Author Topic: Timed references, anomaly - an adjustment may be necessary in pursuit of Accurac  (Read 6459 times)

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Offline lookout

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Police didn't physically hand back the first silencer to the Eatons, so where did Ann Eaton get the second silencer from?





Was that the one which was gathering dust on " Taff's " desk ?

I wonder why the " changeover " happened from DCI to a mere sergeant in such a massive case ??

Offline Caroline

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Was that the one which was gathering dust on " Taff's " desk ?

I wonder why the " changeover " happened from DCI to a mere sergeant in such a massive case ??

(I'll probably regret this but .....) What changeover?
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Offline Roch

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There's no doubt that a call from Nevill to Police or Jeremy that morning would render the conviction unsafe. The problem the Defence has is that nobody in authority is admitting there has been a cover- up.

Is this not par for the course though?  Something is denied and denied and denied... then eventually, it is admitted. 

Nobody is going to admit that Jeremy phoned Nevill - because apparently, it wasn't provable either way.  So the best that can be hoped for on that score - is an admission that police tactics were to tell all witnesses that a call from Nevill to Jeremy hadn't taken place (with a further admission that this was a flawed approach that effectively induced bias in the minds of witnesses against Jeremy).
« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 12:22:PM by Roch »

Offline Adam

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There's no doubt that a call from Nevill to Police or Jeremy that morning would render the conviction unsafe. The problem the Defence has is that nobody in authority is admitting there has been a cover- up.

Unsafe ? It would make him innocent.

The police are not admitting to anything as there is nothing to admit to. Ditto everyone else who has never retracted a word of their testimonies.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 12:30:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Caroline

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Is this not par for the course though?  Something is denied and denied and denied... then eventually, it is admitted. 

Nobody is going to admit that Jeremy phoned Nevill  because apparently, it wasn't provable either way.  So the best that can be hoped for on that score - is an admission that police tactics were to tell all witnesses that a call from Nevill to Jeremy hadn't taken place (with a further admission that this was a flawed approach that effectively induced bias in the minds of witnesses against Jeremy).

Or it never happened in the first place?
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Offline Roch

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Or it never happened in the first place?

Possibly.

However I think Mike's reply to you summed the other possibility up well (on the other thread).  I was going to post something similar in reply to you and had much of it typed out but didn't have time to finish it.  Will return to that and also your other question when i have time.

Offline lookout

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(I'll probably regret this but .....) What changeover?




From " Taff " to SJ. How did this happen ? Don't say because " Taff " had died,that's too easy.

Online mike tesko

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Police didn't physically hand back the first silencer to the Eatons, so where did Ann Eaton get the second silencer from?

Funny coincidence that Robert Boutflours so called 'Diary Entries' make mention of the use of the silencer!

And that, a few days later, his daughter Ann Eaton hands to DC Oakley a second silencer!

And that the 'U' shaped scratch mark was photographed n the kitchen aga surround around the same time - a 'U' shaped scratch mark that was not present on photographs taken of the aga on the first morning of the investigation!

