Author Topic: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn  (Read 4570 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline justice

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2053
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #345 on: January 29, 2017, 06:55:PM »
Hi justice

sorry I cannot understand your post do you think Jackie has a sad life? or have I read it wrong ???
My post is to Jackie and shouldn't concern you.
Envy kills,” the Pope said. “It does not tolerate others having something that I do not have. And it always suffers, because the heart of an envious or jealous person suffers. It is a suffering heart!” It is a suffering that desires “the death of others

Offline susan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 15419
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #346 on: January 29, 2017, 07:29:PM »
My post is to Jackie and shouldn't concern you.

Justice I thought you have said that forums are for debating I asked a question as I did not understand your post.  Your attitude is appalling and my question does not warrant this kind of a response and I am shocked to say the least.

Offline justice

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2053
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #347 on: January 29, 2017, 07:43:PM »
Justice I thought you have said that forums are for debating I asked a question as I did not understand your post.  Your attitude is appalling and my question does not warrant this kind of a response and I am shocked to say the least.
I honestly couldn't  say it different Susan, the post wasn't intended for you, what do you want me to debate, it was probably a harsh thing to say but surely you have seen a lot worse on here Susan?

HERO TO ZERO IN A DAY

, Quote from: justice on January 27, 2017, 05:51:PM
Susie you don't have to say sorry you have been through enough lately, sorry you got caught in this,  I picture Steph same as my daughter who was duped, that's all xx

Justice
From Susan
thanks for being so understanding you are such a nice caring man Xxx

I tried to be a peace maker, it hasn't worked, as of late I have been through enough I hate to see squabbling, I see people hounded and I am not saying Steph is innocent, I repeat I will defend Steph on what she has been through, not who she is  and I would do the same for you.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2017, 09:25:PM by justice »
Envy kills,” the Pope said. “It does not tolerate others having something that I do not have. And it always suffers, because the heart of an envious or jealous person suffers. It is a suffering heart!” It is a suffering that desires “the death of others

Offline JackiePreece

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4743
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #348 on: January 29, 2017, 08:01:PM »
Why would I want to give an opinion on your opinion of why Steph wasn't banging on the prison gates everyday. It's you who is saying she 'couldn't be bothered'. What she did or didn't do, isn't really your concern unless she 'chooses' to comment.

She did tell me
She chose to tell me
"No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" Winston Churchill

Offline JackiePreece

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4743
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #349 on: January 29, 2017, 08:05:PM »
Malice is often why some people thrive on the perceived misery of others. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/in-the-name-love/200901/why-are-we-pleased-others-misfortune

Generally regarded as "morally evil" and said to be the worst trait in human nature closely related to cruelty.
You should be ashamed of yourself
If your not attacking Lookout or Nugs or Sandra
It's revolting to watch
Have you apologised in person the people you wrongly accused of the Ipswich murders
I hope you have apologised and publicly
"No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" Winston Churchill

Offline JackiePreece

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4743
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #350 on: January 29, 2017, 08:07:PM »
Justice I thought you have said that forums are for debating I asked a question as I did not understand your post.  Your attitude is appalling and my question does not warrant this kind of a response and I am shocked to say the least.

Thank Susan
"No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" Winston Churchill

Offline JackiePreece

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4743
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #351 on: January 29, 2017, 08:19:PM »
I honestly couldn't  say it different Susan, the post wasn't intended for you, what do you want me to debate, it was probably a harsh thing to say but surely you have seen a lot worse on here Susan?

HERO TO ZERO IN A DAY

, Quote from: justice on January 27, 2017, 05:51:PM
Susie you don't have to say sorry you have been through enough lately, sorry you got caught in this,  I picture Steph same as my daughter who was duped, that's all xx

Justice

thanks for being so understanding you are such a nice caring man Xxx

I tried to be a peace maker, it hasn't worked, as of late I have been through enough I hate to see squabbling, I see people hounded and I am not saying Steph is innocent, I repeat I will defend Steph on what she has been through, not who she is  and I would do the same for you.

