Why Nevill would jump on Sheila:

[Adam]

He was 9 inches taller.

He was 8 stone heavier.

He was at least 90% stronger & fitter.

He was within inches of Sheila when recieving his first two shots. So had the opportunity.

There was a brutal kitchen fight. The quickest way to end it was by using his massive weight, height & strenght advantages.

He was inches away from Sheila when wrestling over the rifle. The quickest way to end this was by using his massive height, weight & strenght advantages.

He had the opportunity to ring Bamber. So why not negate Sheila instead.

He had the opportunity to ring the police 26 minutes later. So why not negate Sheila instead.

It has been claimed Sheila cut off Nevill's call to Bamber. Again meaning she was inches away from a fully fit Nevill.

Jumping on Sheila means she loses control of the rifle.

It has been claimed today Sheila had 28 cuts/gouges/ abrasions which would have taken several minutes to inflict. Jumping on Sheila was quicker & would inflict less injuries.

Sheila was Haloperidol so would have had no co ordination skills to combat being jumped on.

Jumping on Sheila would be the natural thought from Nevill. It's the quickest & easiest thing to do.

Jumping on Sheila would be the natural thought from Nevill. He would want to use use his massive height, weight & strenght advantage.

An injured Nevill would use his massive height, weight & strenght advantage to jump on Sheila. It would take up less energy for an injured person than having a fight.

It was a life or death situation. Jumping on Sheila ends it. So Nevill would end it & not muck about. 

[Adam]

It does seem that the only reason a fully fit Nevill didn't jump on Sheila, is because she was holding a rifle for shooting vermin.

The evidence & suggestions from other people shows a fully fit Nevill & Sheila were inches away from each other on several occasions. Even when they were not, Nevill could have charged her.

After being shot from close range Nevill chose to run, wrestle & (apparently) give Sheila 28 cuts, gouges & abrasions.

Using his massive physical advantages either pre or post shootings would have been easier, quicker & would have saved everyone's life.

[David1819]

Why Sheila would win.

 - She has a gun.

[lookout]

It does seem that the only reason a fully fit Nevill didn't jump on Sheila, is because she was holding a rifle for shooting vermin.

The evidence & suggestions from other people shows a fully fit Nevill & Sheila were inches away from each other on several occasions. Even when they were not, Nevill could have charged her.

After being shot from close range Nevill chose to run, wrestle & (apparently) give Sheila 28 cuts, gouges & abrasions.

Using his massive physical advantages either pre or post shootings would have been easier, quicker & would have saved everyone's life.

The bigger they are,the harder they fall. Think about it !!

[Bill Robertson]

It does seem that the only reason a fully fit Nevill didn't jump on Sheila, is because she was holding a rifle for shooting vermin.

The evidence & suggestions from other people shows a fully fit Nevill & Sheila were inches away from each other on several occasions. Even when they were not, Nevill could have charged her.

After being shot from close range Nevill chose to run, wrestle & (apparently) give Sheila 28 cuts, gouges & abrasions.

Using his massive physical advantages either pre or post shootings would have been easier, quicker & would have saved everyone's life.

I thought I was leaving, but not quite.
Well, many possible reasons come to mind as to why Nevill would not overpower Sheila.

1. She held a gun on him the whole time.
2. Having confronted Nevill, Sheila told him she had shot/killed June. Nevill goes into deep shock
3. Nevill tries to disarm Sheila, they grapple, she claws his arm away and then she shoots him in the left arm
4. It is jolly painful to get shot and have a broken arm and Nevill finds this rather debilitating
5. Despite being shot, Nevill tried again, and Sheila fired another shot that grazed his chest
6. Sheila told Nevill to sit down. At gun point, he obeys
7. Sheila shot Nevill in the face twice. That caused excruciating pain and heavy bleeding. Cue even more shock
8. Sheila stood very close to Nevill and fired four bullets into his head.

A person holding a semi-automatic rifle has many advantages in that situation?

[susan]

I thought I was leaving, but not quite.
Well, many possible reasons come to mind as to why Nevill would not overpower Sheila.

1. She held a gun on him the whole time.
2. Having confronted Nevill, Sheila told him she had shot/killed June. Nevill goes into deep shock
3. Nevill tries to disarm Sheila, they grapple, she claws his arm away and then she shoots him in the left arm
4. It is jolly painful to get shot and have a broken arm and Nevill finds this rather debilitating
5. Despite being shot, Nevill tried again, and Sheila fired another shot that grazed his chest
6. Sheila told Nevill to sit down. At gun point, he obeys
7. Sheila shot Nevill in the face twice. That caused excruciating pain and heavy bleeding. Cue even more shock
8. Sheila stood very close to Nevill and fired four bullets into his head.

A person holding a semi-automatic rifle has many advantages in that situation?

Hi Bill

have you any theories on the burn marks on Nevil's back

[Caroline]

I thought I was leaving, but not quite.
Well, many possible reasons come to mind as to why Nevill would not overpower Sheila.

