignore. I never address him, I never respond to him, but from time to time I get to see what he says when his post is quoted  -it's ALWAYS personal and usually consists of sexual innuendo. To the best of my knowledge, unless it's been done by pm, this has been ignored- last night, he overstepped the mark. His comment was SEXUALLY OFFENSIVE in it's implication.

There is certainly
more than enough hostility here at the moment. There is also cause and effect. Poke anyone long enough, hard enough, and slyly enough and they'll respond.

And rather than apologise and moderate his online behaviour - he escalates it and involes himself with one of THE worst offenders in the history of this forum

Whilst others stand by and pretend to ignore it
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 02:25:PM
And rather than apologise and moderate his online behaviour - he escalates it

Whilst others stand by and pretend to ignore it

And until now, my impression is that as far as supporters are concerned, it's been a case of "bring it on, the more the better" and I feel perfectly certain that, because he's not been prevented, he sees it as being given permission to continue. I've been warned by someone who's past history shows them to be very practiced at it, that internet bullying is against the law, but sexual harassment hasn't been mentioned. What David's vitriolic 'humour' has led him to IS sexual harassment.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 02:53:PM
And until now, my impression is that as far as supporters are concerned, it's been a case of "bring it on, the more the better" and I feel perfectly certain that, because he's not been prevented, he sees it as being given permission to continue. I've been warned by someone who's past history shows them to be very practiced at it, that internet bullying is against the law, but sexual harassment hasn't been mentioned. What David's vitriolic 'humour' has led him to IS sexual harassment.

I'd like to hear Roch's thought on this, especially given his recent posts about us "hardcore guilters" http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8686.msg415806.html#msg415806

 
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 02:59:PM
My ego remained deflated, as I was aware that other members would call the situation differently than I did (and would therefore feel aggrieved).  However I took heart from the fact that independently, Kaldin appears to be forming similar conclusions to my own, regarding this forum.

I called the situation as I genuinely saw it  - based upon the following two things:

An increase in hostile attitudes towards Kaldin, that seemed in direct proportion to Kaldin becoming more sceptical about the prosecution's case and the views of certain members on here.

My own previous experiences on here - including what I have either been involved in or just witnessed.

Why did you use Kaldin as your example? What was your logic behind it. Why not use Sherlock, Gringo, Jackie, Lookout or Mike to get your point across?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 03:12:PM
And until now, my impression is that as far as supporters are concerned, it's been a case of "bring it on, the more the better" and I feel perfectly certain that, because he's not been prevented, he sees it as being given permission to continue. I've been warned by someone who's past history shows them to be very practiced at it, that internet bullying is against the law, but sexual harassment hasn't been mentioned. What David's vitriolic 'humour' has led him to IS sexual harassment.






I haven't seen any sexual harassment ?? And I certainly wouldn't condone it if I saw it, and to involve others by surmising they'd say " bring it on " is beyond reproach.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 03:16:PM





I haven't seen any sexual harassment ?? And I certainly wouldn't condone it if I saw it, and to involve others by surmising they'd say " bring it on " is beyond reproach.

The problem is Lookout, you don't appear to be aware of the content of some of your own posts and there offensive nature, so it's unlikely you would notice

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8704.msg417569.html#msg417569
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Roch on October 11, 2017, 03:30:PM
Why did you use Kaldin as your example? What was your logic behind it. Why not use Sherlock, Gringo, Jackie, Lookout or Mike to get your point across?

Because over a relatively short period of time, I perceived a change attitudes towards Kaldin, when it became clear they were potentially moving further away from guilt and towards innocence.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 03:30:PM





I haven't seen any sexual harassment ?? And I certainly wouldn't condone it if I saw it, and to involve others by surmising they'd say " bring it on " is beyond reproach.

But you're not on the receiving end of it, are you? If you care to read his last side swipe ate me you won't fail to miss its sexual connotation, although, from the way you've upheld comments from certain other quarters -and it's OK, I'm not pointing a finger at something I've probably done myself- you may not think it's important. I can assure you that, publicly, bringing another person's sexuality into question. is entirely UNACCEPTABLE.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 03:33:PM
Because over a relatively short period of time, I perceived a change attitudes towards Kaldin, when it became clear they were potentially moving further away from guilt and towards innocence.

