Author Topic: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 4 second phone call.  (Read 661 times)

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Offline Jane J

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2017, 10:08:AM »
Hi Jane, I know this is a hypothetical argument as it cannot be anything else without more input.
The logical reply could be 'Why wouldn't he?', because we don't know enough.  In an emergency situation we have to make quick choices, no time for pondering, weighing up pros and cons therefore it may have been reflex to phone his son.
In my life it's an unnatural and stressful act to phone the police, certainly not a reflex action.
In a similar context and similar situation to that facing Nevill, I cannot honestly be sure what I would do.

Maggie, if it had been Nevill's normal course of action to call Jeremy, I could have understood the call, but I don't believe it was. I HAVE been faced with a situation that I wasn't qualified to cope with. My choice was EITHER stand there, helpless, which could have, potentially lead to a death I'd never have forgiven myself for allowing to happen, OR phone someone qualified to cope with it. What would you have done?

If we go back to what happened prior to Sheila's last admission to hospital -and admittedly, the situation was different because Freddie wasn't related to her- doctors were called (although I can't recall the sequence of events) I don't believe Nevill called Jeremy.

Online lookout

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2017, 10:12:AM »
It is strange that at times of dire need we contact our families. No matter what circumstances,be it a life or death situation,our first thoughts are the closeness/nearness of the family and our first contact.

In 2006,I was in a " medical situation " which I knew was urgent,but I rang my daughter instead of the emergency services. Why I did this I'll never know,although I knew one thing and that if I wasn't treated urgently,I could have been a dead duck. Even this matter of urgency didn't make me act accordingly and I should have known better-------as a possible cardiac arrest on the motorway wouldn't have been ideal as daughter drove me to A&E.

I might add that I have a panic button installed for such emergencies too ! ::)
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 10:14:AM by lookout »

Offline maggie

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2017, 10:29:AM »
Maggie, if it had been Nevill's normal course of action to call Jeremy, I could have understood the call, but I don't believe it was. I HAVE been faced with a situation that I wasn't qualified to cope with. My choice was EITHER stand there, helpless, which could have, potentially lead to a death I'd never have forgiven myself for allowing to happen, OR phone someone qualified to cope with it. What would you have done?

If we go back to what happened prior to Sheila's last admission to hospital -and admittedly, the situation was different because Freddie wasn't related to her- doctors were called (although I can't recall the sequence of events) I don't believe Nevill called Jeremy.
I accept your argument to a point, however as we don't know what the situation may have been at the time Nevill phoned JB, it's difficult to compare like with like.
Did Nevill believe he was losing or had lost control of the situation when he phoned?
I do understand the question marks around the phone call, I can accept it does appear irrational but humans can be irrational.
My reaction or your reaction would not necessarily be Nevill's reaction or Joe Bloggs down the road's reaction.
Such choices can sometimes be the difference between life and death.


Offline lebaleb

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2017, 10:32:AM »
Exactly! He called a doctor. Someone who could do something. He didn't call Jeremy first. He didn't call Jeremy, full stop. Why would he?

Maybe Sheila demanded it as her plan was to kill the whole family, we will never know. He needed to calm Sheila down and he may have thought Jeremy could do that.

Offline Adam

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2017, 10:43:AM »
Maybe Sheila demanded it as her plan was to kill the whole family, we will never know. He needed to calm Sheila down and he may have thought Jeremy could do that.

Sheila was acting rationally for a woman 'going crazy'. Remembering Bamber was not at WHF to complete the full set.

Then getting Nevill to ring Bamber to entice him over. While she held Nevill at rifle point with a rifle designed for shooting rabbits 
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 10:55:AM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline maggie

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2017, 10:48:AM »
It is strange that at times of dire need we contact our families. No matter what circumstances,be it a life or death situation,our first thoughts are the closeness/nearness of the family and our first contact.

In 2006,I was in a " medical situation " which I knew was urgent,but I rang my daughter instead of the emergency services. Why I did this I'll never know,although I knew one thing and that if I wasn't treated urgently,I could have been a dead duck. Even this matter of urgency didn't make me act accordingly and I should have known better-------as a possible cardiac arrest on the motorway wouldn't have been ideal as daughter drove me to A&E.

I might add that I have a panic button installed for such emergencies too ! ::)
I can understand that Lookout, we are often irrational and our need for the familiar is very strong when we feel under threat.
An example of this can be a desire to be at home rather than in hospital when ill.
We may be safer in hospital but we feel more secure and safe in familiar surroundings.
Certainly your choice went against all your training, your reflex/objective action to help someone else would have been very different from your own overwhelming personal need when you were under threat.

Offline Adam

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2017, 10:51:AM »
Maybe Sheila demanded it as her plan was to kill the whole family, we will never know. He needed to calm Sheila down and he may have thought Jeremy could do that.

There are 40 reasons why Nevill would not call Bamber. Thread on the forum.

