Author Topic: Reconstruction of the Kitchen  (Read 269 times)

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Offline David1819

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Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« on: June 15, 2017, 01:39:PM »
I am in the process of creating a 3D reconstruction of the Kitchen. Its almost done.

Who thinks I should try and recreate what happened?

Any ideas or suggestions are welcome.  :))
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is."

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2017, 01:49:PM »
Pity we didn't also have pics of the living room/lounge where the toy gun and tampax box was,but there you are. The room still played a part in the murder scene.
However,you might as well continue with your re-creation to see how it pans out.

Offline Adam

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2017, 01:53:PM »
Please recreate to match the found crime scene & condition of Nevill.

32. The discovery of the bodies and the scene within the house 33. In the kitchen the police found Nevill Bamber's body slumped forward over an overturned chair next to the hearth, so that his head was just above a coal scuttle. The police evidence was that there were other chairs and stools upturned and broken crockery, sugar and what appeared to be spots of blood on the floor. A ceiling light lampshade had also been broken. It will be necessary to address further these matter later but on the evidence available at trial, it appeared as though a violent struggle had taken place."


41. Nevill Bamber, who was wearing his pyjamas had been shot eight times. There were two wounds to the right side and two to the top of the head. If not immediately fatal, the combined effect of these four injuries would have been immediate unconsciousness and incapacitation. There was a wound to the left side of the lip and another to the left part of the lower jaw. This injury caused severe fracturing of the jaw, of the teeth in that area and damaged soft tissue in the neck and the larynx. These features of this particular injury and the resultant flow of blood into the mouth meant, in the pathologist's opinion, that Nevill Bamber would not have been able to engage in purposeful talk. There were also gunshot wounds to the left shoulder and a grazing wound above the left elbow.


42. The examination of Nevill Bamber's body also revealed black eyes and a broken nose, linear bruising to the cheeks, lacerations to the head, linear type bruising to the right forearm, bruising to the left wrist and forearm and three circular burn type marks to the back. The linear marks were consistent with Mr Bamber having been struck with a long blunt object, possibly a gun.

« Last Edit: June 15, 2017, 01:59:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline David1819

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2017, 04:04:PM »
Please recreate to match the found crime scene & condition of Nevill.

32. The discovery of the bodies and the scene within the house 33. In the kitchen the police found Nevill Bamber's body slumped forward over an overturned chair next to the hearth, so that his head was just above a coal scuttle. The police evidence was that there were other chairs and stools upturned and broken crockery, sugar and what appeared to be spots of blood on the floor. A ceiling light lampshade had also been broken. It will be necessary to address further these matter later but on the evidence available at trial, it appeared as though a violent struggle had taken place."


41. Nevill Bamber, who was wearing his pyjamas had been shot eight times. There were two wounds to the right side and two to the top of the head. If not immediately fatal, the combined effect of these four injuries would have been immediate unconsciousness and incapacitation. There was a wound to the left side of the lip and another to the left part of the lower jaw. This injury caused severe fracturing of the jaw, of the teeth in that area and damaged soft tissue in the neck and the larynx. These features of this particular injury and the resultant flow of blood into the mouth meant, in the pathologist's opinion, that Nevill Bamber would not have been able to engage in purposeful talk. There were also gunshot wounds to the left shoulder and a grazing wound above the left elbow.


42. The examination of Nevill Bamber's body also revealed black eyes and a broken nose, linear bruising to the cheeks, lacerations to the head, linear type bruising to the right forearm, bruising to the left wrist and forearm and three circular burn type marks to the back. The linear marks were consistent with Mr Bamber having been struck with a long blunt object, possibly a gun.

No problem. I will be taking everything into account.

"I have been asked what I made of what appeared to have been a violent struggle in the kitchen between Mr. Bamber and his assailant. I am aware that by looking at the photographs they might suggest such a struggle, but at the time it did not appear that way to me. I could only see two things broken, one was a lamp shade and the other was a plate or bowl. There was also brown sugar on the floor but it was confined to one small area. I later learnt that the chairs and the brown sugar had been so knocked over by the firearms unit when they rushed about the house looking for Sheila. Yes Mr Bamber must have put up some resistance but it must have been limited because of she bullet wounds to his neck and the one to, I think his left arm, which caused the hone to be smashed. So at that time it did appear feasible that Sheila could have killed her father. "


"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is."

Offline Adam

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2017, 04:35:PM »
No problem. I will be taking everything into account.

"I have been asked what I made of what appeared to have been a violent struggle in the kitchen between Mr. Bamber and his assailant. I am aware that by looking at the photographs they might suggest such a struggle, but at the time it did not appear that way to me. I could only see two things broken, one was a lamp shade and the other was a plate or bowl. There was also brown sugar on the floor but it was confined to one small area. I later learnt that the chairs and the brown sugar had been so knocked over by the firearms unit when they rushed about the house looking for Sheila. Yes Mr Bamber must have put up some resistance but it must have been limited because of she bullet wounds to his neck and the one to, I think his left arm, which caused the hone to be smashed. So at that time it did appear feasible that Sheila could have killed her father. "



Can you do you're reconstruction based on the 'Court of Appeal'. Rather than you're own interppretation. It is the most official and independent document.