Maybe, the relatives set out on a joint venture to implicate Jeremy in the shootings by introducing the second silencer knowing that one of the relatives had deliberately scratched the kitchen aga with the silencer that Ann Eaton handed to police on 11th September! How could Ann Eaton have possession of the same silencer the cops already have got possession of? She couldn't have! She had to have got a second silencer, a silencer which for over a month the relatives had all got access to! This could only have been done in the knowlege that there were two identical looking Parker Hale silencers / moderators, or whatever you choose to call them both, or one or other! That's how the relatives and cops got away with introducing the second silencer (DRB/1) on the 11th September, on the proviso that the first silencer handed over by Peter Eaton on 12th August might not have been the silencer to the anshuzt rifle, the 'other' silencer (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) was the silencer owned by Anthony Pargeter, who always kept it at the farmhouse! He had been keeping it at the farm since 1980! He has never claimed to have removed it from the farmhouse, and that strongly suggests that the 'Pargeter silencer' (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) was the Parker hale silencer inside which was discovered Sheila Caffells unique blood! What then, does this suggest? This is very interesting because red paint from the kitchen arga surround was found in the knurl of the other (DRB/1) silencer! This second silencer was obviously the silencer belonging to the anshuzt rifle! It obviously took the relatives (including Anthony Pargeter) a month to sort out which Parker hale silencer Peter Eaton had handed over to DS Jones on 12th August! Pargeter himself would have known that cops had got possession of his Parker Hale silencer, not the one belonging to the anshuzt rifle! I think if I recollect properly at one stage David Boutflour had been speaking to Anthony Pargeter and Dave Boutflour told him, that police had given the silencer back to the family! But, as we all know this did not happen because once Peter Eaton handed the first silencer (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) over to 'Stan' Jones on the 12th August 1985, it remained in police possession via it being shown by Jones to PI 'Bob' Miller, who told him to hand it to 'Ron' Cook, who took it through to the lab' for Glynis Howard to examine it on the 13th August after which she returned it to Cook, who states that for the next 17 days and nights he kept 'that' silencer in his coat pocket, until the 30th August 1985 when he sent it to the lab' at Huntingdon for the attention of their ballistic expert, Malcom Fletcher, who started to examine it on 12th September 1985, when he discovered the piece of flake trapped between the first two baffle plates of that (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) silencer, a flake which Fletcher passed onto blood expert, John Hayward, who turned the flake into a blood based solution, which he subsequently tested for particular blood group activity, on the 12th, 13th, 18th and 19th September, which produced four blood grouping results, A, EAP BA, AK/1 and HP 2-1, which he declared were unique to Sheila Caffell. A 5th blood test was done on the flake recovered from 'that' silencer (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1), by 12th September, to see whether it was human or animal blood! This test was performed on the 20th September, 1985, and produced a positive result for the blood being human in origin! In the meantime, the second silencer (DRB/1) which Ann Eaton handed to DC Oakley on the 11th September 1985, was retained by Essex police! On the 13th September, both DS Eastwood, and DS Davidson, fingerprinted 'it' (DRB/1)! Then, on the 20th September 1985, the second silencer was submitted to the lab' at Huntingdon, with instruction for 'it' (DRB/1) to be checked for blood, and fibers! Red paint from this second silencer was subsequently discovered ingrained into the knurl of its end cap!!!

Two identical looking silencers then, one (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) containing blood unique to Sheila, the other (DRB/1) containing red paint from the kitchen aga surround!

By the time of Jeremy Bambers October 1986 Chelmsford Crown Court trial, Sheila's blood, and red paint t from the kitchen aga at the scene, were both attributed as belonging to the same silencer!!!!

How is this possible,cwhen careful study of the now known facts excludes for any possibility of the blood and red paint to have come from the same silencer!!!!!


« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 03:08:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Caroline

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Possibly.

However I think Mike's reply to you summed the other possibility up well (on the other thread).  I was going to post something similar in reply to you and had much of it typed out but didn't have time to finish it.  Will return to that and also your other question when i have time.

So you believe the court stamp was forged?
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Offline Roch

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So you believe the court stamp was forged?

Nah - different thread.  I haven't got involved in that argument yet.  :))

Offline Caroline

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Nah - different thread.  I haven't got involved in that argument yet.  :))

Not sure which post you mean, send me the link and I will dissect  ;)
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Online mike tesko

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Funny coincidence that Robert Boutflours so called 'Diary Entries' make mention of the use of the silencer!

And that, a few days later, his daughter Ann Eaton hands to DC Oakley a second silencer!

And that the 'U' shaped scratch mark was photographed n the kitchen aga surround around the same time - a 'U' shaped scratch mark that was not present on photographs taken of the aga on the first morning of the investigation!