Nevill ignoring these reasons, phoning  Bamber & waiting a long time for an answer, contradicts Bamber's own evidence that Nevill just said 11 words to him before putting the phone down after just 6 seconds. 
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 10:53:AM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Online lookout

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2017, 10:52:AM »
Maggie, if it had been Nevill's normal course of action to call Jeremy, I could have understood the call, but I don't believe it was. I HAVE been faced with a situation that I wasn't qualified to cope with. My choice was EITHER stand there, helpless, which could have, potentially lead to a death I'd never have forgiven myself for allowing to happen, OR phone someone qualified to cope with it. What would you have done?

If we go back to what happened prior to Sheila's last admission to hospital -and admittedly, the situation was different because Freddie wasn't related to her- doctors were called (although I can't recall the sequence of events) I don't believe Nevill called Jeremy.





Doctors were called at Freddie's request,but even they couldn't solve anything as Sheila wanted her dad,who couldn't pick her up until the next day.

With all that's been said and discussed about " the " phone-calls,I think you're in the minority by saying that Neville didn't phone Jeremy.

If you can prove that Sheila had been dead before 3am,then you've won the argument about his guilt.

Offline maggie

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2017, 10:55:AM »
It is strange that at times of dire need we contact our families. No matter what circumstances,be it a life or death situation,our first thoughts are the closeness/nearness of the family and our first contact.

In 2006,I was in a " medical situation " which I knew was urgent,but I rang my daughter instead of the emergency services. Why I did this I'll never know,although I knew one thing and that if I wasn't treated urgently,I could have been a dead duck. Even this matter of urgency didn't make me act accordingly and I should have known better-------as a possible cardiac arrest on the motorway wouldn't have been ideal as daughter drove me to A&E.

I might add that I have a panic button installed for such emergencies too ! ::)
Think actually if we had a Mum who made us feel safe, we really want our Mum. At 19 I desperately wanted my Mum one night, I wanted to scream her name but my traumatised brain still told me that really wasn't cool so I shouted some guys name but I wanted my Mum because she would make everything alright ;D

Offline susan

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2017, 10:55:AM »
I accept your argument to a point, however as we don't know what the situation may have been at the time Nevill phoned JB, it's difficult to compare like with like.
Did Nevill believe he was losing or had lost control of the situation when he phoned?
I do understand the question marks around the phone call, I can accept it does appear irrational but humans can be irrational.
My reaction or your reaction would not necessarily be Nevill's reaction or Joe Bloggs down the road's reaction.
Such choices can sometimes be the difference between life and death.

Maggie I think the phone call is quite rational according to some JB was so cunning and clever he was not clever if he planned the phone call and we don,t not know if Nevill was  in the habit of phoning Jeremy could have been quite common and I fail to see why it was considered irrational.  He may have thought they could bring the situation under control without involving the police as I would have thought that was the last thing Nevill would have wanted this is all my opinion as none of us have proof of anything.

Offline susan

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2017, 10:57:AM »
Think actually if we had a Mum who made us feel safe, we really want our Mum. At 19 I desperately wanted my Mum one night, I wanted to scream her name but my traumatised brain still told me that really wasn't cool so I shouted some guys name but I wanted my Mum because she would make everything alright ;D

Maggie Mums always made things OK and in time of need we always went to her whatever our age.

Offline maggie

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2017, 10:59:AM »
There are 40 reasons why Nevill would not call Bamber. Thread on the forum.

Nevill ignoring these reasons, phoning  Bamber & waiting a long time for an answer, contradicts Bamber's own evidence that Nevill just said 11 words to him before putting the phone down after just 6 seconds.
Adam there may be '40' or 400 reasons why Nevill did not call JB that night and just one why he did but if that one is the correct reason your 40 are meaningless.

Offline Adam

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2017, 11:01:AM »
Maggie I think the phone call is quite rational according to some JB was so cunning and clever he was not clever if he planned the phone call and we don,t not know if Nevill was  in the habit of phoning Jeremy could have been quite common and I fail to see why it was considered irrational.  He may have thought they could bring the situation under control without involving the police as I would have thought that was the last thing Nevill would have wanted this is all my opinion as none of us have proof of anything.

When else did Nevill phone Bamber for help ? Never. Sheila lived in London.

This makes Nevill only speaking for 6 seconds to Bamber before putting the phone down, even stranger.

There is no way Bamber would know what to do as it was a new situation for him. 
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 11:05:AM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Adam

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #28 on: August 10, 2017, 11:04:AM »
Adam there may be '40' or 400 reasons why Nevill did not call JB that night and just one why he did but if that one is the correct reason your 40 are meaningless.

If Bamber going inside WHF in 30 minutes time somehow outweighed the 40 disadvantages, surely Nevill would have spent more than 6 seconds on the phone speaking to Bamber.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline maggie

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Re: Studying Nevill's 11 words in his 6 second phone call.
« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2017, 11:06:AM »
If Bamber going inside WHF in 30 minutes time somehow outweighed the 40 disadvantages, surely Nevill would have spent more than 6 seconds on the phone speaking to Bamber.
Sorry Adam.... don't understand that. It reminds me of maths problems..... therefore how long would it take Jeremy to fill a bath.  ;D