Did Colin Caffell Contribute To Sheila's Schizophrenia?

[lookout]

Do-you believe Sheila planned it, or was it a spur of the moment killing Lookout? If it was pre planned, she had to be confident in her ability to take everyone out and have the nerve or guts then to kill herself?

Or do you just think it kicked off on the night and things materialised the way it did?

I would say it was a spur of the moment action simply because the guns were around and ready to fire.
Discussions over supper would have rumbled on and there was so much ill-feeling with one thing and another by all accounts, going through subjects such as fostering is more than enough to bring out all kinds of emotions with Sheila whose condition was somewhat delicate given the situation she was in with childcare.

In her frame of mind, it would have proved easy for Sheila to put an end to everything and solve what would have been an uncertain future. Her depression got the better of her.

[lookout]

Of course, RJ. It maybe JUST possible, had she been interested, she could have fired off a round or two for fun. Perhaps, in order to make certain every bullet went home, she'd been taking secret lessons? -does a mother practice how to kill her children?- in which case the whole thing was long premeditated. However, planning and doing are different animals. Sheila seems never to have been confident of anything in her life, or of accomplishing anything without having her hand held. That alone suggests a shaking hand.

If it had been an illness related, spur of the moment thing, given her poor hand/eye coordination -we can, I believe rule out her ability to apply make up and nail varnish because she'd have had greater control of small, short brushes than the length of a rifle- her senses dulled by medication designed for the purpose, I think it can be said that many of the shots would have gone wild.

If we're going to refrain from speaking for the dead, we must also refrain from endowing them with capabilities they didn't have.

Which is exactly what I mean by those speaking for the dead----the ones who supposedly knew her. The ones who'd said she hadn't known one end of a gun to the other. Mainly her surviving family who " spoke for her " by coming out with all kinds of nonsense that wasn't true.

[guest7363]

Of course, RJ. It maybe JUST possible, had she been interested, she could have fired off a round or two for fun. Perhaps, in order to make certain every bullet went home, she'd been taking secret lessons? -does a mother practice how to kill her children?- in which case the whole thing was long premeditated. However, planning and doing are different animals. Sheila seems never to have been confident of anything in her life, or of accomplishing anything without having her hand held. That alone suggests a shaking hand.

If it had been an illness related, spur of the moment thing, given her poor hand/eye coordination -we can, I believe rule out her ability to apply make up and nail varnish because she'd have had greater control of small, short brushes than the length of a rifle- her senses dulled by medication designed for the purpose, I think it can be said that many of the shots would have gone wild.

If we're going to refrain from speaking for the dead, we must also refrain from endowing them with capabilities they didn't have.

Excellant post Jane,

If we're going to refrain from speaking for the dead, we must also refrain from endowing them with capabilities they didn't have.
Love it   

If it was a spur of the moment, Boy did she get lucky, Bamber leaving the rifle out loaded, the twins at the farmhouse, the phones not working in places and getting the better of and battering Neville, not forgetting that  Neville’s carelessness in phoning his useless Son instead of the police 😂😂

[guest7363]

Which is exactly what I mean by those speaking for the dead----the ones who supposedly knew her. The ones who'd said she hadn't known one end of a gun to the other. Mainly her surviving family who " spoke for her " by coming out with all kinds of nonsense that wasn't true.

Catcha later, busy day at Schools, Lettings etc today

[lookout]

Catcha later, busy day at Schools, Lettings etc today

Okay RJ x

[Jane]

Which is exactly what I mean by those speaking for the dead----the ones who supposedly knew her. The ones who'd said she hadn't known one end of a gun to the other. Mainly her surviving family who " spoke for her " by coming out with all kinds of nonsense that wasn't true.

Lookout, I can only comment on what I see, and listen to what others say. I see Sheila as a bit of a 'society' girl who was at her happiest in a city rather than the country. She put great store in looking pretty. Well dressed, hair, nails and make up done. She liked parties and clubbing. There's been nothing at all said of her which indicates her being into any country pursuits. No school friends have come forward to say Sheila enjoyed shoots when she stayed with them. Indeed, it's possible she didn't make friends with girls from farming families because she didn't share the same interests.

