Author Topic: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!  (Read 978 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46866
Who in their right mind would take Sheila Caffell's bloodstains knickers home with them from the scene of the shooting tragedy, to wash them when all the other bloodstains items at the scene which the police did not seize where destroyed on a bonfire on the farms land?
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 23412
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2019, 06:37:PM »
She rinsed them out at WHF.

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46866
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2019, 08:53:PM »
She rinsed them out at WHF.

I was led to believe that she took the bucket away with her from the kitchen in the boot of her car, with the cold water that they had been soaking in still in the bucket!

In any event, simply rinsing such an item would not remove the clotted blood that must have been all over them. Everybody knows that heavily bloodstained garments such as blood soiled knickers from a ladies monthly cycle need a good soaking, and that a quick rinse would not have served to get rid of any blood evidence that the relatives might well have put to use later on...

I beleive its very significant that Ann Eaton took Sheila's rinsed knickers and the silencer away from the scene on the 10th August 1985. Why would anyone want to keep hold of such a personal garment belonging to a recently deceased lady?

Menstrual Blood in Silencer Set to Cause a Stink..

I am also very mindful of what DCS Ainsley reminded her to say prior to her attending the trial to testify if defence counsel suggested to her that the relatives could have easily contaminated the silencer with Sheila's menstrual blood from the knickers she had taken control of from the scene...

Ann Eaton said that you could tell the difference between ordinary blood and menstrual blood because of the smell of the later bloodt type! Ainsley reminded her to make sure that she remembered to say that if the matter should arise!

Menstrual Blood Smells differently..

Now, this I found to be very interesting, because no-one appears to have officially sniffed at the blood in or on the silencer to see whether the blood or not was Sheila's menstrual blood, or her usual venous blood? And Yet Ann Eaton must have sniffed at the silencer when the relatives had it in their possession to see if it was possible to tell from the smell of the blood that was on the siilencer or inside it, whether or not it was Sheila's menstrual blood?


And, here was Ainsley telling her to make sure that if she was asked about the possibility that the relatives had deliberately contaminated the silencer with Sheila's menstrual blood she was to tell them about the difference between both types of blood, which could be determined simply by smelling the blood!

How come the blood experts at the lab' knew nothing about this part of Ann Eatons explanation considering that she was involved in the find and handing over of the silencer - she kept Sheila's unsoaked knickers at her home along with the silencer1 Seems to me that Ann Eaton and the relatives must have been worried that the defence were going to be suggesting to them that they could have deliberately contaminated tghe suilencer with remnants of Sheila's menstraul blood from the knickers, or the bucket the knickers were transported away in from the scene...

None of the Lab' experts tested the blood for its smell, and perhaps that is where they made a mistake?

Perhaps the blood found on and inside the silencer was Sheila's menstraul blood, only in its dried formast - and who is to say that when menstraul blood and veneous blood dry separately that you can't tell the difference between one and the other?


What has always interested me, was the total absence of any PGM blood found in the results taken of the blood from the silencer, and I have always wondered whether this might have been to do with the breakdown of the blood when a female menstrates? Another thing which might require looking into is whether or not the deterioating condition of AK1 blood in a womans menstraul blood could adversley effect the AK2-1 blood enzyme from an unmenstrating female mixed together?

Sheila Caffell  - normal Venous Blood

Sheila Caffell - Menstraul Blood (According to Ann Eaton it smells differently to normal blood)..


I am not aware that any blood expert excluded any of the blood which has been attributed to any part of the silencer, inside or outside of it from potentially being menstraul Blood.....


(1) - https://biology.stackexchange.com/questions/21357/what-is-the-difference-between-regular-blood-a-womans-and-a-virgins-menstrual

(2) - https://biology.stackexchange.com/questions/54004/is-there-a-simple-test-that-can-differentiate-menstrual-blood-period-blood-fr


« Last Edit: January 28, 2019, 09:31:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 23412
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2019, 09:37:PM »
I was led to believe that she took the bucket away with her from the kitchen in the boot of her car, with the cold water that they had been soaking in still in the bucket!