1. She held a gun on him the whole time.
2. Having confronted Nevill, Sheila told him she had shot/killed June. Nevill goes into deep shock
3. Nevill tries to disarm Sheila, they grapple, she claws his arm away and then she shoots him in the left arm
4. It is jolly painful to get shot and have a broken arm and Nevill finds this rather debilitating
5. Despite being shot, Nevill tried again, and Sheila fired another shot that grazed his chest
6. Sheila told Nevill to sit down. At gun point, he obeys
7. Sheila shot Nevill in the face twice. That caused excruciating pain and heavy bleeding. Cue even more shock
8. Sheila stood very close to Nevill and fired four bullets into his head.

A person holding a semi-automatic rifle has many advantages in that situation?

But not in a scenario when Jeremy gets Sheila into the main bed room?

[Bill Robertson]

Hi Bill

have you any theories on the burn marks on Nevil's back

My only theory is that they are not burn marks caused on the night in question and they are probably irrelevant to the killings.
The prosecution carried out an experiment that showed that the rifle, with the silencer on, could never get hot enough to burn skin just by firing bullets through it. It did not even get warm to the touch. The rips in the pyjama jacket don't line up with the marks and the pyjama jacket was not burnt either.

I guess it is just possible that the marks could have been made post-mortem. Sheila had time on her hands between 4 am and 7:30 am

But, really, I've no idea what they are.

[Bill Robertson]

But not in a scenario when Jeremy gets Sheila into the main bed room?

I don't entirely understand the point, but in any confrontation between someone holding a gun and someone unarmed, the one with the gun normally prevails.

I once faced someone armed with a sawn-off shotgun. He told me to back off and I did.

[Adam]

I don't entirely understand the point, but in any confrontation between someone holding a gun and someone unarmed, the one with the gun normally prevails.

I once faced someone armed with a sawn-off shotgun. He told me to back off and I did.

If it was me & Sheila got within inches or feet of me, holding that rifle, I would just wrestle her to the ground. Whether fully fit or not.

If caught by surprise she wouldn't fire any shots before losing control of the rifle. As said Nevill was 8 stone heavier, 9 inches taller & over twice as strong/fit.

The unlikely event of me getting one torso shot, would only stop me trying if Sheila was holding a shot gun.

[Jan]

If it was me & Sheila got within inches or feet of me, holding that rifle, I would just wrestle her to the ground. Whether fully fit or not.

If caught by surprise she wouldn't fire any shots before losing control of the rifle. As said Nevill was 8 stone heavier, 9 inches taller & over twice as strong/fit.

The unlikely event of me getting one torso shot, would only stop me trying if Sheila was holding a shot gun.

To re-in force your argument you indicated the gun was not a dangerous weapon as used for vermin? But whoever the perpretrator was the fact was all the victims were shot dead so I don't think that comment was relevant.

Also how do you know how a father who has knowledge of his daughters violence will react ? You are not privy to his thoughts or actions. Most of the time he could have been trying to talk her down or could have not had much chance to get too close to her . If we are going to bandy about opinions then I would have thought he would have been more violent if it was Jeremy because there would have been no need for reasoning or talking just a fight .

[Jan]

I don't entirely understand the point, but in any confrontation between someone holding a gun and someone unarmed, the one with the gun normally prevails.

I once faced someone armed with a sawn-off shotgun. He told me to back off and I did.

  crikey

[susan]

To re-in force your argument you indicated the gun was not a dangerous weapon as used for vermin? But whoever the perpretrator was the fact was all the victims were shot dead so I don't think that comment was relevant.

Also how do you know how a father who has knowledge of his daughters violence will react ? You are not privy to his thoughts or actions. Most of the time he could have been trying to talk her down or could have not had much chance to get too close to her . If we are going to bandy about opinions then I would have thought he would have been more violent if it was Jeremy because there would have been no need for reasoning or talking just a fight .

Jan that is a very good point you have made Nevil I am sure would have reacted quite differently to Jeremy.

[Jan]

Jan that is a very good point you have made Nevil I am sure would have reacted quite differently to Jeremy.
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I think with the illness that Sheila suffered from that she would be unpredictable and as was written in some evidence sometimes she did not even recognise people around her . So each situation could be different . So to try and assume any reactions would be very difficult. Whereas if it was Jeremy I think his father would have been shocked and very very angry which would have perhaps fired him up even more .

But as we don't even have a definitive order or times of death or know when injuries were caused or even if the damage in the kitchen was caused by a fight or the raid team we are all making theories . That is all .

[Adam]

To re-in force your argument you indicated the gun was not a dangerous weapon as used for vermin? But whoever the perpretrator was the fact was all the victims were shot dead so I don't think that comment was relevant.

Also how do you know how a father who has knowledge of his daughters violence will react ? You are not privy to his thoughts or actions. Most of the time he could have been trying to talk her down or could have not had much chance to get too close to her . If we are going to bandy about opinions then I would have thought he would have been more violent if it was Jeremy because there would have been no need for reasoning or talking just a fight .

Yes but Nevill & June needed 15 shots. Even Sheila needed two.

Anyway there are 16 reasons why Nevill would use his gigantic height, weight, fitness & strenght advantages while fully fit. And several chances he had to do so. Rather than ringing up Bamber before letting Sheila shoot him from close range.

After being shot from close range & still not jumping on Sheila, preferring to run downstairs, he had no option but to use his gigantic height, weight, fitness & strenght advantages in the kitchen. But chose to rifle wrestle.