So you are saying Kaldin was bullied into submission ha ha come off it Roch you're smarter than that

Aren't you  ;D >:( :) ;)
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 03:35:PM
Because over a relatively short period of time, I perceived a change attitudes towards Kaldin, when it became clear they were potentially moving further away from guilt and towards innocence.

And whilst you were obsessing over your attitude toward 'supporters' you took your eye off the ball regarding the rest of us and how we are being treated

You focused your attention on your perceived notion because of your clear and apparent bias

Then ngb stepped in, in your favour - agreeing with your perception at that time.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Roch on October 11, 2017, 03:40:PM
So you are saying Kaldin was bullied into submission ha ha come off it Roch you're smarter than that

Aren't you  ;D >:( :) ;)

I don't know what you mean - you must be reading my post the wrong way?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 03:41:PM
But you're not on the receiving end of it, are you? If you care to read his last side swipe ate me you won't fail to miss its sexual connotation, although, from the way you've upheld comments from certain other quarters -and it's OK, I'm not pointing a finger at something I've probably done myself- you may not think it's important. I can assure you that, publicly, bringing another person's sexuality into question. is entirely UNACCEPTABLE.






I'm on the receiving end of crap every day,or time that I'm on this forum,so perhaps I was too pre-occupied to have seen whatever post it was. However,when the crap lands in your backyard-----it's not nice,is it !!! ???
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 03:44:PM
Because over a relatively short period of time, I perceived a change attitudes towards Kaldin, when it became clear they were potentially moving further away from guilt and towards innocence.

Might that have been around the time that I perceived a personality change in Kaldin, during which he became neither supporter nor detractor, but someone playing the childish game of "Why?" for their own amusement. I put this to then several times. There was no response. Not all of us here have a fervent belief either way and it can be used to advantage.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 03:50:PM
One thing for sure Kaldin would have seen a massive difference on the forum----not for the good either.
If he'd appeared as a staunch guilter would attitudes towards him have been different ? OF COURSE THEY WOULD.!
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 03:51:PM
Bullying can be displayed in both a covert and overt way and there are varying methods used by bullies.

https://bullyingnoway.gov.au/WhatIsBullying/Pages/Types-of-bullying.aspx

Who are the offenders?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 03:53:PM





I'm on the receiving end of crap every day,or time that I'm on this forum,so perhaps I was too pre-occupied to have seen whatever post it was. However,when the crap lands in your backyard-----it's not nice,is it !!! ???

As are most of us in some way, shape, or form. I guess it's part and parcel of forum life. There are certain adjectives Jackie uses which are just her way of saying Hi. One becomes oblivious, although on occasions it's amusing. However, there's crap of the acceptable type, which generally occurs during interaction,  and there's crap which ISN'T and is targeted at a poster who has no dealings with their attacker.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 03:58:PM
As are most of us in some way, shape, or form. I guess it's part and parcel of forum life. There are certain adjectives Jackie uses which are just her way of saying Hi. One becomes oblivious, although on occasions it's amusing. However, there's crap of the acceptable type, which generally occurs during interaction,  and there's crap which ISN'T and is targeted at a poster who has no dealings with their attacker.






Speaking of which I have Stephanie on ignore but it still doesn't stop her abuse towards me and that's even without me opening my mouth. So what's your answer to that  seeing as you know everything.?

Someone outside this forum is telling me and has told me to leave.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 03:58:PM
One thing for sure Kaldin would have seen a massive difference on the forum----not for the good either.
If he'd appeared as a staunch guilter would attitudes towards him have been different ? OF COURSE THEY WOULD.!

Looking at it objectively, Lookout, I'd have applied the same conclusion which ever side they CLAIMED to support. Those posts would STILL have taken the form of the "Why?" game.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 04:09:PM





Speaking of which I have Stephanie on ignore but it still doesn't stop her abuse towards me and that's even without me opening my mouth. So what's your answer to that  seeing as you know everything.?

Someone outside this forum is telling me and has told me to leave.

Would you like me to provide examples of your abusive posts towards me?

And  what's with the victim mentality anyway? You seem to blow hot and cold whenever it suits
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 04:11:PM





Speaking of which I have Stephanie on ignore but it still doesn't stop her abuse towards me and that's even without me opening my mouth. So what's your answer to that  seeing as you know everything.?

Someone outside this forum is telling me and has told me to leave.