In any event, simply rinsing such an item would not remove the clotted blood that must have been all over them. Everybody knows that heavily bloodstained garments such as blood soiled knickers from a ladies monthly cycle need a good soaking, and that a quick rinse would not have served to get rid of any blood evidence that the relatives might well have put to use later on...

I beleive its very significant that Ann Eaton took Sheila's rinsed knickers and the silencer away from the scene on the 10th August 1985. Why would anyone want to keep hold of such a personal garment belonging to a recently deceased lady?

Menstrual Blood in Silencer Set to Cause a Stink..

I am also very mindful of what DCS Ainsley reminded her to say prior to her attending the trial to testify if defence counsel suggested to her that the relatives could have easily contaminated the silencer with Sheila's menstrual blood from the knickers she had taken control of from the scene...

Ann Eaton said that you could tell the difference between ordinary blood and menstrual blood because of the smell of the later bloodt type! Ainsley reminded her to make sure that she remembered to say that if the matter should arise!

Menstrual Blood Smells differently..

Now, this I found to be very interesting, because no-one appears to have officially sniffed at the blood in or on the silencer to see whether the blood or not was Sheila's menstrual blood, or her usual venous blood? And Yet Ann Eaton must have sniffed at the silencer when the relatives had it in their possession to see if it was possible to tell from the smell of the blood that was on the siilencer or inside it, whether or not it was Sheila's menstrual blood?


And, here was Ainsley telling her to make sure that if she was asked about the possibility that the relatives had deliberately contaminated the silencer with Sheila's menstrual blood she was to tell them about the difference between both types of blood, which could be determined simply by smelling the blood!

How come the blood experts at the lab' knew nothing about this part of Ann Eatons explanation considering that she was involved in the find and handing over of the silencer - she kept Sheila's unsoaked knickers at her home along with the silencer1 Seems to me that Ann Eaton and the relatives must have been worried that the defence were going to be suggesting to them that they could have deliberately contaminated tghe suilencer with remnants of Sheila's menstraul blood from the knickers, or the bucket the knickers were transported away in from the scene...

None of the Lab' experts tested the blood for its smell, and perhaps that is where they made a mistake?

Perhaps the blood found on and inside the silencer was Sheila's menstraul blood, only in its dried formast - and who is to say that when menstraul blood and veneous blood dry separately that you can't tell the difference between one and the other?


What has always interested me, was the total absence of any PGM blood found in the results taken of the blood from the silencer, and I have always wondered whether this might have been to do with the breakdown of the blood when a female menstrates? Another thing which might require looking into is whether or not the deterioating condition of AK1 blood in a womans menstraul blood could adversley effect the AK2-1 blood enzyme from an unmenstrating female mixed together?

Sheila Caffell  - normal Venous Blood

Sheila Caffell - Menstraul Blood (According to Ann Eaton it smells differently to normal blood)..


I am not aware that any blood expert excluded any of the blood which has been attributed to any part of the silencer, inside or outside of it from potentially being menstraul Blood.....


(1) - https://biology.stackexchange.com/questions/21357/what-is-the-difference-between-regular-blood-a-womans-and-a-virgins-menstrual

(2) - https://biology.stackexchange.com/questions/54004/is-there-a-simple-test-that-can-differentiate-menstrual-blood-period-blood-fr


Soaking in cold water would remove the blood. Have you ever asked Bamber about the soaking clothes?

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46866
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2019, 09:46:PM »
Soaking in cold water would remove the blood. Have you ever asked Bamber about the soaking clothes?

Ann Eaton raised the difference between the smell of one type of blood, as opposed to another, when she was being coached on what to say when she testified, if asked any awkward questions...

Seems like a somewhat odd thing to say, out of the blue, must have had something dodgy in her mind when she raised that comment...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46866
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2019, 10:48:PM »
Now, the other truly amazing thing I stumbled upon very recently whilst reading through the papers in my possession, was that some human flesh or human tissue was found inside the threaded metal end cap of the silencer!
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46866
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2019, 10:51:PM »
Now, the other truly amazing thing I stumbled upon very recently whilst reading through the papers in my possession, was that some human flesh or human tissue was found inside the threaded metal end cap of the silencer!