Maybe, the relatives set out on a joint venture to implicate Jeremy in the shootings by introducing the second silencer knowing that one of the relatives had deliberately scratched the kitchen aga with the silencer that Ann Eaton handed to police on 11th September! How could Ann Eaton have possession of the same silencer the cops already have got possession of? She couldn't have! She had to have got a second silencer, a silencer which for over a month the relatives had all got access to! This could only have been done in the knowlege that there were two identical looking Parker Hale silencers / moderators, or whatever you choose to call them both, or one or other! That's how the relatives and cops got away with introducing the second silencer (DRB/1) on the 11th September, on the proviso that the first silencer handed over by Peter Eaton on 12th August might not have been the silencer to the anshuzt rifle, the 'other' silencer (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) was the silencer owned by Anthony Pargeter, who always kept it at the farmhouse! He had been keeping it at the farm since 1980! He has never claimed to have removed it from the farmhouse, and that strongly suggests that the 'Pargeter silencer' (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) was the Parker hale silencer inside which was discovered Sheila Caffells unique blood! What then, does this suggest? This is very interesting because red paint from the kitchen arga surround was found in the knurl of the other (DRB/1) silencer! This second silencer was obviously the silencer belonging to the anshuzt rifle! It obviously took the relatives (including Anthony Pargeter) a month to sort out which Parker hale silencer Peter Eaton had handed over to DS Jones on 12th August! Pargeter himself would have known that cops had got possession of his Parker Hale silencer, not the one belonging to the anshuzt rifle! I think if I recollect properly at one stage David Boutflour had been speaking to Anthony Pargeter and Dave Boutflour told him, that police had given the silencer back to the family! But, as we all know this did not happen because once Peter Eaton handed the first silencer (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) over to 'Stan' Jones on the 12th August 1985, it remained in police possession via it being shown by Jones to PI 'Bob' Miller, who told him to hand it to 'Ron' Cook, who took it through to the lab' for Glynis Howard to examine it on the 13th August after which she returned it to Cook, who states that for the next 17 days and nights he kept 'that' silencer in his coat pocket, until the 30th August 1985 when he sent it to the lab' at Huntingdon for the attention of their ballistic expert, Malcom Fletcher, who started to examine it on 12th September 1985, when he discovered the piece of flake trapped between the first two baffle plates of that (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) silencer, a flake which Fletcher passed onto blood expert, John Hayward, who turned the flake into a blood based solution, which he subsequently tested for particular blood group activity, on the 12th, 13th, 18th and 19th September, which produced four blood grouping results, A, EAP BA, AK/1 and HP 2-1, which he declared were unique to Sheila Caffell. A 5th blood test was done on the flake recovered from 'that' silencer (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1), by 12th September, to see whether it was human or animal blood! This test was performed on the 20th September, 1985, and produced a positive result for the blood being human in origin! In the meantime, the second silencer (DRB/1) which Ann Eaton handed to DC Oakley on the 11th September 1985, was retained by Essex police! On the 13th September, both DS Eastwood, and DS Davidson, fingerprinted 'it' (DRB/1)! Then, on the 20th September 1985, the second silencer was submitted to the lab' at Huntingdon, with instruction for 'it' (DRB/1) to be checked for blood, and fibers! Red paint from this second silencer was subsequently discovered ingrained into the knurl of its end cap!!!

Two identical looking silencers then, one (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1) containing blood unique to Sheila, the other (DRB/1) containing red paint from the kitchen aga surround!

By the time of Jeremy Bambers October 1986 Chelmsford Crown Court trial, Sheila's blood, and red paint t from the kitchen aga at the scene, were both attributed as belonging to the same silencer!!!!

How is this possible,cwhen careful study of the now known facts excludes for any possibility of the blood and red paint to have come from the same silencer!!!!!

Let's take the matter to the next level, because on the 11th September David Boutflour contacts police to tell them that he has found the gun silencer! Of course he did, it was the one his sister Ann Eaton would hand to DC Oakley that very same date! Oh, and there's more, he wanted to meet police at the farmhouse to show them a scratch mark on the kitchen aga which could be the source of the red paint on the end of the silencer in question! Then, cops attend scene and photograph the 'U' shaped scratch on the front fascia of the aga surround, that was not present there on the morning of the shootings when crime scene photographs were taken!

Make your own conclusions regarding what you think might have happenned!

Worse still, but by 14th September 1985, David Boutflour was telling police that he found the silencer in two possible locations inside the gun cupboard! Now, how can you find one silencer, in two different places?

It's quite obvious that he was saying what he said, because he found two silencers in the cupboard, not one! Only one of these two silencers got handed over to Jones by Peter Eaton on 12th August (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1), but the second one was retained for a month before Ann Eaton handed it (DRB/1) over to DC Oakley on the 11th September 1985!

Two silencers then, handed over to police by husband and then wife, the first with the lab' from 30th August 1985, the latter one not sent to the lab' until the 20th September 1985!!!
« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 03:28:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Online mike tesko

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Of course, Ann Eaton is only going to acknowledge that she only knew about one silencer, a silencer found in the so called gun cupboard by her brother David Boutflour! She hasn't yet denied handing over 'that' silencer to DC Oakley on the 11th September 1985 (DRB/1). If pushed she will say that that was the only silencer she knows anything at all about! She will deny knowing that a month earlier her husband Peter had given 'Stan' Jones the other silencer (SBJ/1, SJ/1, DB/1)! So will David Boutflour! But they will be digging a deeper hole for themselves to fall into, because the COLP investigation confirmed that relatives 'found two silencers', and relatives 'handed over both silencers', one month 'separated the handing over of these to police' by the Eatons!

COLP refer to the existence of the 'second silencer' in their interview of DS Davidson!!!
« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 03:38:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Reader

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Pc West's log and evidence at trial suggests that the call had ended and Pc West had spoken to both Insp. Targrass and the operator before he entered 03:42 in his log.
I think A/Insp. Targrass has died since.