A question on Sheila showering & removing gun shot residue:

[Caroline]

Excellent post Adam ...

Like Mike said it is arguably possible that she could have cleaned herself up after 4 murders ...

But it is obvious she could not have cleaned herself up after shooting herself ...

Is there any explanation anyone why her hands and night dress had no traces ?

I would love to hear anybodies theories on how this is possible ...

But for me it looks like it was either Jeremy and / or a hitman or one or more of the relatives ...

Even though Sheila discussed killing her children with her doctor the lack of hand and clothing traces from the last 2 shots cannot be explained by her cleaning herself up - so i agree Adam - it does not look at all likely (or even possible) that Sheila shot herself ...

But why didn't this lack of hand or clothing marks ring alarm bells with Essex Police ?
Or did it ? were they working on this when Julie and the silencer turned up ?
Any ideas on this Adam or anybody else ?

Once again - excellent post Adam ...

Until the evidence was tested and reports written, they didn't know there was no forensic evidence on Sheila. It only took a month for thr investigation to change from Jeremy to Sheila.

[David1819]

Excellent post Adam ...

Like Mike said it is arguably possible that she could have cleaned herself up after 4 murders ...

But it is obvious she could not have cleaned herself up after shooting herself ...

Is there any explanation anyone why her hands and night dress had no traces ?

The type of ammunition used in the killings did not use a typical propellant. Thus the tests show a lack of GSR. This is confirmed by experiments.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7638.msg362836.html#msg362836

There was also traces of lead on her hands with higher levels on her right hand than the left hand. This indicates she handled and loaded the ammunition.

[Steve_uk]

The type of ammunition used in the killings did not use a typical propellant. Thus the tests show a lack of GSR. This is confirmed by experiments.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7638.msg362836.html#msg362836

There was also traces of lead on her hands with higher levels on her right hand than the left hand. This indicates she handled and loaded the ammunition.

I thought the laboratory at Huntingdon rejected the hand swabs?

[Caroline]

The type of ammunition used in the killings did not use a typical propellant. Thus the tests show a lack of GSR. This is confirmed by experiments.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7638.msg362836.html#msg362836

There was also traces of lead on her hands with higher levels on her right hand than the left hand. This indicates she handled and loaded the ammunition.

No it doesn't, such traces could have come from having her hand on the rifle.

[Adam]

Excellent post Adam ...

Like Mike said it is arguably possible that she could have cleaned herself up after 4 murders ...

But it is obvious she could not have cleaned herself up after shooting herself ...

Is there any explanation anyone why her hands and night dress had no traces ?

I would love to hear anybodies theories on how this is possible ...

But for me it looks like it was either Jeremy and / or a hitman or one or more of the relatives ...

Even though Sheila discussed killing her children with her doctor the lack of hand and clothing traces from the last 2 shots cannot be explained by her cleaning herself up - so i agree Adam - it does not look at all likely (or even possible) that Sheila shot herself ...

But why didn't this lack of hand or clothing marks ring alarm bells with Essex Police ?
Or did it ? were they working on this when Julie and the silencer turned up ?
Any ideas on this Adam or anybody else ?

Once again - excellent post Adam ...

There is no proof, Sheila had a shower & changed while alive.

Some supporters suggest she showered/changed in the short time she had available between Nevill's call and the police arriving. To try to explain there being no forensic evidence on her that she had committed the massacre. Forgetting she couldn't shower/change after she had killed herself.

The evidence of her being found in her nightie & bare footed strongly indicates Sheila did not have a shower & change. It is too much of a coincidence she would change into the exact same clothes she would have gone to bed in at 10pm. 

A shower would have washed any blood off her at the time. However it would not have washed gun shot residue off her. Or removed bruises, injuries or broken nails. Doubtful it would remove dirt & oil from under her nails either.

While alive, there is no reason why Sheila would want to attempt to remove all evidence she had committed murder. The murder weapon was going to be found on top of her.

[Adam]

Excellent post Adam ...

Like Mike said it is arguably possible that she could have cleaned herself up after 4 murders ...

But it is obvious she could not have cleaned herself up after shooting herself ...

Is there any explanation anyone why her hands and night dress had no traces ?

I would love to hear anybodies theories on how this is possible ...

But for me it looks like it was either Jeremy and / or a hitman or one or more of the relatives ...

Even though Sheila discussed killing her children with her doctor the lack of hand and clothing traces from the last 2 shots cannot be explained by her cleaning herself up - so i agree Adam - it does not look at all likely (or even possible) that Sheila shot herself ...

But why didn't this lack of hand or clothing marks ring alarm bells with Essex Police ?
Or did it ? were they working on this when Julie and the silencer turned up ?
Any ideas on this Adam or anybody else ?

Once again - excellent post Adam ...