The screw thread of the silencers metal end cap was airtight - s0 tight in fact that David Boutflour couldn't unscrew it because he said it was screwed on too tightly!


So, how on earth could some human flesh, or human tissue find its way into the air tight thread that I am talking about?
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 23412
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2019, 01:03:AM »
Ann Eaton raised the difference between the smell of one type of blood, as opposed to another, when she was being coached on what to say when she testified, if asked any awkward questions...

Seems like a somewhat odd thing to say, out of the blue, must have had something dodgy in her mind when she raised that comment...

It is an odd thing to say for the reason that I doubt something that had been soaking would have any smell. You didn't say whether Jeremy had mentioned the soaking articles to you previously?
« Last Edit: January 29, 2019, 01:04:AM by Caroline »

Offline David1819

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6463
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2019, 08:30:AM »
She rinsed them out at WHF.


No, she said she rinsed them out at WHF. Ann said does not equate to Ann did.

 :P
"A theory without facts is fantasy"

Offline David1819

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6463
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2019, 08:35:AM »
I was led to believe that she took the bucket away with her from the kitchen in the boot of her car, with the cold water that they had been soaking in still in the bucket!

In any event, simply rinsing such an item would not remove the clotted blood that must have been all over them. Everybody knows that heavily bloodstained garments such as blood soiled knickers from a ladies monthly cycle need a good soaking, and that a quick rinse would not have served to get rid of any blood evidence that the relatives might well have put to use later on...

I beleive its very significant that Ann Eaton took Sheila's rinsed knickers and the silencer away from the scene on the 10th August 1985. Why would anyone want to keep hold of such a personal garment belonging to a recently deceased lady?


Menstrual blood often contains flakes of clotted blood. I think its a very strong possibility that this is the type of blood flake that what was tested in the lab and this is what sealed JBs fate.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2019, 08:37:AM by David1819 »
"A theory without facts is fantasy"

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46866
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2019, 09:53:AM »
Menstrual blood often contains flakes of clotted blood. I think its a very strong possibility that this is the type of blood flake that what was tested in the lab and this is what sealed JBs fate.

Yeah, I go along with that /this possibility - the flake in question was almost certainly exhibit 'DB/1' (23) that got sent to the Lab' on 30th August 1985 (not the silencer under an entirely new 'guise)..
« Last Edit: January 30, 2019, 06:33:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline David1819

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6463
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2019, 10:13:AM »
Yeah, I go along with that /this possibility - the flake in question was almost certainly exhibit 'DB/1' (23) that got sent to the Lab' on 30th August 1985 (not the silencer under an entirely new disguise)..


Also what about that "blob of jam" looking blood on the silencer?

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3251067-late-period-then-blood-clot-tmi-picture-warning

 :o


« Last Edit: January 29, 2019, 10:14:AM by David1819 »
"A theory without facts is fantasy"

Offline mike tesko

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46866
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2019, 10:41:AM »

Also what about that "blob of jam" looking blood on the silencer?

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3251067-late-period-then-blood-clot-tmi-picture-warning

 :o


The 'Blob' of jam like substance raises some concern because the relatives don't say what happened to it - but something must have happened to it..
« Last Edit: January 29, 2019, 10:43:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 23412
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2019, 11:06:AM »

No, she said she rinsed them out at WHF. Ann said does not equate to Ann did.

 :P

So she took the bucket home then?  ;D ;D ;D ;D
« Last Edit: January 29, 2019, 11:09:AM by Caroline »

Offline Caroline

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 23412
Re: The Soiled underwear belonging to Sheila - catalyst for foul play!
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2019, 11:08:AM »
Menstrual blood often contains flakes of clotted blood. I think its a very strong possibility that this is the type of blood flake that what was tested in the lab and this is what sealed JBs fate.

Seriously David, you know nothing about this subject!  ::) How can you have a flake from something that has been soaking all night - use ya loaf!  ::)