Author Topic: lukes albi  (Read 3950 times)

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Offline sandra L

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #30 on: November 22, 2019, 07:54:AM »
Luke had an alibi that was not believed because, it was claimed, a change in Shane's statement was "proof" that he was lying.

How many other people's statements changed (some of them significantly)? Are we to accept that as proof that they,  too, were lying? If not, why not?

The argument that "they weren't accused of anything" doesn't stand. In this country, a person has the right to be presumed innocent unless or until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It is not proof of anything to decide that someone changing their statement is lying - if it is accepted as such, then everyone who changed their statements must be lying.

The"they weren't accused of anything" leaves wide open the opportunity to set up the accused, simply by interpreting changed statements attributed to him as "lies" and changed statements attributed to all others as "innocent mistakes." A self-fulfilling prophecy - it's not rocket science!

Offline nugnug

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #31 on: November 22, 2019, 10:09:AM »
Luke had an alibi that was not believed because, it was claimed, a change in Shane's statement was "proof" that he was lying.

How many other people's statements changed (some of them significantly)? Are we to accept that as proof that they,  too, were lying? If not, why not?

The argument that "they weren't accused of anything" doesn't stand. In this country, a person has the right to be presumed innocent unless or until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It is not proof of anything to decide that someone changing their statement is lying - if it is accepted as such, then everyone who changed their statements must be lying.

The"they weren't accused of anything" leaves wide open the opportunity to set up the accused, simply by interpreting changed statements attributed to him as "lies" and changed statements attributed to all others as "innocent mistakes." A self-fulfilling prophecy - it's not rocket science!

well by that logi the familys changing statements for what time jodi left home must also be a lie.

Offline sandra L

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #32 on: November 22, 2019, 02:52:PM »
I guess you have never, discovered, found out. That one of your family members has just been brutally murdered. Just imagine the confusion, the stress, the disbelieve, the shock. No wonder they were a bit mixed up. Have some respect Sandra.

Respect, Davie? I'm surprised you even know how to spell the word.

You've taken a logical, rational approach to a misleading post you made and used Jodi's family's suffering to emote all over that response, because you can't respond to it logically or rationally.

Why wouldn't the same considerations apply to the Mitchells? As innocent individuals, wouldn't they also be in confusion, stress, disbelief and shock, especially when Luke became the target of the police investigation? If it's enough to explain errors in Jodi's family's statements, why not in Luke and his family's? The argument "because he was convicted" doesn't stand. He wasn't convicted on the very first day of the investigation - they were still lying to him and his family weeks later, reassuring them that Luke wasn't a suspect. He wasn't convicted when they raided his house twice and took away all his belongings, or interrogated him for hours without access to a lawyer or any other support. Confusion, stress, disbelief, shock? Go figure.

And please, don't presume that you know what has gone on in my family - you don't.

Offline sandra L

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #33 on: November 22, 2019, 07:09:PM »
Insults, how mature Sandra.

You're right, Davie, that was uncalled for and I apologise.

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You should probably try bully your poodle nugs on the issue of spelling, instead of myself

It wasn't intended as an attempt to bully - I abhor bullying of any description. Nugnug has his own mind and doesn't take instructions from me. However, I think it is clear that Nugnug's spelling is of no real importance and strikes me as a form of dyslexia (although that is only a guess, having a dyslexic daughter myself). He's able to make perfectly clear what he is saying, even if it doesn't conform to other people's expectations of spelling. I do think it is a form of bullying to shame someone for their spelling when it is clear there is some sort of difficulty for the poster when it comes to spelling.

My (rather petulant, I agree) reference to spelling was actually paraphrasing Paddy Hill outside the court of appeal


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Luke deserves no respect, he is a psychopathic murderer, convicted by a jury and his mother tried to cover it up. Luke had no alibi, This is FACT.

As you wish Davie. You still haven't addressed the issue of the right to the presumption of innocence until proven guilty, or the double standards at a time when no-one had been proven guilty of anything and I suspect you have no intention of doing so, which means this is no longer a sensible debate.

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And please don't assume "people like me" the name is Davie.

I know what the name is, Davie and you, Davie, have no qualms about launching personal attacks on other posters. So, Davie, my point was, quite simply, I don't give people like Davie the opportunity to attack others just because people like Davie demand that I do so.

By the way, where's your proof that "the name's Davie"? Just asking.

Offline nugnug

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #34 on: November 25, 2019, 11:50:AM »
are so the mitchells changing  statements means they lied but the jones family constantly changing staements dosnt mean the leid thats logic for you.

Offline Parky41

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #35 on: November 25, 2019, 12:30:PM »
"Seemples" really;

In any investigation - some lie some are truthful.
Some clarify matters whilst others dig deeper holes.
Seems these holes - are still getting dug, by the main people fighting for innocence.
They are clearly lying and misleading, why would that be?