Anyway the police officers denied knocking things over at this appeal. Thread already created.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7957.msg377403.html#msg377403
« Last Edit: June 15, 2017, 04:39:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline notsure

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2017, 06:45:PM »
I would be very interested david.

Offline Adam

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2017, 07:01:PM »
Be good if we get both a Sheila & Bamber scenario. There was a massive difference in the strenght, protection & co ordination between the two.

Bamber's scenario will have to have the silencer on the rifle & scratching the aga.

« Last Edit: June 15, 2017, 07:29:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline susan

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2017, 08:58:PM »
I am in the process of creating a 3D reconstruction of the Kitchen. Its almost done.

Who thinks I should try and recreate what happened?

Any ideas or suggestions are welcome.  :))

David yes please create a 3D reconstruction of the kitchen I would be very interested if you would try and create what happened in the kitchen.

Offline Adam

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2017, 09:24:PM »
David did say he was going to provide a complete fifth scenario. However it seems he's just providing individual diagrams. His bedroom diagrams were totally unconvincing.

They showed Angela Jolie/Sheila shooting Nevill from the bedroom door. Hitting him twice in the face with expert precision from several yards away. This contradicts the evidence that these two shots were from inches away. 

David intially said the casings from the rifle eject up to ten feet forward. This would have meant all four casings would be yards outside the bedroom. Which again contradicts the evidence.

After I told him this, David then changed the casing trajectories. Apparently they now actually eject several feet sideways and bounce fiercely off walls. Which is surprising power for a rifle just used for shooting rabbits.

The source for these magical flying & bouncing casings ? David's own diagrams of course.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2017, 07:38:AM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline David1819

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2017, 11:20:PM »
Can you do you're reconstruction based on the 'Court of Appeal'. Rather than you're own interppretation. It is the most official and independent document.

Anyway the police officers denied knocking things over at this appeal. Thread already created.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7957.msg377403.html#msg377403

The colp statements of DI Cook and Trial testimony of Doctor Vanezis has the raid team causing much of the mess in the kitchen and Neville being unable to use his arm plus already in a fatal condition before he returns the kitchen.

Like you say Adam. Police and Experts don't create false reports.  8)

"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is."

Offline Hartley.

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2017, 11:37:PM »
The colp statements of DI Cook and Trial testimony of Doctor Vanezis has the raid team causing much of the mess in the kitchen and Neville being unable to use his arm plus already in a fatal condition before he returns the kitchen.

Like you say Adam. Police and Experts don't create false reports.  8)

I must admit, I'm not really sure where this is going. There was a fight in the kitchen, even if it was only one sided.
Nevill received a number of wounds not associated with the inflicted gunshot wounds.

It seems clear, that Nevill was struck a number of times by the killer, either bludgeoned with the rifle or some other linear item used as a weapon.

Do you disagree David?

Offline Adam

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2017, 12:25:AM »
Reply 8 shows David's bedroom diagrams were a complete disaster. All his theories contradicting the evidence & only his own diagrams being used as a source.

Magical bouncing casings were  changed from magical forward ejecting ones. Face shots from inches away turned into long range shots from an amazingly accurrate Sheila.

There is no point in creating diagrams for the kitchen fight. But I'm sure he will still do it.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2017, 11:44:AM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2017, 10:58:AM »
It would have been more a struggle in the kitchen as Neville would have tried to retrieve the rifle from Sheila--------NOT a fight as such.We all know how the police love to exaggerate.!!

Offline Caroline

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2017, 07:33:PM »
I must admit, I'm not really sure where this is going. There was a fight in the kitchen, even if it was only one sided.
Nevill received a number of wounds not associated with the inflicted gunshot wounds.

It seems clear, that Nevill was struck a number of times by the killer, either bludgeoned with the rifle or some other linear item used as a weapon.

Do you disagree David?

David HAS to say there was no fight in the kitchen because he knows no forensics from other victims were found on Sheila. We don't know of course that the same could be said for Jeremy as he had time to clean up. Personally, I don't believe there was an actual fight either - I think Jeremy bludgeoned, Nevil with the rifle - he must have done because the stock broke off. I think Jeremy messed up the kitchen to make it look as though 'Sheila had gone mad'.
100% - No doubts!

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Reconstruction of the Kitchen
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2017, 07:44:PM »
David HAS to say there was no fight in the kitchen because he knows no forensics from other victims were found on Sheila. We don't know of course that the same could be said for Jeremy as he had time to clean up. Personally, I don't believe there was an actual fight either - I think Jeremy bludgeoned, Nevil with the rifle - he must have done because the stock broke off. I think Jeremy messed up the kitchen to make it look as though 'Sheila had gone mad'.
I think there was some form of limited scuffle which surprised Jeremy as he had labelled them all callously in his mind as sitting ducks. I think Nevill managed to get a hand on the rifle and to manoeuvre it to smash the ceiling light, after which Jeremy became angry realizing it would be evidence left at the scene and that's when the overkill came into play with the broken stock and hale of bullets when Nevill was probably already dead.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2017, 07:45:PM by Steve_uk »