Your posts about me are disgraceful
how dare you!!! my life is pretty near perfect

You continue to make stuff up every time you are on the forum and just to add I have never been on Benefits for years when I have nothing wrong it's distasteful
« Last Edit: January 29, 2017, 11:12:PM by Zoso »
"No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" Winston Churchill

Offline susan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 15419
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #352 on: January 29, 2017, 08:36:PM »


Jackie

It would seem that Justice is not the nice kind caring man I thought he was he seems to want to target you everytime you are on the forum and it is grossly unfair.  I for one have never asked him to stop defending Steph and neither have you so what is his problem? I am so sorry that the forum has come down to this and I apologise to other posters if I have caused them to feel uncomfortable but this all started because I responded to one of your posts to him with the grins/laughs thought your post was funny and still do ;D
« Last Edit: January 29, 2017, 08:38:PM by susan »

Offline JackiePreece

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4743
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #353 on: January 29, 2017, 09:54:PM »
Jackie

It would seem that Justice is not the nice kind caring man I thought he was he seems to want to target you everytime you are on the forum and it is grossly unfair.  I for one have never asked him to stop defending Steph and neither have you so what is his problem? I am so sorry that the forum has come down to this and I apologise to other posters if I have caused them to feel uncomfortable but this all started because I responded to one of your posts to him with the grins/laughs thought your post was funny and still do ;D

Thank you for your support x
"No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" Winston Churchill

Offline Stephanie

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6461
  • The facts leading to the Simon Hall confession
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #354 on: February 02, 2017, 03:10:PM »
To make it clear Sandra, and with hindsight, that is exactly what you were doing. It's what people like you do - exploit, mistreat and abuse/attack people who are in vulnerable situations.

It's evidenced in both yours and Billy Middleton's 2010 & 2013 publications on the Wronglyaccusedperson website and indeed other communications.

"Psychological manipulation can be defined as the exercise of undue influence through mental distortion and emotional exploitation, with the intention to seize power, control, benefits and/or privileges at the victim’s expense.

It is important to distinguish healthy social influence from psychological manipulation. Healthy social influence occurs between most people, and is part of the give and take of constructive relationships. In psychological manipulation, one person is used for the benefit of another. The manipulator deliberately creates an imbalance of power, and exploits the victim to serve his or her agenda.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/communication-success/201510/14-signs-psychological-and-emotional-manipulation

Here are public statements made by Billy Middleton's old boss in 2011.

http://simplybillymiddleton.myfreeforum.org/ftopic9-0.php

Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:38 am
"I do feel incredibly angry that Billy Middleton feels that he has the right to publish on the internet whatever he wants without fear of retribution.

Reading his MOJ2010 speech just puts my blood pressure right up because there is hardly one single paragraph that contains the whole truth. Unfortunately there is very little that I can state as "fact" as at it would mean exposing people and information that at the moment has to remain confidential. I am, however, now in a position to comment on the following subject things that I was told as Billy took it upon himself to expose his ex-wife as the person to whom the sexual assault charges concerned.

He himself describes the charge as "sexual abuse". I'm unclear why. As far as I know the charges were of sexual assault. To my mind sexual abuse indicates a more long term situation. A freudian slip, perhaps?. Maybe this was closer to the truth of what was happening in Billy and Kareen's relationship.

However Billy Middleton states: "They then threw in a charge of sexual abuse against my wife instead but both she and her uncle proved in court it was not physically possible because we were about 60 miles apart at the time and the doctor who examined her testified that there was no physical evidence to support it.

Billy put forward a special plea of 'consent' to the sexual assault charges yet in the statement above he is implying that it never happened and that this was "proved in court". He can't have it both ways - either his ex-wife consented or else it didn't happen, not both.

The only 'incident' of sexual assault Kareen discussed with me in any detail was the time that caused her to leave Billy in April/May 2007. Remember, this was about 2 years before the trial and 18 months before the fire. It was the first time I visited her at her aunt and uncle's house in Brae after she left Cullivoe with the kids. She told me what Billy had done to her. Needless to say, I was appalled. She was upset and confused and asked my advice on what to do. She spoke about going back to him as she was afraid if she left him for good what he would do. Billy was constantly texting her and using the children as a weapon against her, saying things like did she really want the kids to come from a broken home and she was to think about the effect all this was having on them. Things like that. I advised her not to go back to him. She was 3 months pregnant with Annalise at the time.