From how I read how your posts are responded to, it seems to me that few interact with you. There are a small number who agree, but most responses are from those who disagree and with whom you're likely to be a tad prickly so they become equally -or MORE- prickly in return. Someone OUTSIDE of the forum, telling you to leave is a very different matter. How does a non forum member know you to be a member of this forum and how, unless they have your email addy, do they manage to contact you? Is their suggestion malevolent, OR are they offering you something better? Perhaps one of the reasons why you experience me as "knowing everything" is because I go on asking questions until I find satisfactory answers.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 04:12:PM
Looking at it objectively, Lookout, I'd have applied the same conclusion which ever side they CLAIMED to support. Those posts would STILL have taken the form of the "Why?" game.






All you and Caroline have asked me is WHY this,that and the other when I've posted.Can't you see this ?? Like I said,you don't like it when the tables are turned.
Kaldin was only doing what you and Caroline have been doing since changing stance.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 04:24:PM
From how I read how your posts are responded to, it seems to me that few interact with you. There are a small number who agree, but most responses are from those who disagree and with whom you're likely to be a tad prickly so they become equally -or MORE- prickly in return. Someone OUTSIDE of the forum, telling you to leave is a very different matter. How does a non forum member know you to be a member of this forum and how, unless they have your email addy, do they manage to contact you? Is their suggestion malevolent, OR are they offering you something better? Perhaps one of the reasons why you experience me as "knowing everything" is because I go on asking questions until I find satisfactory answers.

What I cannot fathom Jane is why those members who interact with her don't PM her to give her advice, which she may find helpful, instead of her having to seek advice off the forum from other quarters. And what advice, if any, is she being given?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 04:31:PM
From how I read how your posts are responded to, it seems to me that few interact with you. There are a small number who agree, but most responses are from those who disagree and with whom you're likely to be a tad prickly so they become equally -or MORE- prickly in return. Someone OUTSIDE of the forum, telling you to leave is a very different matter. How does a non forum member know you to be a member of this forum and how, unless they have your email addy, do they manage to contact you? Is their suggestion malevolent, OR are they offering you something better? Perhaps one of the reasons why you experience me as "knowing everything" is because I go on asking questions until I find satisfactory answers.






Ex member.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 04:31:PM





All you and Caroline have asked me is WHY this,that and the other when I've posted.Can't you see this ?? Like I said,you don't like it when the tables are turned.
Kaldin was only doing what you and Caroline have been doing since changing stance.

I concur that Caroline and I will challenge everything you say that we believe the FACTS to be wrong. We both have the qualifications to KNOW when it's wrong. I have my notes and books that I can refer to and I'm lucky enough to know people I can ask for verification, PLUS I'm more than ready to admit if I don't know something or if I've made a mistake. I see no shame in it. How else does one learn? Kaldin held threads to ransom for hours over things which ware no more than the opinion they CHOSE to apply to it. My feeling is that whatever Caroline and I said, they'd have said exactly the opposite. The result was boring and highly unintelligent bickering rather than solid debate.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 04:35:PM





Ex member.

Question again, I'm afraid, but I have little -NO- knowledge of how these things work. How can an EX member have access to your pm page?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 04:40:PM
I concur that Caroline and I will challenge everything you say that we believe the FACTS to be wrong. We both have the qualifications to KNOW when it's wrong. I have my notes and books that I can refer to and I'm lucky enough to know people I can ask for verification, PLUS I'm more than ready to admit if I don't know something or if I've made a mistake. I see no shame in it. How else does one learn? Kaldin held threads to ransom for hours over things which ware no more than the opinion they CHOSE to apply to it. My feeling is that whatever Caroline and I said, they'd have said exactly the opposite. The result was boring and highly unintelligent bickering rather than solid debate.






Your agreeing with anyone is now as rare as hens teeth so others are naturally going to pick up on this so what else do you expect other than an approach of trepidation,questioning and generally being " held to ransom  ? You've brought it on yourselves is all I can say------------tit for tat.

Erm-----------qualifications for what ?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 04:48:PM
Question again, I'm afraid, but I have little -NO- knowledge of how these things work. How can an EX member have access to your pm page?






Doesn't have to be a pm does it ?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 04:52:PM





Your agreeing with anyone is now as rare as hens teeth so others are naturally going to pick up on this so what else do you expect other than an approach of trepidation,questioning and generally being " held to ransom  ? You've brought it on yourselves is all I can say------------tit for tat.

