Author Topic: Cops seized Jeremy’s answer phone and five audio recording tapes....  (Read 453 times)

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Offline mike tesko

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Cops believed that Neville Bambers call to Jeremy might have been captured on one of the audio tapes...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Cops believed that Neville Bambers call to Jeremy might have been captured on one of the audio tapes...

Results of the analysis were not disclosed...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Adam

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Mike did Jeremy turn his answering phone off every night before bed ?

Obviously he would not have reached the phone in time to answer Nevill's call, if the answering machine was on.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline mike tesko

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I remember vividly discussing this aspect of the investigation with Jeremy when I was incarcerated with him on B Wing at HMP Full Sutton on several occasions during late 1989 and July 1990...

Jeremy said that he answered his phone after two or three rings when his father called him that morning!

He said therefore the automatic recording mechanism on his answer phone did not get activated! As such there would have been no recording what his father said to him! He said he told the police that he had answered the phone call quickly..

However, he also suspected that the police thought that if he had been the killer, that he might have telephoned his own house number, so that his answer machine had recorded the connection from the farmhouse, or a snippet of conversation that had been fraudulently disguised to sound like it had been his father who had made the call to him, when in fact he might have made the call to himself! We talked about the workability of such a theorey! I said if he had been the killer, at the house making a disguised call to himself, it would have been rubbished Almost immediately because Jeremy was supposed to have answered the call from his father, not recorded it on his answer machine! Jeremy said he thought the police were hoping to find a recording to usurp his account but that they didn't find anything or they would have used it against him! I got the clear impression that Jeremy hadn't tried to use his answer phone to prove the call he received from his father had in fact been made! In any event, the phones at white house farm and Jeremy's cottage at Head Street, Goldhanger were bugged and every phone call made and received at both locations were constantly being monitored under a telecommunications Act warrant - the drugs squad who had Jeremy and his cronies under surveillance, knew that a call had been made from white house farm to Jeremy's cottage, before Neville Bamber had made his call to Chelmsford police as per the phone log timed at 3.26am! I think the exercise of the cops seizing Jeremy's answer phone and five audio tapes was simply done for taking purposes, since Neville Bamber almost certainly phoned the police at 3.26am, some 10 minutes before Jeremy himself ended up phoning them at 3.36am...

I spent many a long hour puzzling over the phone call issue..

I took advice from BT engineers, one who was retired, another who was currently working for them...

« Last Edit: October 03, 2018, 06:21:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Mike did Jeremy turn his answering phone off every night before bed ?

Obviously he would not have reached the phone in time to answer Nevill's call, if the answering machine was on.

Jeremy told me he always left his answer phone on, day and night and that it had a timer setting which I think he said had about three different settings, I think the settings were time orientated to the best of my recollection!
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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I spent many a long hour puzzling over the phone call issue..

I took advice from BT engineers, one who was retired, another who was currently working for them...

There were several contentious issues which I felt needed to be investigated and explained properly, some of these issues might have been misrepresented during Jeremy's trial!
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Adam

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I remember vividly discussing this aspect of the investigation with Jeremy when I was incarcerated with him on B Wing at HMP Full Sutton on several occasions during late 1989 and July 1990...

Jeremy said that he answered his phone after two or three rings when his father called him that morning!

He said therefore the automatic recording mechanism on his answer phone did not get activated! As such there would have been no recording what his father said to him! He said he told the police that he had answered the phone call quickly..

However, he also suspected that the police thought that if he had been the killer, that he might have telephoned his own house number, so that his answer machine had recorded the connection from the farmhouse, or a snippet of conversation that had been fraudulently disguised to sound like it had been his father who had made the call to him, when in fact he might have made the call to himself! We talked about the workability of such a theorey! I said if he had been the killer, at the house making a disguised call to himself, it would have been rubbished Almost immediately because Jeremy was supposed to have answered the call from his father, not recorded it on his answer machine! Jeremy said he thought the police were hoping to find a recording to usurp his account but that they didn't find anything or they would have used it against him! I got the clear impression that Jeremy hadn't tried to use his answer phone to prove the call he received from his father had in fact been made! In any event, the phones at white house farm and Jeremy's cottage at Head Street, Goldhanger were bugged and every phone call made and received at both locations were constantly being monitored under a telecommunications Act warrant - the drugs squad who had Jeremy and his cronies under surveillance, knew that a call had been made from white house farm to Jeremy's cottage, before Neville Bamber had made his call to Chelmsford police as per the phone log timed at 3.26am! I think the exercise of the cops seizing Jeremy's answer phone and five audio tapes was simply done for taking purposes, since Neville Bamber almost certainly phoned the police at 3.26am, some 10 minutes before Jeremy himself ended up phoning them at 3.36am...

I spent many a long hour puzzling over the phone call issue..

I took advice from BT engineers, one who was retired, another who was currently working for them...

Thanks Mike. Yes it would have been the norm to leave an answering machine on 24/7. As it is now.

Two or three rings Mike ? He told the police he slept 'like a log' that night.

It would be at least 2 or 3 minutes before he woke, realised the phone was ringing, decided to answer it & went downstairs.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2018, 06:28:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline mike tesko

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There were several contentious issues which I felt needed to be investigated and explained properly, some of these issues might have been misrepresented during Jeremy's trial!