Kareen had not been happy for a long time. Billy spent much of his home time on the computer. Kareen was sure he was in contact with other women. She looked up the history on their computer one day Billy was at work and found that he had googled "rape", "torture" and "p***y fisting". Billy had been visiting hardcore BDSM sites and Kareen was scared - is this what he had in mind for her? She told me things had been escalating against her will in the bedroom. She did not tell me the exact date of when the assault had taken place but I did get the impression that she had waited a few days before leaving him and moving to Brae. She only went to see the GP the day after she moved to Brae on her aunt and uncle's insistance. From my understanding of what Kareen has told me because she had waited a number of days and because she had given birth to 2 children naturally the GP was non-committal about any signs of an assault having taken place.

When Kareen took Billy back most of her family and friends distanced themselves from her including me. I felt embarrassed because I had tried to advise her not to take him back but she had and it felt very awkward. I know her family felt the same way. We have spoke since about the reasons why she took him back and I can absolutely see why she did - she was a typical abused wife caught in a cycle of abuse. She told me that one of the conditions she took him back on was if he saw a counsellor. He showed her a letter with an appointment but does not know if he ever attended. All she knows is that the abuse only ever got worse and because she no longer felt she could turn to her friends and family she was completely isolated.


Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 10:11 am  http://simplybillymiddleton.myfreeforum.org/ftopic9-0.php
"For reasons only known to themselves the police never interviewed either myself or Kareen's counsellor whom she was seeing regarding unresolved issues from her childhood and also the difficulties she was experiencing within her own relationship with Billy. She told her counsellor everything.

However, following the trial Kareen's solicitor did take a statement from her counsellor. That is why Billy never fought to see the kids. His lies would be exposed before his family and he couldn't let that happen.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2017, 03:28:PM by Stephanie »
“The only people who are mad at you for telling the truth are those people who are living a lie. Keep telling the truth"

Offline Stephanie

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6461
  • The facts leading to the Simon Hall confession
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or withdrawn
« Reply #355 on: February 02, 2017, 03:15:PM »
She then goes on to state:

Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 4:01 pm  http://simplybillymiddleton.myfreeforum.org/ftopic9-0.php 
"After Billy was arrested I sent this email to his parents. I also sent a copy to Sandra Lean, to try and confirm that I was telling the truth.

Flag this message
Re: Please note amended address
Tuesday, 11 November, 2008 9:48
From:
"MARINA THOMASON"
Add sender to Contacts
To:
"Harriets Mail"
Dear Harriet and Jim,

We've got your e-mail and we will pin the address up in the canteen at work.  I'm sure one or two of the workers will want to write to Billy.  This is a very difficult letter for me to write to you and I've struggled with my conscious whether I should or not.

During the time of Billy and Kareens wedding you were very good to us and you made me feel very welcome in your home, I felt you Harriet and me especially, clicked.  You are a nice family.  But the truth of the matter is we advised Billy and Kareen to pospone their wedding.  I took Kareen aside and Christopher took Billy and advised them to put the wedding off.  We did this because we knew the extent of the problems they had in their relationship and feared it would end in disaster. We hoped if they delayed it their relationship would come to its own natural conclusion.  We always thought someone would get hurt although we could never forsee this happening.

I don't know to what extent you know of what went on here in Cullivoe.  The police were involved on two occasions that we know of.  There were numerous other occasions that were kept quiet by the Williamsons here in Yell.  Billy and Kareens next door neighbour was very upset by what was happening.  She was Christina's chaperone to nursery in the taxi.  She said every Friday night was the same,  they would be woken up in the middle of the night with Kareen screaming and sometimes she would hear Christina crying.  She wanted to report Billy and Kareen to social services but luckily for them she spoke to her sister first about it who lives here in Cullivoe.  She suggested speaking to Jean Saunders which she did.  Jean said that if anything happened which she was worried about the neighbour was to phone her first.  As a consequence Jean and John were in the square on more than one occasion. Kareen and the bairns came here to stay the night one of the times.  It was very upsetting for me as my mam had just died suddenly 2 weeks before and I was 6 months pregnant for Amanda. When I answered the phone in the middle of the night to hear Kareen screaming I thought she was being murdered.