Erm-----------qualifications for what ?




There was no "trepidation" on Kaldin's part, Lookout. As they said to Caroline "I'm not a shrinking violet" and if you read through their posts, you'll see this for yourself. I've witnessed nothing of the "shrinking violet" OR "trepidation" from either you, Jackie, or any other supporters, but from how you claim we've "bought it on yourselves" and that it was "tit for tat" it makes me wonder whether there may have been some collaboration?

Qualifications to challenge you when you've got it wrong and won't back down.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 04:56:PM





Doesn't have to be a pm does it ?

Then surely they must have your personal details. Why would you give your personal details out, AND are they telling you to "leave the forum" as a threat, OR are you telling them that you believe yourself to be under attack by those nasty guilters, ie Caroline and me, and they're telling you not to put up with it, and you should "leave the forum"?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 05:39:PM





I haven't seen any sexual harassment ?? And I certainly wouldn't condone it if I saw it, and to involve others by surmising they'd say " bring it on " is beyond reproach.

Ditto
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 05:40:PM
But you're not on the receiving end of it, are you? If you care to read his last side swipe ate me you won't fail to miss its sexual connotation, although, from the way you've upheld comments from certain other quarters -and it's OK, I'm not pointing a finger at something I've probably done myself- you may not think it's important. I can assure you that, publicly, bringing another person's sexuality into question. is entirely UNACCEPTABLE.

How do you expect to be treated with your vile behaviour, you are not in the slightest bit interested in the truth
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 05:50:PM
Qualifications
What a joke, you can hardly string a sentence together and cannot do a single post without abuse
The trouble is Kaldin is far to intelligent for the two of you
He had you running around in circles
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 05:50:PM
Qualifications
What a joke, you can hardly string a sentence together and cannot do a single post without abuse
The trouble is Kaldin is far to intelligent for the two of you
He had you running around in circles

Projection
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 05:51:PM





Your agreeing with anyone is now as rare as hens teeth so others are naturally going to pick up on this so what else do you expect other than an approach of trepidation,questioning and generally being " held to ransom  ? You've brought it on yourselves is all I can say------------tit for tat.

Erm-----------qualifications for what ?


Exactly Lookout  how funny
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 05:52:PM
Qualifications
What a joke, you can hardly string a sentence together and cannot do a single post without abuse
The trouble is Kaldin is far to intelligent for the two of you
He had you running around in circles

Kaldin may turn out to be a she for all we know.
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 05:54:PM

There was no "trepidation" on Kaldin's part, Lookout. As they said to Caroline "I'm not a shrinking violet" and if you read through their posts, you'll see this for yourself. I've witnessed nothing of the "shrinking violet" OR "trepidation" from either you, Jackie, or any other supporters, but from how you claim we've "bought it on yourselves" and that it was "tit for tat" it makes me wonder whether there may have been some collaboration?

Qualifications to challenge you when you've got it wrong and won't back down.

Collaboration, you are really sick, we don't pm each other every 2 minutes and we don't sit on a forum 24/7 you are the saddest person I have ever come across
No life and bitter
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 05:56:PM
Kaldin may turn out to be a she for all we know.

Who cares we all love Kaldin we have always way before you ever came on here

All the genuine people love Kaldin to bits
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 05:57:PM
Photos of me?

Unflattering?


Steph truly they are dreadful
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 05:58:PM
Who cares we all love Kaldin we have always way before you ever came on here

All the genuine people love Kaldin to bits

Sounds to me like Kaldin has some self esteem issues going on
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 05:58:PM

Steph truly they are dreadful

What are dreadful?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:00:PM
Who cares we all love Kaldin we have always way before you ever came on here

All the genuine people love Kaldin to bits

Who are these genuine people to which you refer

Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 06:01:PM
Collaboration, you are really sick, we don't pm each other every 2 minutes and we don't sit on a forum 24/7 you are the saddest person I have ever come across
No life and bitter

Utter vulgarity..................and projection
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 06:05:PM
Utter vulgarity..................and projection


Projection you and your sidekicks favourite word
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 11, 2017, 06:06:PM
Sounds to me like Kaldin has some self esteem issues going on

Kaldin is and always been one of the most confident people on here
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:08:PM
Kaldin is and always been one of the most confident people on here

You know nothing about it
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:11:PM
Collaboration, you are really sick, we don't pm each other every 2 minutes and we don't sit on a forum 24/7 you are the saddest person I have ever come across
No life and bitter

"No life and bitter"

I feel sorry for you in some ways because something clearly went wrong somewhere
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 06:11:PM

Projection you and your sidekicks favourite word

Well and accurately placed.
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:11:PM

Maggie and Ngb surely it's time this member was banned once again posting members personal details on an open forum

Stop your hypocrisy and projection

Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:13:PM
I still cannot get my head around WHY Roch used Kaldin as his example?