(Regarding your claim that as a farmer's daughter she'd have automatically known about guns MAY be true for some, but my farmer friends' daughter is very similar to Sheila, adored her father, went to boarding school, temped as a secretary, had a flat in London, into fashion and everything connected to it, married a man with no connections with farming, possibly because the local farming males weren't interested in her as a wife because she didn't have the same interests. I'm fairly certain she's never as much as touched a gun)

I have no reason to think that what's been said of Sheila by those who knew her, isn't true because no one yet has said anything which could be considered to be contradictory.

[Jane]

Catcha later, busy day at Schools, Lettings etc today

See ya!

[guest29835]

Excellant post Jane,

If we're going to refrain from speaking for the dead, we must also refrain from endowing them with capabilities they didn't have.
Love it   

If it was a spur of the moment, Boy did she get lucky, Bamber leaving the rifle out loaded, the twins at the farmhouse, the phones not working in places and getting the better of and battering Neville, not forgetting that  Neville’s carelessness in phoning his useless Son instead of the police 😂😂

Maybe that's why it was a spur of the moment thing?

[JackieD]

Lookout, I can only comment on what I see, and listen to what others say. I see Sheila as a bit of a 'society' girl who was at her happiest in a city rather than the country. She put great store in looking pretty. Well dressed, hair, nails and make up done. She liked parties and clubbing. There's been nothing at all said of her which indicates her being into any country pursuits. No school friends have come forward to say Sheila enjoyed shoots when she stayed with them. Indeed, it's possible she didn't make friends with girls from farming families because she didn't share the same interests.

(Regarding your claim that as a farmer's daughter she'd have automatically known about guns MAY be true for some, but my farmer friends' daughter is very similar to Sheila, adored her father, went to boarding school, temped as a secretary, had a flat in London, into fashion and everything connected to it, married a man with no connections with farming, possibly because the local farming males weren't interested in her as a wife because she didn't have the same interests. I'm fairly certain she's never as much as touched a gun)

I have no reason to think that what's been said of Sheila by those who knew her, isn't true because no one yet has said anything which could be considered to be contradictory.

You didn’t see though did you though???  You make it all up as you go

I’m going to put your stats up later to show how many hours a day you spend on this forum making stuff up
Dont you ever go out

[JackieD]

Colins account in his book does NOT tally with the tv interview after trial

Colin says in his book that he had a bad feeling about leaving the twins at the Farm House  "as
Sheila's mental condition always deteriorated after she had been staying there".

He was in a relationship with another of his girlfriends and had made it clear to Sheila that there
was not a chance of reconciliation.

[JackieD]

Colin’s words  last Summer (Summer 1984) we were doing things together as a family we started doing all the regular things like visiting Kew Gardens, the swimming pool, zoo, things like that, had a lot of fun, it was nice to be a family because we had never actually done it before

I think there was a lot of HOPE of eventually getting something together again

If Colin had really wished to reconcile, why did he not do so years before? Why did he divorce?

The twins were 6 years old when Sheila died, Colin and Sheila had been separated or divorced for some five and half years by then.

Colin had an affair and left Sheila when the twins were 4 or 5 months old. He didn’t see the twins for a year

[JackieD]

Colin stated in his book that he wished Sheila dead on the night of the murders.He was fed up with her leaning on him.He just wanted to get on with his own life??

[JackieD]

Colin says Sheila Caffell wasn't violent

On one page of Colin’s book he gave sheila a black eye and on one occasion sheila threw a glass and cut her wrist


From Freddie’s statement  this describes one of Sheila's violent psychotic episodes. While ranting and raving about God and the devil, Sheila repeatedly hit herself and the walls. Then sat down and brushed her hair as though nothing had happened, before starting all over again.

Freddie called two doctors but Sheila accused them of trying to poison her and threw them out.



Freddie states that he was afraid for his safety and for the safety of everyone in Sheila's flat - which included the boys.

Sheila eventually had to be sectioned under the Mental Health Act.

 Sheila hallucinated at times, then she thought she, her sons and the rest of the family were possessed by the devil. Sheila was also afraid that she would have sex with her sons and that she and her sons might harm each other.

[JackieD]

Colin just does not seem a very nice person
Taking pornographic photos of Sheila when she was 17, leaving Sheila and the twins not long after the babies were born and giving Sheila a black eye his affairs and dropping Sheila off at WHF when he knew she had been threatening suicide and leading Sheila on that they were going to be a family again.

What a cruel person

[lookout]

I think most women would have divorced him, except the obvious mug who remains married to him.
I wonder why Heather gave up ?