We never could figure out what was going on but when Kareen left Billy and went to Brae she told me a few things and it all fitted together like a jig-saw puzzle.  I know that she went on to tell her uncle Andy and Gilda even more so don't be too harsh on them because you have to understand that Kareen very much made Billy out to be the bad guy. I don't know the truth of the matter because Kareen told one story and Billy told the opposite.

I don't know where this idea that the Williamsons never visited Kareen here in Cullivoe came from because to my mind it is simply not true. Susan was there at least twice a week, Christina and Lana were best friends.  Although Carol doesn't drive she came at least once a week before or after choir practice and if she was working at the school she was there more often.  All the family turned up for any birthday parties or occasions.

I know you are living a nightmare at the moment and of course you want to believe Billy, he is your son. We will all have to await what evidence comes out at the trial.  I hope you are not to upset by this email that is not my intention at all.  No-matter what the truth is of what happened that awful night the letter we wrote from C & A still holds true and I used to call Billy Christophers' right hand. He is a terrible miss at work.

This is a hard thing for everyone involved to come to terms with and our deepest sympathy is with you,

Marina.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2017, 03:26:PM by Stephanie »
“The only people who are mad at you for telling the truth are those people who are living a lie. Keep telling the truth"

Offline Stephanie

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6461
  • The facts leading to the Simon Hall confession
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or wiithdrawn
« Reply #356 on: February 25, 2017, 05:42:PM »
Maybe you should speak to Sandra I have always found her very kind and sensible as I have with nug nug
I don't know why Stephanie didn't visit Simon much, it appears she seems more interested in spending time on the forums
If I had a husband in prison who I believed was innocent I would never miss a single visit

There is nothing kind or sensible in Sandra Leans stance displayed here regarding Simon Hall's confession/guilt.

"Narcissist are very good at twisting the truth, exaggerating the facts, and creating drama for their own personal gains. Often times narcissist will surround themselves with enablers, harem, or loyal followers who often don't wish to admit they too are victims or may think they are supporting a fake persona who is ultimately the narcissist...

By his own admission Simon Hall was narcisstic. The very fact that he maintained his innocence following his arrest supports this fact as do all of his actions from that point on.

Simon Halls abuse of me started the day I met him.


I've no idea why you feel compelled to question when I did or didn't visit nor what business it was/is of yours. But for the record; Simon Hall's psychological abuse of me had become public knowledge by the end of 2012. Many people, including yourself, joined in with the abuse. Maybe you would explain why you chose to behave this way?

"The entire persona of a narcissist is a façade meant to benefit the ONE ?= The Narcissist! Narcissist feel as though they are above the law, above others, and that the world is out to get them and therefore they go out of their way to showcase and spotlight themselves by selling themselves with their illustrious careers, expensive materialistic possessions, wealth. Abuse is with the objective to maintain power and control while isolating their victims to become dependent upon them.


Narcissists have a plan from the very beginning of the honeymoon stage, to the love bombing ( use of flattery, declarations of love and romantic encounters to attract victims), to the denial, and ultimately the devalue and discard and that's simply to take away and destroy the victim in anyway possible. They are not limited to keeping their victims walking on eggshells and will resort to abuse of all forms to accomplish this task. They have no remorse or empathy for those that are left behind. Victims will never get the apology that they deserve.

Jeremy Bamber is no different!
« Last Edit: February 25, 2017, 05:51:PM by Stephanie »
“The only people who are mad at you for telling the truth are those people who are living a lie. Keep telling the truth"

Offline sandra L

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 568
Re: Sandra Leans book "No Smoke" should be re-vised or wiithdrawn
« Reply #357 on: February 25, 2017, 06:20:PM »
There is nothing kind or sensible in Sandra Leans stance displayed here regarding Simon Hall's confession/guilt.

Not from your perspective, no.

I consider it pretty sensible to ask questions when things don't add up properly. I'm sure lots of people perceive truth-seeking as "unkind," but that's the nature of the society we've become - we'd rather shoot the messenger than hear the message.

Just because you don't like the questions I ask, that doesn't make me unkind for asking them. Makes me sensible!