Author Topic: the 2 youths on the moped.  (Read 6642 times)

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Offline Harper

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2019, 04:53:PM »
Sorry for questions that have probably been answered previously. You all seem to be very well versed on this case.

An answer that I can't find - when GD and JF came back up the path from the Tool Hire at Newbattle to GD's home at Easthouses, they were having issues with the moped. Did they drive the moped up the path or walked the moped Back to GD's? Or was it a bit of both?

Offline nugnug

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #16 on: November 21, 2019, 05:37:PM »
Your like a parrot, NOBODY has been disputing this.


Ferris also admitted to witnessing Luke jabbing Jodi in the leg with a knife and also verbally abusing her, but since that does not suit the narrative, that he is a liar. Can't have the best of both worlds.

well if nobody disputes that what is there to dispute.

they right next to a murder scene at the time a murder is supposed to have taken place
« Last Edit: November 21, 2019, 05:41:PM by nugnug »

Offline nugnug

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2019, 05:51:PM »
Oh so the murder did take place at 5:15?

why the patholgist dident actully give a time of a time the proscution

the proscuting did not give 515 as the exact time just around that time nobody that precise about a time of death.

Offline nugnug

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #18 on: November 21, 2019, 06:05:PM »
Only when its suits the narrative right? Messy. So Ferris is a liar right?

well yes that was established in courtt he lied about the time he was one the path as did dickie.

Offline nugnug

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2019, 06:37:PM »
What? So he was on the path at 5:15 as you claim he claimed, but now he was not there at this time, because he is a liar, which one is it? Make up your mind.

he admited he had previsoly lied and said he was there at 4 15 when he was there at 615 dikie also admited this that was established at the trail.

and is in the links i have previously posted.

Offline sandra L

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #20 on: November 21, 2019, 08:14:PM »
Sorry for questions that have probably been answered previously. You all seem to be very well versed on this case.

An answer that I can't find - when GD and JF came back up the path from the Tool Hire at Newbattle to GD's home at Easthouses, they were having issues with the moped. Did they drive the moped up the path or walked the moped Back to GD's? Or was it a bit of both?

According to their own statements and those of witnesses, it was a bit of both.

They drove the moped through Basically Tools and part way up Newbattle Road, where it cut out and they were seen by two independent sets of witnesses (1) pushing it up the rest of the Newbattle Road to the entrance to Roan's Dyke Park and (2) pushing it into the entrance to Roan's Dyke path.

They then struggled to get it started and keep it going for quite some time while they were "messing about on the path" (i.e, they would get it going, ride it for a bit up or down the path, then it would cut out again) - from at least Ferris's statements, they finally got it going long enough to ride the last part of the path (Easthouses end) and along Lady Path to Dickie's garden.

Offline nugnug

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #21 on: November 22, 2019, 12:01:AM »
Name the witnesses.


do you think the police would ask somone to come forward if there wasnt a witness if there wasnt a witnese it wouldent of even be mentioned would it.

Offline sandra L

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #22 on: November 22, 2019, 07:59:AM »
Name the witnesses.

No. They've never been publicly named, so I'm not about to put them in the firing line for people like you. Before you start bandying about words like "selective," this has been my approach from the start and applies equally to witnesses in Jodi's family and friends who were not publicly named. It's a blanket policy - if people's names are in the public domain, it's ok to discuss them by name. If not, I don't.

Offline nugnug

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2019, 10:15:AM »
are likely to make an appealfor somone to come forward if theres no witness  to them being there.

Offline sandra L

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #24 on: November 22, 2019, 02:43:PM »
Goodness, Davie, nothing personal going on here, then?

Freeloading? You're having a laugh. Do you work, or have you worked, for nothing, for years at a time, Davie? Have you given your every spare hour and large sums of your own money to help other people?

Would you be prepared to take a cut in your income to help others? No? Then you can't stand in judgement of me.

And by "people like you," I mean people who have no qualms about launching personal attacks on other people from the cowardly safety of a fake name on an internet forum. So, yes, people like you.


