Re: Utility Bills by Lookout

[lookout]

It seems to be a bone of contention over exactly WHAT they've seen/read. Supporters deny they've seen/shown relevant items but there are WS to say that these items have been seen/shown. Then there's the case of the logs. Supporters seem not to know what the jury saw and what they didn't, and the fact that the new legal team are scratching at everything possible to find any little thing they can use as a challenge tells it's own story.

I feel pretty sure that you're a person who would scrutinise any sort of information before you put pen to paper,or do you just take things as read ? Wouldn't you ever challenge something like a bill if you thought it was wrong ?

[Jane]

I feel pretty sure that you're a person who would scrutinise any sort of information before you put pen to paper,or do you just take things as read ? Wouldn't you ever challenge something like a bill if you thought it was wrong ?

I've rarely challenged a bill -that was M's forte. We'd do the weekly shop and he'd tell the cashier what it would come to within 50 pence and was never wrong- my maths aren't good enough. That's the thing with challenging, isn't it? One HAS to be certain one is right -or at least won't be counter challenged by someone who knows better- or risk making a total fool of oneself. HOW, for instance, does one resolve what the jury were/weren't shown? If, for argument's sake, the jury could be asked, what's the betting some would say they'd seen it and others would deny having seen it.

[lookout]

I've rarely challenged a bill -that was M's forte. We'd do the weekly shop and he'd tell the cashier what it would come to within 50 pence and was never wrong- my maths aren't good enough. That's the thing with challenging, isn't it? One HAS to be certain one is right -or at least won't be counter challenged by someone who knows better- or risk making a total fool of oneself. HOW, for instance, does one resolve what the jury were/weren't shown? If, for argument's sake, the jury could be asked, what's the betting some would say they'd seen it and others would deny having seen it.

It's a known fact that women are more likely to be conned/fleeced than men are. I've had to stand on my own two feet since 1994,time enough to know when you are being hoodwinked and in my case it's paid off, not to be taken in by anyone or  be it the banks,utilities,groceries,solicitors or whatever. I'm certainly not an old grouse,far from it,but nobody gets one over on me.

As I've said,that in the face of the evidence given to them,the jury were right in their decision. All you have to do is read into what I've sad about the jury.

[Jane]

It's a known fact that women are more likely to be conned/fleeced than men are. I've had to stand on my own two feet since 1994,time enough to know when you are being hoodwinked and in my case it's paid off, not to be taken in by anyone or  be it the banks,utilities,groceries,solicitors or whatever. I'm certainly not an old grouse,far from it,but nobody gets one over on me.

As I've said,that in the face of the evidence given to them,the jury were right in their decision. All you have to do is read into what I've sad about the jury.

There's the huge difference between us, Lookout. You appear to take it as read that people are out to fleece you. I don't. Why would they, deliberately? Naturally, I'm not going to get it right every time -these people don't have "con artist" written across their foreheads, not that foreheads are visible over the phone- but do you?

[lookout]

There's the huge difference between us, Lookout. You appear to take it as read that people are out to fleece you. I don't. Why would they, deliberately? Naturally, I'm not going to get it right every time -these people don't have "con artist" written across their foreheads, not that foreheads are visible over the phone- but do you?

I NEVER expect to be fleeced,certainly not by large companies who you're reliant on throughout your life.
It has everything to do with trust/mistrust, something that my late husband and his father before him were past-masters at teaching the difference because of being business people.

An example for me at this moment is that one of the big power companies sent me quite a large electric bill which covered the summer months ( not expected in the summer ) I pay quarterly so therefore have my meter read. I queried this bill and they told me that my meter hadn't been read for 12 months ! So I asked them who the daft old sod was that came to read the meter,but they were adamant it hadn't been read.
To cut a long story short,it's my word against the company that the meter was read as their insistence is that they've been estimated bills,which I know not to be true,but I have no choice but to pay nigh on £300 for a summer " heating " bill,as it's a stalemate situation unless I gathered all my bills together for a legal challenge of which I'm not prepared to enter as I just can't be bothered.

