Author Topic: The murder of 14 year-old schoolgirl Jodi Jones near Edinburgh on 30 June 2003  (Read 282577 times)

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Offline nugnug

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well most people dont try and handle the pollice and the press becouse thy dont think thy need to theyve done wrong so they dont think hey will have any problems.



Offline nugnug

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i love the wat the record spin everything.

Offline nugnug

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whats allway bothred me about this case is the patholgist said had been moved now did the police moveit or did the kiler or killers move it.

Offline sandra L

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As it turns out, nugnug, she was probably moved more than once - the lack of blood at the foot of the wall and where the body was found suggest she wasn't killed in either place.

Offline nugnug

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As it turns out, nugnug, she was probably moved more than once - the lack of blood at the foot of the wall and where the body was found suggest she wasn't killed in either place.

moving a body of that size  would be hatd for one person to do and would they do it in daylight without being noticed.

Offline marty

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So from death to the time the pathologist got there she could have been moved up to about 5 times. She was on a plastic sheet in the morning by the time he got to the scene, if I remember correctly.

Offline nugnug

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thepolice move body ssomtimes photograph them but i doubt they would do twice.

Offline marty

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They shouldn’t be moving anything until all possible evidence has been gathered though.

Offline nugnug

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They shouldn’t be moving anything until all possible evidence has been gathered though.

no they shouldent but t times they do.


im not saying it necasrly happend here though it could  that who ever moved the body had to put it dwn agin maybe they were woried they would be seen if they are caried it all the way to were they wanted her so  kept having to pick her up and pu her down agin.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2018, 11:53:PM by nugnug »

Offline Bullseye

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Hi everyone my first post, lots of questions sorry!

It’s been years since I caught up on the case. I use to read the old site til the thread was all removed. Ive always had doubt over the case, but still don’t know if he is guilty or not hoping you guys can help me gets my facts right and clear up a few things that don’t make sense to me. 

Everything seems to be centred round that 45 minute timeframe 1700 - 1745, what evidence is there that was the time of the murder, all I could find from the court records was “Although the pathologists were unable to fix a time of death, the untoward sound heard by Leonard Kelly as he cycled along the Roan's Dyke Path would fit with the attack upon her having taken place behind the wall at that time” surely that’s not all they are going by? Also the way she was treated after she was found how reliable would a time of death be, anyone know?

Was any dna found with full dna profiles other than the sisters bf? And yet to be identified?

Was there a blood stained shirt found in the area that was not tested or examined? Find that hard to believe

Was Luke’s dog training to be a tracker dog?

How long does it take to walk from Jodie’s house to the top of the lane? From the top of the lane to the v? The v to the bottom and the bottom to Luke’s house? I believe it takes around 15mins to walk length of the lane.

Was there proof Luke’s mum got home at 1715.
The call about putting the pie on for tea, what time was that, was it on the house phone or mobile, was there a log of this call?
Luke’s brother could not confirm he saw Luke in the house, but did he confirm he had pie and mash, how long after his mum got home did he come for tea? Was his room on the same level or upstair?

Is it correct he had not showered, hair and hands dirty (if I killed someone first thing I’d do is shower)

A lot of confusion over clothing I found. Witness one, green fishing type hip length jacket, witness 2 green bomber style with orange lining. So why were the police looking for a Parker style jacket and a combat shirt (which I believe Luke said he only purchased after the murder) Did they suggest there was footwear missing too, as lads that age don’t usually have a load of shoes, generally they wear the same pair most days, were any missing? What did the 2 lads that knew Luke and seen him sitting on the wall say he was wearing?

JF and GD on path at 1700 to 1720, around same time as LK, motor bike parked at v did not see or hear anything or anyone. (Who was the witness that said they saw the bike parked at v with nobody else around?) LK heard noise behind wall but saw nobody, and did not see or hear any bike, is that correct?

What time did Luke leave to meet other friends and what time did they meet at. How long would that journey take

I’m hoping the answer to some of these might help me make a bit more sense of the case, or maybe give me more questions lol

Offline nugnug

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are good to see you agian bullseye there did used to be a timline of the events

from memory i belive lukes met up with his mates at 7pm,

theres 4 difrent times fr when jodi left her house.

« Last Edit: January 24, 2019, 10:09:PM by nugnug »

Offline Bullseye

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Hey nugnug, it’s been a few years, hope you are well.

I’m just reading through all the info on here, refreshing my memory. On page 200 so getting there. Finding a few answers to some questions I’ve had over the years. But I’m sure I will have more lol

Offline sandra L

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Hi, Bullseye, I'm stuck on a train at the moment, so I have some time to answer your questions!

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Everything seems to be centred round that 45 minute timeframe 1700 - 1745, what evidence is there that was the time of the murder, all I could find from the court records was “Although the pathologists were unable to fix a time of death, the untoward sound heard by Leonard Kelly as he cycled along the Roan's Dyke Path would fit with the attack upon her having taken place behind the wall at that time” surely that’s not all they are going by? Also the way she was treated after she was found how reliable would a time of death be, anyone know?

There was no evidence whatsoever that this was to time of death. No medical, pathologist or forensic evidence and no eyewitness (or even deduction from eyewitness accounts) because the time of leaving was never confirmed. If, as earlier statements suggested, Jodi left at 5.05 or 5.30 ToD could not have been 5.15


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Was any dna found with full dna profiles other than the sisters bf? And yet to be identified?

Yes, there were five male DNA profiles unaccounted for. One of this was eventually identified as Falconer (condom man), the others remain unidentified. Other, partial profiles on the clothing also remain unidentified but cannot be Luke's.