What were his motives for doing so

He's been called out for goading many times before
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 06:18:PM

Maggie and Ngb surely it's time this member was banned once again posting members personal details on an open forum

You have to be the most stupid person here if you're unable to see that the title of this thread is FORUM SPATS and recognize that YOU are the person responsible for 90% of them. The thread has been running quite happily all the afternoon -which, as I've already said CAN be checked- you poke your nose in and all hell erupts. I think this is all you live for Jackie. A famous saying goes "Where there is discord, let us bring harmony". Applied to you, it SHOULD read "Where there is harmony, lets see how quickly I can rip it apart".
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:21:PM
You have to be the most stupid person here if you're unable to see that the title of this thread is FORUM SPATS and recognize that YOU are the person responsible for 90% of them. The thread has been running quite happily all the afternoon -which, as I've already said CAN be checked- you poke your nose in and all hell erupts. I think this is all you live for Jackie. A famous saying goes "Where there is discord, let us bring harmony". Applied to you, it SHOULD read "Where there is harmony, lets see how quickly I can rip it apart".

I agree Jane though at the core I feel it's the fear of the truth coming to the surface that is her Achilles heal
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:35:PM
I know nothing about Kaldin nor do I care to know anything about them its doesn't interest me one iota

But what does interest me is when Jackie comes out in support of a person

She started a thread aimed at Kaldin which I found odd especially given the fact I'd just started posting on the forum again

From that point on I watched as history repeated itself

It became fairly obvious where it was all going to end
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:38:PM
Thought I should bring you back to the beginning of the thread Roch

In relation to the " forum spats" last night

* Ngb came on the forum and agreed with Roch's

* I disagreed with Roch's post or Ngb"s or both - can't remember

* Ngb referred to the forum atmosphere as "almost tribal" and said he "hates bullying" - who doesn't?

* Caroline observed the forum numbers went up


Who are the bullies and what is being done about it? And where is the "almost tribal" atmosphere coming from?



I have used the below as examples


Adam
Yesterday at 07.47 PM
Can the moderators show consistancy in their moderating.
I complained when David put up a poster saying I make things up. However was told it would not be removed.
If Lookout is untouchable on here, just tell the forum why.

David
Yesterday at 07.57 PM
I doubt it. If she was ever obsessing over someone having a shower, it would be none other than her one and only Caroline.

Kaldin
Yesterday 08.50 PM
Why on earth would she be moderated for that? Don't be silly.

Caroline
Yesterday at 08.06 PM
Not really - you're acting like a 3 year old. Anyone working on a farm all day would have a shower and you know it. You went on and on about the bible cover and ended up being wrong, the same with the rifle angles - now you're arguing over this. I was perfectly polite to you but if you want want to start that BS. then I give ans good as I get!

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.08 PM
You're the one who's answering for other posters, and you don't even know who you're speaking to some of the time.

It's just nonsense to assume that Jeremy would have had a shower that time of night, but you keep on and on insisting that he must have had one. Don't bother to threaten me - I'm not a shrinking violet myself.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.12 PM
Are you speaking for yourself or for Caroline now? It's difficult to tell

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.12 PM
Oh please - you know I'm not an idiot.  ^-^
Why does saying that Jeremy didn't necessarily have a shower mean I'm not a fence sitter? Are we judging his guilt or innocence on whether he showers at night or not now?

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.16 PM
Haha! You and your two mates spend hours discussing other posters.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.22 PM
Don't tell me what I thought. You're the one being absurd - insisting that someone would have had a shower is ridiculous.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 8.23 PM
No I didn't. I was merely discussing the issue of a shower or no-shower, and you and Jane got all arsy.

Jane J
Yesterday at 08:27 PM
All of which makes rather more sense than Kaldin dragging out something they appear to have absolutely no interest in other than amusement value.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08.37 PM
Do you have a point to make or are your eyes stuck?