I wouldn't mind but I've remained loyal to the company and have been with the same bank for 50 years.
No dishonesty in my life. but there's a lot of incompetency abound which is the bain of my life.

[Caroline]

I NEVER expect to be fleeced,certainly not by large companies who you're reliant on throughout your life.
It has everything to do with trust/mistrust, something that my late husband and his father before him were past-masters at teaching the difference because of being business people.

An example for me at this moment is that one of the big power companies sent me quite a large electric bill which covered the summer months ( not expected in the summer ) I pay quarterly so therefore have my meter read. I queried this bill and they told me that my meter hadn't been read for 12 months ! So I asked them who the daft old sod was that came to read the meter,but they were adamant it hadn't been read.
To cut a long story short,it's my word against the company that the meter was read as their insistence is that they've been estimated bills,which I know not to be true,but I have no choice but to pay nigh on £300 for a summer " heating " bill,as it's a stalemate situation unless I gathered all my bills together for a legal challenge of which I'm not prepared to enter as I just can't be bothered.

I wouldn't mind but I've remained loyal to the company and have been with the same bank for 50 years.
No dishonesty in my life. but there's a lot of incompetency abound which is the bain of my life.

How much would you generally use during the summer?

[lookout]

How much would you generally use during the summer?

Less than £100 for starters. What the company have done,because they say that they were estimated bills,is lump 12 months of estimates then adjust it when I phoned in the readings last week. I keep all bills and out of their 12 month estimates,there are only two,which were this years and also big bills as one was the winter one.
If I hadn't opened my mouth and complained about the first bill they sent £157 ( which was high for summer ) then I wouldn't have received the much higher one of £276 two days later,which they said was " adjusted ".

This year I've paid two quarters-----January@ £248,then June @ £264-----and now this latest one @ £276.

[lookout]

This time last year all I paid was £15.73 ! Because they deducted the annual saving of £74.

[Reader]

Is the reading used in your latest bill the same as the reading you supplied by telephone? If so, will your account be substantially in credit once the latest bill is paid?

[lookout]

Is the reading used in your latest bill the same as the reading you supplied by telephone? If so, will your account be substantially in credit once the latest bill is paid?

Yes,I'll say it'll be in credit,but my problem will remain to be that I'll never know what past readings will ever " accurately " be because of the company saying that bills were always estimated.
It'll be like starting afresh as I'll be reading the meter myself on the 1st of every month so that when I receive my bill it can,or should then be calculated on usage for the quarter.
Whether or not overpayment will then be detected is anyone's guess,but if there's a marked difference it should be adjusted to past usage.
It would seem that both this company and the water company also have problems with quarterly cash bills as opposed to paying monthly by direct debit ( which I won't have on principal because both have fleeced me ) as with direct debit they can " take " what they like or what they think fit,whereas sending a bill is at least something visible even if they do get it wrong ! Neither seem to like paper bills !

However I've reluctantly paid the electric bill so I hope they can bother to spot the error of their ways after a couple of readings before the next bill is due in November.
I did phone CAB about it all and they said pretty much the same as I in that it's my word against theirs that the meter had been read. Afterall,I should know because I let the old man in to read it .They were saying it hadn't been read for 12 months,so it's stalemate.
I literally couldn't be bothered " fighting " a large company. Maybe if I'd been younger.
 

[Reader]

I keep all bills . . .

Each bill shows readings as estimated or actual, so by looking through the bills, you can easily find actual readings separated by one year. The difference between those readings gives your consumption over one year. That information allows you to use certain comparison sites that compare all the suppliers.

Paying your adjusted quarterly bill after supplying your own meter reading shouldn't leave your account in credit.

Despite your past experiences with a monthly direct debit, I would suggest you reconsider it. Just check each payment that is taken. If a significant mistake occurs, such as a payment being taken twice, demand an immediate refund. If they refuse, and you're certain that an unauthorized payment was taken, you can require your bank to refund you.