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Was there a blood stained shirt found in the area that was not tested or examined? Find that hard to believe
There was a hoodie and jogging bottoms that were never tested (no  indication that they were bloodstained. A shirt found on the wall was bloodstained -from memory, there were no positive results from testing, but again, partial results indicated nothing of Luke's DNA - i' d need to go back and fact check this, since I don't remember the exact circumstances

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Was Luke’s dog training to be a tracker dog?
yes

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how long does it take to walk from Jodie’s house to the top of the lane? From the top of the lane to the v? The v to the bottom and the bottom to Luke’s house? I believe it takes around 15mins to walk length of the lane.
There's the entrance lane then the path. Jodi's house to entrance lane, 2 mins 40:seconds, entrance lane to top of path, 2 - 3 mins, top of path to V, 7 -8 mins, v to bottom, approx 4 mins, bottom to Luke's house 7mins.

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Was there proof Luke’s mum got home at 1715. [/]quote]
Other than Luke and Shane,s accounts, CCTV showed Corinne leaving work just after 5pm and in a shop 5 mins from Her home at we ar around 5.08, but nothing else to say she went straight home from there.

[qute]The call about putting the pie on for tea, what time was that, was it on the house phone or mobile, was there a log of this call?

From memory, 4.23pm, house phone to work landline, yes, it's in the phone records.

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Luke’s brother could not confirm he saw Luke in the house, but did he confirm he had pie and mash, how long after his mum got home did he come for tea? Was his room on the same level or upstair?

He did  confirm he saw Luke, but the police would not accept it because he couldn't remember in his first statement. He confirmed what he ate and said it was just after his mother arrived home around 5.15pm. He was upstairs until he was called down for tea, came down and collected his dinner, poke to like and his mum, the took his meal up to his room to est. The police said Corinne put him up to saying all of that.

[qute{s it correct he had not showered, hair and hands dirty (if I killed someone first thing I’d do is shower) [/quote] Yes, that is correct. The dirt on his ankles and neck were described as having the appearance of having been there for some time.

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lot of confusion over clothing I found. Witness one, green fishing type hip length jacket, witness 2 green bomber style with orange lining. So why were the police looking for a Parker style jacket and a combat shirt (which I believe Luke said he only purchased after the murder) Did they suggest there was footwear missing too, as lads that age don’t usually have a load of shoes, generally they wear the same pair most days, were any missing? What did the 2 lads that knew Luke and seen him sitting on the wall say he was wearing?

Only one witness mentioned a parka jacket (the witnesses who may have seen someone else entirely but assumed it was Luke) - she said it "could have been s parka" but "only because of the length. Initially, she described it as " dark" and possibly green". No questions about missing footwear.

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JF and GD on path at 1700 to 1720, around same time as LK, motor bike parked at v did not see or hear anything or anyone. (Who was the witness that said they saw the bike parked at v with nobody else around?) LK heard noise behind wall but saw nobody, and did not see or hear any bike, is that correct?
Quote

I can't name the person who saw the bike, but her other confirmed movements and evidence make it an extremely credible and reliable account. JF and GD admitted the bike was there without them at 5.15pm

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What time did Luke leave to meet other friends and what time did they meet at. How long would that journey take

After waiting for Jodi until about quarter to seven, Luke crossed the road into the abbey to wait for his other friends arriving - it would have taken him no more than 2 minutes to get into the abbey grounds -it was right opposite the wall where he was sitting in full view waiting for Jodi at the end of his street.

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I’m hoping the answer to some of these might help me make a bit more sense of the case, or maybe give me more questions lol

All of this and much more is in my latest book 'Innocents Betrayed' - available on Amazon

Offline Bullseye

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Thanks for the information Sandra, I will check out the book, still to read the first one too sorry!  :-[ I sent you a PM hope you got it, I’ve no idea how to use these sites lol

So there is nothing other than a guy on a bike that heard a noise behind the wall at 1715 , to say that this is the time of the murder 1700 to 1730? So it really could have been anytime? And there is a credible sighting of the bike at 1715 at the V (sorry I wasn’t asking for a name, I just wondered if someone else on the path to see them) Then it’s very unlikely to have been then, as they would have heard or seen something or scared anyone away I’d have thought? So it would need to be after that. Timing just doesn’t fit for me to think it’s Luke. Then he is just sitting meters away from her body minutes after he has meant to have killed her for an hour, she could have been found at anytime, he would have no idea if there was any blood dna etc on him.

Turnbull said there where 3 key points that  showed Luke’s guilt.
Shane’s statement
AB sighting
Luke finding body, not the dog

Shane’s statement - someone has to have made the tea, just because he could not confirm he seen Luke does not mean Luke was not home. His mum confirmed Luke was home, only she and Luke know the truth on this but to give an alibi for such a horrendous crime, and continue to stick by this and show full support make me tend to believe her. Only thing that I don’t understand is why Shane has never spoken out to clarify this over all these years and also show his support. I know I would.

AB sighting - In my opinion the clothing does not match Jodi so i would not have taken that as a positive sighting, also she did not confirm Luke being the boy she saw.

Luke or the dog find the body - Only Luke and the family know the truth to this one. But I’ve never understood this really. Why the family statements all changed. First they all confirmed in more than one statement over a few weeks that the dog alerted them to the wall, there was no question to that. Then the statement changed, why, I’m not sure how that can be mistaken as they said they saw the dog jump at wall originally. But why would they change this, did they remember later they didn’t actually see the dog alert, they had just taken Luke’s word for it? It makes me uncomfortable to think how much of an affect this had to the trial, it wasn’t just a bit of evidence, it was a key point, one of the 3 key points Turnbull raised with the lack of any dna, etc. As I said only Luke and the family know if the original statement was correct or mistaken. if the dog was a trained tracker I would tend to believe the original statement that the dog alerted them to the wall. But just my opinion guys!