The answer there of course - is itself, simple.


Offline nugnug

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #36 on: November 25, 2019, 12:33:PM »
"Seemples" really;

In any investigation - some lie some are truthful.
Some clarify matters whilst others dig deeper holes.
Seems these holes - are still getting dug, by the main people fighting for innocence.
They are clearly lying and misleading, why would that be?

The answer there of course - is itself, simple.

so how do ou explian the jones changing the times for jodi leaving home was that a mistake or a delbrate lie.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2019, 12:42:PM by nugnug »

Offline Parky41

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #37 on: November 25, 2019, 02:36:PM »
You're on, your wrong thread Nugnug.

This is your alibi one.

Offline sandra L

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #38 on: November 26, 2019, 07:56:AM »
"Seemples" really;

In any investigation - some lie some are truthful.
Some clarify matters whilst others dig deeper holes.
Seems these holes - are still getting dug, by the main people fighting for innocence.
They are clearly lying and misleading, why would that be?

The answer there of course - is itself, simple.

Go on, then, Parky. Give everyone the "simple" answer to why I would lie and mislead. I'm not interested in what you think of anyone else at this point, just me, as one of the "main people fighting for his innocence."

Why would I fight? Why would I lie? Why would I mislead? Remember, Parky, I look for answers backed up by evidence - you made these claims and asked these questions, claiming to have a "simple" answer, so let's have it.

Offline Parky41

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #39 on: November 26, 2019, 12:15:PM »


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Why would I fight? Why would I lie? Why would I mislead? Remember, Parky, I look for answers backed up by evidence - you made these claims and asked these questions, claiming to have a "simple" answer, so let's have it.


"Why would I fight"
Perhaps you could explain with clarity this:
The latter end of June 2003 this girl is murdered.
September 2003 CM chaps your door?
Is this correct or was it September 2004? 2005? 2006?

How did CM hear, there was this woman from Mayfield who believed her son was innocent?
We have seen already that Luke and your daughter were part of  a gang - that hung out at times, company together?
Simply put - was your daughter the reasoning behind CM's visit? The start of your fight together?
You took your daughter, with you,  to see Luke in prison - is this correct?

Simply asking questions here - to get an idea of accuracy, as to why you started this fight.
There is a world of difference between Joe public believing innocence to becoming actively involved.
Helpful for study purpose, for book material, not a one way street of giving - you have gained substantially through this.
 
The answer of course could lie in its own subterfuge of reasoning.
Akin to the ? around why Luke, not only murdered this girl but mutilated her.
What drives a person to want to be part of that - Are they simply just some vigilante for innocence or is there darkness within.
Only in them lies the truth - the answer.   
Lithium posted a clip previously - of a woman's eyes, aglow, radiant in some odd pleasure.
Of that warm feeling one gets - when being confronted and attacked verbally. (Twitter)

This "Why would I fight? Why would I lie? Why would I mislead?"
Why do you do these things Ms Lean? Only you know the truth, of what drives you to do so.

In simplicity to do with Luke's case - there is no choice but to lie to mislead, the truth is why he is locked up.

Of SK being on this path - a typo.
Of a mystery man being on this path - the media to blame.
Of those joint theories - CM is simply mistaken.
Of this trio having to walk passed YW's whilst heading directly to this path - JF to blame.
Of all of the evidence against Luke - every one is to blame, whilst the simple truth is, it is Luke himself to blame, with his wild
reasoning and stories that inevitably set suspicion upon him.
Caught in his own lies - no one else to blame for that

Offline sandra L

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #40 on: November 26, 2019, 02:52:PM »

"Why would I fight"
Perhaps you could explain with clarity this:
The latter end of June 2003 this girl is murdered.
September 2003 CM chaps your door?
Is this correct or was it September 2004? 2005? 2006?

With absolute clarity, Parky:

Corinne Mitchell never, ever "chapped my door." She put a note through the door of my workplace, after hours, when the premises were closed, in September 2003.


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How did CM hear, there was this woman from Mayfield who believed her son was innocent?

I wasn't from Mayfield at the time, Corinne's workplace was in Mayfield. Someone I knew told someone else about my thoughts, that person told someone else who knew Corinne - that's how Corinne found out about me.

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We have seen already that Luke and your daughter were part of  a gang - that hung out at times, company together?

No you have not, because they were not. Neither of my daughters ever met Luke Mitchell prior to Luke being imprisoned. Are you really suggesting a 14 year old boy would want to hang out with 12 and 10 year old girls, or that my 10 and 12 year olds were "part of a gang".  I don't know where this rubbish comes from, but it's utterly ludicrous. I have dozens of people who will attest to the FACT that myself and my daughters did not know the Mitchells prior to Jodi's murder, including the people who were with me the morning I arrived at work to find the note from Corinne at my workplace.