[lookout]

Received an adjusted bill a couple of days ago---------£133.33 overpayment. Summer bill now £46.87.

[Steve_uk]

The energy bills are now completely out of hand. https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/cost-of-living/martin-lewis-says-people-could-24858826

[Cambridgecutie]

The energy bills are now completely out of hand. https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/cost-of-living/martin-lewis-says-people-could-24858826

I find Martin Lewis a bit dramatic.  I'm looking at ways to cut my consumption for several reasons: good for environment, saves money and the challenge of trying to beat the system! 

Lets consider all the ways we could save on domestic energy use for those of us that are not too young or old and in good health. 

A former navy officer told me years ago the best way to keep warm is to ensure the ankles, wrists and neck are covered which seems to work.  Also the head.  I will be wearing long sleeved thermal tops and bottoms, boot slippers and a beanie hat.   

Use a thermometer to identify any cold spots and attempt to solve by insulating etc.

Set appliances such as washing machine and dishwasher to come on during night tariff which uses cheaper rates of elec/gas.

Get up earlier or go to bed later and shower during night tariff as above.

Check the humidity level.  If its high consider a dehumidifier as it costs more to heat moist air than dry air. 

Collect old scraps of wood for a firepit in garen.  Kiln dried is best as it doesn't smoke as much but I find its more expensive than indoor heating.  But I've only bought small bags from the likes of B &M.  It might be more cost effective to bulk buy.

Use energy efficient bulbs and/or candles.

Consider turning off freezer and walking to supermarket in evening to buy food more frequently.  Turn heating down or off when going to supermarket and get some cardio and weight bearing exercise too.  You can put headphones on and listen to music or whatever if its safe to do so. 

Go for a run or walk in evening if its safe to do so turning down/off heating.

Go to pub in evening turning down/off heating.

Go to gym or whatever the preferred social activity is in evening turning down/off heating.

Make a flask of hot drink that's always available to sip on.  Maybe a hot toddy!

Check the weather forecast to plan in advance ie if its going to be really cold go out.  If in appropriate clothes and moving you don't feel cold. 

I'm sure others can add their own ideas....

[Steve_uk]

I find Martin Lewis a bit dramatic.  I'm looking at ways to cut my consumption for several reasons: good for environment, saves money and the challenge of trying to beat the system! 

Lets consider all the ways we could save on domestic energy use for those of us that are not too young or old and in good health. 

A former navy officer told me years ago the best way to keep warm is to ensure the ankles, wrists and neck are covered which seems to work.  Also the head.  I will be wearing long sleeved thermal tops and bottoms, boot slippers and a beanie hat.   

Use a thermometer to identify any cold spots and attempt to solve by insulating etc.

Set appliances such as washing machine and dishwasher to come on during night tariff which uses cheaper rates of elec/gas.

Get up earlier or go to bed later and shower during night tariff as above.

Check the humidity level.  If its high consider a dehumidifier as it costs more to heat moist air than dry air. 

Collect old scraps of wood for a firepit in garen.  Kiln dried is best as it doesn't smoke as much but I find its more expensive than indoor heating.  But I've only bought small bags from the likes of B &M.  It might be more cost effective to bulk buy.

Use energy efficient bulbs and/or candles.

Consider turning off freezer and walking to supermarket in evening to buy food more frequently.  Turn heating down or off when going to supermarket and get some cardio and weight bearing exercise too.  You can put headphones on and listen to music or whatever if its safe to do so. 

Go for a run or walk in evening if its safe to do so turning down/off heating.

Go to pub in evening turning down/off heating.

Go to gym or whatever the preferred social activity is in evening turning down/off heating.

Make a flask of hot drink that's always available to sip on.  Maybe a hot toddy!

Check the weather forecast to plan in advance ie if its going to be really cold go out.  If in appropriate clothes and moving you don't feel cold. 

I'm sure others can add their own ideas....

Yes. Fill a hot water bottle..