The mountain of undisputed forensic evidence has always shown Sheila did not commit the massacre.

Again the hard part is for passionate supporters to change stance to Bamber being guilty.  Or focus on yours or Mike's alternative killer suggestions of RB, AE, a random stranger, a hit man or SAS style hit man team.

Susan has said she agrees the evidence shows Sheila did not commit the massacre while simultaneously announcing this week "I will continue to say Sheila murdered her family". Which is disrespectful to an innocent woman.

Only David is still kicking & screaming at the mountain of forensic evidence showing Sheila was murdered.  But has only come up with a picture of a clean, undamaged & bloodless foot. He doesn't believe Sheila showered & changed but achieved her immaculate condition from firing 26 bullets, reloading twice & fighting a 6.4 male.

[maggie]

The mountain of undisputed forensic evidence has always shown Sheila did not commit the massacre.

Again the hard part is for passionate supporters to change stance to Bamber being guilty.  Or focus on yours or Mike's alternative killer suggestions of RB, AE, a random stranger, a hit man or SAS style hit man team.

Susan has said she agrees the evidence shows Sheila did not commit the massacre while simultaneously announcing this week "I will continue to say Sheila murdered her family". Which is disrespectful to an innocent woman.

Only David is still kicking & screaming at the mountain of forensic evidence showing Sheila was murdered.  But has only come up with a picture of a clean, undamaged & bloodless foot. He doesn't believe Sheila showered & changed but achieved her immaculate condition from firing 26 bullets, reloading twice & fighting a 6.4 male.

Out of curiosity what is your explanation for the blood stained blue socks lying near Sheila's body?   Just curious how you believe they came to be there and if they are of any significance.

[guest2181]

No it doesn't, such traces could have come from having her hand on the rifle.

I think this clears it up:

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1691.msg51928.html#msg51928

[guest2181]

The type of ammunition used in the killings did not use a typical propellant. Thus the tests show a lack of GSR. This is confirmed by experiments.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7638.msg362836.html#msg362836

There was also traces of lead on her hands with higher levels on her right hand than the left hand. This indicates she handled and loaded the ammunition.

The bullets used were manufactured by Eley, not Remington.

You have been told this several times.

Remington distribute Eley bullets in the US in boxes bearing both names but they do not manufacture them. Eley and Remington are different.

[Adam]

Out of curiosity what is your explanation for the blood stained blue socks lying near Sheila's body?   Just curious how you believe they came to be there and if they are of any significance.

Nevill was found bare footed. Socks were found next to his side of the bed. So probable he took off his socks & left them by the bed before going to sleep.

The close ups show a lot of blood around the socks on the carpet. Suggesting the blood fell on top of the socks after Nevill was shot. Or after June walked around to the other side of the bed. Bamber would have got blood on him both pre & during shooting Sheila.

I doubt that back splatter from Sheila's neck shots would have travelled to the socks.

[maggie]

Nevill was found bare footed. Socks were found next to his side of the bed. So probable he took off his socks & left them by the bed before going to sleep.

The close ups show blood around the socks on the carpet. Suggesting the blood fell on top of the socks after Nevill was shot. Or after June walked around to the other side of the bed. Bamber would have got blood on him both pre & during shooting Sheila.

I doubt that back splatter from Sheila's neck shots would have travelled to the socks.

Nothing new there then.

[guest2181]

Out of curiosity what is your explanation for the blood stained blue socks lying near Sheila's body?   Just curious how you believe they came to be there and if they are of any significance.

Is it noted anywhere that the socks were blood stained?

I think they are given reference DB/6 (catalogued by David Bird).

[Adam]

Is it noted anywhere that the socks were blood stained?

I think they are given reference DB/6 (catalogued by David Bird).

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,887.0.html

The pictures on page 2 suggest the socks had blood on.

[guest2181]

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,887.0.html

The pictures on page 2 suggest the socks had blood on.

Yeah, it does look like there are a few drops.

I just wondered if it was written down anywhere. 

[lookout]

There is no proof, Sheila had a shower & changed while alive.

Some supporters suggest she showered/changed in the short time she had available between Nevill's call and the police arriving. To try to explain there being no forensic evidence on her that she had committed the massacre. Forgetting she couldn't shower/change after she had killed herself.

The evidence of her being found in her nightie & bare footed strongly indicates Sheila did not have a shower & change. It is too much of a coincidence she would change into the exact same clothes she would have gone to bed in at 10pm. 

A shower would have washed any blood off her at the time. However it would not have washed gun shot residue off her. Or removed bruises, injuries or broken nails. Doubtful it would remove dirt & oil from under her nails either.

While alive, there is no reason why Sheila would want to attempt to remove all evidence she had committed murder. The murder weapon was going to be found on top of her.

There's no proof that she hadn't showered either.