Maggie
Yesterday at 08.45 PM
Maybe he just feels he needs to make a point, can't see that he's doing any harm. :-)

Kaldin
Yesterday at 08:30 PM
You see who's chucking the abuse around? It's you.

Maggie:
Yesterday at 08:34 PM 
I have to say I am with kaldin Jane, I am not emotionally involved in this case anymore.  My only hope is that JB is where he should be because if he is innocent it is beyond tragic.
If he's guilty and he's in prison why should I care?  He deserves to be where he is. :-X

Maggie
Yesterday at 08:42 PM »
I sense things may be getting personal.
Can posters please stick to the debate rather than attacking the poster.  cheers

Maggie
Yesterday at 09:42 PM »
I have locked this thread until I have time to sort it out.
Maybe it's time you all changed the subject.

Kaldin
Yesterday at 09.53 PM
Who rattled your cage? You seem very bitter.

Roch
Yesterday at 10:22 PM
Kaldin was treated with relative respect, until it became abundantly clear they were robustly questioning the guilty arguments (as canvassed by the guilt favouring members and the prosecution evidence). Then the insolence began

Ngb1066
Yesterday 10.32pm
As an administrator here I try to stand back from this Roch and avoid getting involved in forum spats, but I have to say I agree with you.  I am increasingly concerned at the general forum atmosphere.  It is becoming almost tribal, and that is not good.  I hate bullying and I am afraid that is what I am increasingly seeing here now.  I really wish it would stop.

Maggie
Yesterday at 11:01 PM »
I am locking this thread and if posters continue their bullying on another thread I shall start banning. It's gone far  enough



How do we move forward from this?

Isn't it down to each and everyone of us to regulate our forum behaviours and emotions; including past and present mods

It may have gone unnoticed to you but Caroline posted that night that she "was oot"

Why?

Was she bullied?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: lookout on October 11, 2017, 06:55:PM
I could debate with the likes of Kaldin all day without a cross word or argument whether he's for guilty,innocent or indifferent. I have with Steve and he's a staunch guilter. Along with Notsure,who's not sure and many others who've been and gone but the minute I'm left with no support,I'm targeted.
Woe betide anyone who comes along as a supporter,or who appears to be.

Maybe when nobody talks to me I have nothing in common with them.   It matters not to me, though you couldn't resist in saying that " few are actually in conversation with me " !!   
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 06:56:PM
Why do I need motives. There was pack behaviour on here a few months ago and I noticed hostility towards Kaldin very recently, so I spoke out about it.  Kaldin had already mentioned the pack behaviour towards Lookout.  Instead of looking for motives maybe you should be considering perceptions?

Why do you get out of bed in the morning Roch?

Whenever I post on the forum I experience pack mentality also. What's your perception on this Roch
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 11, 2017, 07:51:PM
I could debate with the likes of Kaldin all day without a cross word or argument whether he's for guilty,innocent or indifferent. I have with Steve and he's a staunch guilter. Along with Notsure,who's not sure and many others who've been and gone but the minute I'm left with no support,I'm targeted.
Woe betide anyone who comes along as a supporter,or who appears to be.

Maybe when nobody talks to me I have nothing in common with them.   It matters not to me, though you couldn't resist in saying that " few are actually in conversation with me " !!

Of course you could chat with people who believe the same as you, Lookout, but that's not debating and it couldn't last long because you'd run out of things to say pretty quickly. Besides which, I've not seen you have more than the odd exchange with any of them. You're NOT targeted when you're alone. You're targeted when you say something which is patently incorrect but passed off as fact as opposed to opinion. You could certainly say that if you choose not to talk to anyone it's because you don't have anything in common with them. When I said that "few are actually in conversation with you" what I meant -though it's interesting that you should turn it round to use against me- was that few have a running conversation with you, OR, if you prefer, or it makes it more acceptable, "you don't actually have running conversations with many".
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 08:15:PM
Qualifications
What a joke, you can hardly string a sentence together and cannot do a single post without abuse
The trouble is Kaldin is far to intelligent for the two of you
He had you running around in circles

I totally disagree
Title: Re: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 11, 2017, 08:18:PM

Steph truly they are dreadful

This is an admittance of guilt Jackie

Remember that online footprint I mentioned earlier
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 11:04:AM

There was no "trepidation" on Kaldin's part, Lookout. As they said to Caroline "I'm not a shrinking violet" and if you read through their posts, you'll see this for yourself. I've witnessed nothing of the "shrinking violet" OR "trepidation" from either you, Jackie, or any other supporters, but from how you claim we've "bought it on yourselves" and that it was "tit for tat" it makes me wonder whether there may have been some collaboration?

