Author Topic: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...  (Read 3702 times)

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Offline maggie

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #30 on: June 08, 2018, 07:29:PM »




They did and I read one of her books Lookout, was quite a while ago and can't remember much about it but I was curious at the time.
Sheila and Colin often visited the clairvoyant friend of theirs--------mentioned in his book.

Offline Jane

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #31 on: June 08, 2018, 07:30:PM »





Sheila and Colin often visited the clairvoyant friend of theirs--------mentioned in his book.

It is. I think both she and Colin were spiritual. It wouldn't have impacted on his atheism.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #32 on: June 09, 2018, 12:29:PM »
For the first time I found myself looking into the contents of Sheila's letter and reading what is possibly an underlying message. She makes it clear that she hadn't wanted to be there. WHY is she telling Ann and Peter that she's not in hospital because of gynae problems. She seems to feel it's important that they know this and goes into huge detail to refute it. Might it be that June had told them that this was the reason she was there? She seems to be admitting that there HAD been a problem, ie she'd OD'd on God. She speaks very openly about her confused thinking, but she also speaks of it being in the past.  The PS about her having "found God in a simple way" almost sounds as if she'd telling them that she's not involved with something which is anything out of the ordinary.
I think this letter is quite touching. However I think it was written in March 1985 and the "all people are bad and should be killed" remark in June if I recall the chronology of the CAL book.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2018, 12:30:PM by Steve_uk »

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #33 on: June 09, 2018, 12:33:PM »




It may surprise you that it's not only " inheritance killers " who plan in advance. Killers are cold-blooded whether sane or not.
Do you really think Sheila was planning killing in advance when she was vacant at the party, didn't speak on the way down to the Farm, was blank at the Tiptree shop with lipstick smudged on teeth, was listless all week as she sat round the table with her parents and hardly had strength to pick up the telephone, let alone make conversation with Auntie Pam..
« Last Edit: June 09, 2018, 12:34:PM by Steve_uk »

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #34 on: June 09, 2018, 12:35:PM »
This thread really is about Sheila's state of mind in the run-up to the murders and whether she was influenced in any way by her Bible reading.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #35 on: June 09, 2018, 12:39:PM »
People are religious in their own ways. Sheila's faith was nothing like June's in my opinion. June was a god fearing fundamentalist living day by day as the bible teaches. Whereas Sheila got into it for emotional reasons as her life was going downhill.
But did she ever reject God or was it true as she claimed that she had "found God in a simple way"
« Last Edit: June 09, 2018, 12:40:PM by Steve_uk »

Offline lookout

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #36 on: June 09, 2018, 12:45:PM »
Do you really think Sheila was planning killing in advance when she was vacant at the party, didn't speak on the way down to the Farm, was blank at the Tiptree shop with lipstick smudged on teeth, was listless all week as she sat round the table with her parents and hardly had strength to pick up the telephone, let alone make conversation with Auntie Pam..





There's every possibility that she'd put deep thought into what she had intended to carry out. Timings for instance of farm workers arriving early morning so the " deed " would have to have been done in advance of that thought.
Her dreaded thoughts of the possibility of losing her sons,a nightmare in itself and of course the last night before the twins were due to go away in the next day or two,so the killings had to be that night come what may.
Sheila must also have pondered her own future in her time of desperation.
It's little wonder that there was nothing else left for her to do other than to wipe away all the misery.

Offline lookout

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #37 on: June 09, 2018, 12:50:PM »
People do sink to their lowest ebb and see no way out.Nobody can foretell or foresee what a person is thinking or what their next move is going to be.
Separation plays a huge part in suicides and a lot of people can't cope or deal with it.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #38 on: June 09, 2018, 12:54:PM »
The point is whether there's something contained in Sheila's bible reading of which Jeremy could claim to have no knowledge but which would implicate her in the crime. Remember he claimed to Julie that this was the "perfect crime", so no trail leading to him, no forensic evidence, him gambling that he had done enough to rope her in as an accessory should she disclose, which makes me think he didn't care much for her in the first place, that she was a mere expedient in the whole process.

Offline Jane

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #39 on: June 09, 2018, 12:58:PM »
But did she ever reject God or was it true as she claimed that she had "found God in a simple way"

Steve, reading her letter properly has lead me to believe that Sheila's belief in God was not the all consuming obsession that June's appeared to be. I'd have called it within the parameters of balanced. The letter indicates -by her use of the past tense- that she knew she'd once had very confused thoughts.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #40 on: June 09, 2018, 01:01:PM »
Steve, reading her letter properly has lead me to believe that Sheila's belief in God was not the all consuming obsession that June's appeared to be. I'd have called it within the parameters of balanced. The letter indicates -by her use of the past tense- that she knew she'd once had very confused thoughts.
Yes that's my reading of it as well Jane. I suppose the Defence would have to argue that there was significant deterioration of her though processes in the following four months.

Offline Jane

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #41 on: June 09, 2018, 01:04:PM »




There's every possibility that she'd put deep thought into what she had intended to carry out. Timings for instance of farm workers arriving early morning so the " deed " would have to have been done in advance of that thought.
Her dreaded thoughts of the possibility of losing her sons,a nightmare in itself and of course the last night before the twins were due to go away in the next day or two,so the killings had to be that night come what may.
Sheila must also have pondered her own future in her time of desperation.
It's little wonder that there was nothing else left for her to do other than to wipe away all the misery.


Why would she have had thoughts about the possibility of losing the boys? Colin had them already. She had unlimited access. Why would their going away be any different from when they were with Colin during the week?

Offline lookout

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #42 on: June 09, 2018, 01:24:PM »

Why would she have had thoughts about the possibility of losing the boys? Colin had them already. She had unlimited access. Why would their going away be any different from when they were with Colin during the week?






Colin had been very worried about leaving the boys in the sole company of Sheila----hence the letter pleading with Nevill that he,Colin,has 100% guardianship of them.
Why was this do you think because in my book it's unusual for a mother not to have full custody of her children ?

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #43 on: June 09, 2018, 01:28:PM »





Colin had been very worried about leaving the boys in the sole company of Sheila----hence the letter pleading with Nevill that he,Colin,has 100% guardianship of them.
Why was this do you think because in my book it's unusual for a mother not to have full custody of her children ?
But that wasn't his main concern in that last letter, but June's influence over them.

Offline Jane

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Re: The Bible - secrets of the tragedy...
« Reply #44 on: June 09, 2018, 01:32:PM »





Colin had been very worried about leaving the boys in the sole company of Sheila----hence the letter pleading with Nevill that he,Colin,has 100% guardianship of them.
Why was this do you think because in my book it's unusual for a mother not to have full custody of her children ?

Leaving aside her mental state, she was probably -if her various career attempts are anything to go by- psychologically flaky. Possibly because she'd had little experience of running a home and family without outside help. Possibly because she simply wasn't interested. It was certainly more unusual then, than now, for a mother not to have full custody of her children, but I'm willing to bet Sheila wasn't the only such case.