Offline Harper

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #25 on: November 22, 2019, 03:27:PM »
Thanks for the info Sandra and Davie, I hope I didn't cause all this arguing though!

From what I can see, everyone is generally in agreement regarding the following:

- The two boys were on the path between roughly 5pm and 5.30pm

- They were seen and admitted to being on this path at this time

- They were riding around on a troublesome moped, but were having issues with starting it.

- The moped was not roadworthy as it had no silencer on the exhaust, which is why they were running it on the paths and woodland

I agree that it's frustrating that we do not all have access to case files, but don't feel that we can blame Sandra Lean just because she does have access to the files and is not legally allowed to share them with us?

Offline sandra L

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #26 on: November 22, 2019, 03:49:PM »
Thanks Harper - no, you're not the cause of some of the more heated posts.

I have said repeatedly, if I could make all of the documents public, I'd do it in the blink of an eye - why would I put myself through all the stress if I could just put it all out there and let people read it for themselves?

I've been between a rock and a hard place for a very long time, doing what I can to get as much of the story out there as I can, but always constrained by things I'm not allowed to do for various reasons.

Some posters, no matter how often I explain that, choose to interpret as me "hiding" information - there's nothing I, or anyone else, can do about that interpretation, but the facts remain the facts - I do what I can, when I can, with what I'm allowed to do.

Offline Harper

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #27 on: November 22, 2019, 06:22:PM »
Of course Davie, with Sandra being the only one here with access to the case files, she can pick and choose what to share with us. But if she is telling lies and creating a fake alternate story, then she is completely wasting her time, her prospective career and a large portion of her life.

Her goals with this are obviously to get Luke a successful appeal, retrial and released. Before any of this can happen, the real case files and evidence would have to be presented and scrutinised. If at that point it was found that she had been lying then it would all fall apart, Sandra Lean would be disgraced and Luke would be left in prison.

If she is telling lies, all she has achieved over these years is to convince a few random folk on forums that Luke Mitchell may be innocent.

Offline sandra L

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #28 on: November 22, 2019, 07:47:PM »
Thank you Harper.

And why would I take such a risk for people I didn't even know at the time? Why risk my own and my daughters' safety?

I have nothing to hide and nothing to fear in relation to what is in the case papers. Never, in over 16 years, has anyone tried to sue me for anything I have claimed about what is in the papers. Why might that be? Because they would have to prove I was lying and they can't, because I'm not.

Actually, my goals are not only to get Luke a successful appeal, retrial and released. My main goal is a simple one - to get the truth for Luke and his family, Jodi and hers and all of the rest of us out here who still don't know, to this day, who really killed Jodi. Because, if it wasn't Luke, then the person capable of such a horrific crime has been undetected for over sixteen years. For those who don't believe that's possible:

it took more 20 years to link Angus Sinclair with the murders of four women - he was free for five years, raping and indecently assaulting other women and girls

Peter Sutcliffe, the Yorkshire Ripper, evaded police for six years

it took sixteen years to finally get to the truth about who killed Rachel Nickell in 1992.

In all of these cases, even though these men were committing other crimes, investigators failed to link them. In fact, had investigators managed to link information they had on file, over a four year period, for Robert Napper with the murder of Rachel Nickell (after their spectacular failure in focusing on Colin Stagg), Samantha and Jasmine Bissett would be alive today.

Peter Sutcliffe was "in the system" from 1969 and he was interviewed 9 times during the height of the Ripper investigation ( 1975 - 1980) - how many women would be still alive had those links been made?

It's been said so many times Luke has to be Jodi's killer because there have been "no other similar crimes" since January 2005.

That, of course, is blatantly untrue and also fails to account for similar crimes before 2003. It doesn't take much to scratch the surface and see how many similar attacks on girls and young women there have been, before and since.

All I ask is that people consider the question - what if other connections were never made because the initial investigation focused so quickly (and single-mindedly) on Luke and what if no other possibilities have ever been considered since? Are we happy to call that justice?

Offline marty

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Re: the 2 youths on the moped.
« Reply #29 on: November 22, 2019, 09:31:PM »
Nicholas