Qualifications to challenge you when you've got it wrong and won't back down.


You raise an interesting point about collaboration Jane

I guess as Roch says it's all down to perception and as you pointed out elsewhere morality

Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 12, 2017, 12:41:PM
Why do you get out of bed in the morning Roch?

Whenever I post on the forum I experience pack mentality also. What's your perception on this Roch


Without a shadow of doubt Roch is one of the most respected members posting on this forum and has obviously had access to some very exciting news which I am sure he will share when the time is right

How someone with your background and history has the audacity to question his character or posting beggars belief
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 12:42:PM

Without a shadow of doubt Roch is one of the most respected members posting on this forum and has obviously had access to some very exciting news which I am sure he will share when the time is right

How someone with your background and history has the audacity to question his character or posting beggars belief

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/sex-lies-trauma/201503/cyberstalking-the-fastest-growing-crime

Sounds like Roch is your "sidekick" Jackie
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: susan on October 12, 2017, 12:45:PM

Without a shadow of doubt Roch is one of the most respected members posting on this forum and has obviously had access to some very exciting news which I am sure he will share when the time is right

How someone with your background and history has the audacity to question his character or posting beggars belief

Jackie Roch is a great guy and a very honest one and he is highly respected on this forum think most will agree.
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 12:49:PM
Jackie Roch is a great guy and a very honest one and he is highly respected on this forum think most will agree.

We are back to perception again Susan
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 12:50:PM
Jackie Roch is a great guy and a very honest one and he is highly respected on this forum think most will agree.

And it appears you are Jackie's "sidekick"
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 12:52:PM
Jackie Roch is a great guy and a very honest one and he is highly respected on this forum think most will agree.

You appear to be the spokesperson for many Susan
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 12:54:PM
Jackie Roch is a great guy and a very honest one and he is highly respected on this forum think most will agree.

Do you think you are "highly respected" on this forum Susan

What point are you attempting to make anyway
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 01:03:PM

Without a shadow of doubt Roch is one of the most respected members posting on this forum and has obviously had access to some very exciting news which I am sure he will share when the time is right

In your opinion Jackie


What makes a respectable individual and do you consider yourself to be respectable

I ask because it's important to establish YOUR perception of respectability

Of course the same would apply to Susan

Does Susan consider herself to be a respectable individual, what does Susan base her idea of respectability on



Finally, do you think Bamber sees you as a respectable individual
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: JackieD on October 12, 2017, 01:11:PM
Jackie Roch is a great guy and a very honest one and he is highly respected on this forum think most will agree.


its true Susan
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Roch on October 12, 2017, 01:22:PM
Thanks for the compliments but there really is no need.  I am not the perfect poster / member... honestly  :))
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 01:28:PM
Thanks for the compliments but there really is no need.  I am not the perfect poster / member... honestly  :))

Would you refer to Jackie as respectable Roch?
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Jane on October 12, 2017, 01:34:PM
Thanks for the compliments but there really is no need.  I am not the perfect poster / member... honestly  :))

Sycophancy is alive and well, it seems. Well done for rising above it, Roch. 
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: susan on October 12, 2017, 01:34:PM
Thanks for the compliments but there really is no need.  I am not the perfect poster / member... honestly  :))

hahaha Roch modesty is another of your strong points :))
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 01:35:PM
hahaha Roch modesty is another of your strong points :))

Are you modest Susan
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 01:42:PM
Sycophancy is alive and well, it seems. Well done for rising above it, Roch.

Sycophants aka puppets  ::)

https://www.sott.net/article/298624-The-way-of-the-psychopath
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: David1819 on October 12, 2017, 01:48:PM
Sycophants aka puppets  ::)

https://www.sott.net/article/298624-The-way-of-the-psychopath

Mrs Psychobabble is at it again  ::)
Title: Re: FORUM SPATS
Post by: Stephanie on October 12, 2017, 01:51:PM
Mrs Psychobabble is at it again  ::)

Says Mr misogynist  ;) ;)