One such issue, concerned Jeremy's claim that after the phone line went dead at the conclusion of his father's call to him, Jeremy had stood steadfast in asserting that he tried to ring his father back several times, or a few times, but that he had got a constant engaged tone each time he had tried! Some people were suggesting that he wouldn't have been able to dial his father's telephone back until several minutes had elapsed, or that because the telephone handset of the telephone in the kitchen back at the farmhouse was off its cradle when cops eventually entered the kitchen hours later, that the line between the farmhouse and Jeremy's cottage at Goldhanger would have remained open continuously! In fact, all that would have been required, was for Neville Bamber to depress the cradle and within a very short space of time, he would have got a dialling tone and been able to make another call to somewhere else from the farmhouse! This was because the call was made from white house farm to 9 Head Street, Goldhanger! If Jeremy had tried to do the same thing in these circumstances he would not have got a dialling tone, or been able to make another call to anywhere else, or to anyone else, the line would have remained open each time he depressed the cradle of his own phone...

I was interested in why Jeremy was so adamant that each time he tried to ring his father back, how he kept saying that he kept getting a constant engaged tone, even though prosecution witnesses were saying that he couldn't have!

But...

As we shall see, Jeremy was telling the truth...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Thanks Mike. Yes it would have been the norm to leave an answering machine on 24/7. As it is now.

Two or three rings Mike ? He told the police he slept 'like a log' that night.

It would be at least 2 or 3 minutes before he woke, realised the phone was ringing, decided to answer it & went downstairs.

My understanding, Adam was that he had a contemporary phone plugged in downstairs, and his answer phone on his bedside cabinet! I think that was one of the reasons why the cops seized the answer phone in the first instance, because Jeremy had answered the phone so quickly! He assured me that he had answered his father's call really quickly thinking that it might have been Julie Mugford' ringing him wanting more drugs to sell...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Adam

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My understanding, Adam was that he had a contemporary phone plugged in downstairs, and his answer phone on his bedside cabinet! I think that was one of the reasons why the cops seized the answer phone in the first instance, because Jeremy had answered the phone so quickly! He assured me that he had answered his father's call really quickly thinking that it might have been Julie Mugford' ringing him wanting more drugs to sell...

Thanks Mike. So Jeremy answered his phone in bed.

I thought Julie was not able to dial out from her home phone ?
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline mike tesko

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I was interested in why Jeremy was so adamant that each time he tried to ring his father back, how he kept saying that he kept getting a constant engaged tone, even though prosecution witnesses were saying that he couldn't have!

But...

As we shall see, Jeremy was telling the truth...

I was reliably informed that because Neville Bamber had instigated the call to Jeremy, that all Neville Bamber had to do was depress the cradle of the phone only once and that this would cut the connection between white house farm and Jeremy at his cottage! As soon as Neville did this he would eventually get a dialling tone in the handset back at White House farm! There might have been a slight delay before Neville actually got a fresh dialling tone but the upshot of this was that once Neville got a fresh dialling tone, he could dial a different number - he in fact, called the police station at Witham, and because there was no one on hand to take his call, his call was switched by the automatic switching system and he was put through to the control room at Chelmsford police station, the time he actually got out through to them was at 3.26am...

Now..

From Jeremy's perspective, no sooner did the call he was receiving get cut off, than Jeremy is frantically trying to re-establish contact with his father at white house farm. He gets a dialling tone after depressing the cradle of his own phone and he dials his father's number at white house farm, but gets a constant engaged tone, suggesting that his father is talking to somebody else, or trying to phone Jeremy back! It is irrelevant whether or not back at White House farm, Neville not only has got a dialling tone, or whether he had already dialled the telephone number of Witham police station, or even if his call there was already switched by the automatic out of hours call switch system that diverted his call to the control room at Chelmsford police station by 3.26am, at each step of the way every time Jeremy attempted to re-establish contact with his father he would always get an engaged tone, a constant engaged tone, and this is precisely what Jeremy had always been maintaining before his trial, during his trial, and afterwards, despite prosecution witnesses and the prosecutor claiming that it couldn't have happened like he said it did and had...

They were wrong, and Jeremy was right!
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Thanks Mike. So Jeremy answered his phone in bed.

I thought Julie was not able to dial out from her home phone ?

She used a pay phone on the occasions she needed to contact him, close to her bedsit...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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I was still not entirely happy with what I had managed to find out from the two telephone engineers I received technical information from about the states of the telephones, and who could do what, this, that or the other - I wanted to know as much as possible about what could have made Neville Bambers call to his son, Jeremy go dead...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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I was still not entirely happy with what I had managed to find out from the two telephone engineers I received technical information from about the states of the telephones, and who could do what, this, that or the other - I wanted to know as much as possible about what could have made Neville Bambers call to his son, Jeremy go dead...

They wanted to know what type of telephone was being used by Neville Bamber back at White House farm at the time his call was made to Jeremy when it was supposed to have gone dead, and been cut off abruptly?

I said that as far as I am aware the phone in question was a round finger dial phone!
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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They wanted to know what type of telephone was being used by Neville Bamber back at White House farm at the time his call was made to Jeremy when it was supposed to have gone dead, and been cut off abruptly?

I said that as far as I am aware the phone in question was a round finger dial phone!

Ooooh, I was told...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...