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Simply put - was your daughter the reasoning behind CM's visit? The start of your fight together?


No.

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Simply asking questions here - to get an idea of accuracy, as to why you started this fight.
There is a world of difference between Joe public believing innocence to becoming actively involved.
Helpful for study purpose, for book material, not a one way street of giving - you have gained substantially through this.

You're not "simply asking questions," Parky - saying it doesn't make it true. You are also making false claims and repeating outright lies. I've made it perfectly clear, many times, very publicly, why I "started this fight." I became actively involved long before there was any "study purpose" or "book material" on the horizon (five years and four years respectively). I understand that you cannot accept that someone would fight so actively for no other reason that a burning need to challenge terrible injustice - just because you can't accept it doesn't mean it's not a fact.

"Gained substantially"? In what ways?
 
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The answer of course could lie in its own subterfuge of reasoning.
Akin to the ? around why Luke, not only murdered this girl but mutilated her.
What drives a person to want to be part of that - Are they simply just some vigilante for innocence or is there darkness within.

Quantum leap there, don't you think? Because you don't understand why I do what I do, I'm either a vigilante or have "darkness within"? No other possibilities considered?
 
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Lithium posted a clip previously - of a woman's eyes, aglow, radiant in some odd pleasure.
Of that warm feeling one gets - when being confronted and attacked verbally. (Twitter)

I haven't a clue what you're talking about.

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This "Why would I fight? Why would I lie? Why would I mislead?"
Why do you do these things Ms Lean? Only you know the truth, of what drives you to do so.

I don't do these things (apart from fight) - it is you who claimed I do and I asked you to come up with any good reasons why I would lie or mislead. You can't - instead you post a rambling post filled with outright lies.

I'm done with this, Parky. You've shown your true colours with this post - you'll happily lie through your teeth (or repeat the lies of others) to suit your agenda - you attack my daughters' characters knowing nothing about them, simply to get at me. Pathetic and transparent.

Offline Parky41

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #41 on: November 26, 2019, 03:35:PM »
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I'm done with this, Parky. You've shown your true colours with this post - you'll happily lie through your teeth (or repeat the lies of others) to suit your agenda - you attack my daughters' characters knowing nothing about them, simply to get at me. Pathetic and transparent.

No Ms Lean, yet again, I was simply asking questions around other information I have read on these forums.

Thus why I asked the question rather than just assuming - I honestly did not know.
Absolutely no idea what age your daughters were or are, or in clarity which year CM approached you or where.
Thus the 2003? 2004 etc.

These questions alone appear to have upset you gravely - for that I apologize, I have stated before and do so again, this
fight you have, extremely personal to say the least - I understand how difficult it may be at times, to keep on an even keel.

You will have to excuse me, if you feel I had somehow attacked your daughters characters, by implication that they may have
known or hung out with Luke? Again having no idea of their age. You stated before, when talking about the colours AB saw, that they
were possibly the same colours as Newbattle, of your daughters attending this school - I tied the two together, 2003 and High School.
There most definitely was not - any attack on your daughters far less their characters.

I was simply trying to understand why - within the space of two months, CM not only knew of you, knew where you worked and somehow knew you could be of help to her.
Two total strangers, that's all.

Throughout this process - You have studied in depth and written three books (1st and 2nd edition - of the 1st)
You have gained qualifications along the way - thus, not a one way street.

Still leaves a ? mark as to why CM sought this complete stranger out - within two months of this crime.
The prison visit best left alone.

Perhaps better to leave it at that - until rationale takes hold again.

Offline sandra L

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #42 on: November 26, 2019, 08:48:PM »
Give everyone the "simple" answer to why I would lie and mislead

Please?

Offline Bullseye

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #43 on: November 27, 2019, 09:28:AM »
Fame and fortune, after all these years Sandra you are so famous and rich lol was so worth it all!!  Come on guys really?? There are a lot easier, quicker ways to find fame and fortune which does not include putting yourself in danger everyday or standing up for a man you know to be guilty but pretending they are innocent just to be famous. Absolutely ridiculous. Is this really what you think??  It’s very clear all Sandra is doing is standing up for someone she believes to be innocent. I take my hat off to her. If I’m ever in trouble she would be my first call, someone who cares and will do whatever she can to help

Offline WakeyWakey

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Re: lukes albi
« Reply #44 on: November 27, 2019, 01:01:PM »
Fame and fortune, after all these years Sandra you are so famous and rich lol was so worth it all!!  Come on guys really?? There are a lot easier, quicker ways to find fame and fortune which does not include putting yourself in danger everyday or standing up for a man you know to be guilty but pretending they are innocent just to be famous. Absolutely ridiculous. Is this really what you think??  It’s very clear all Sandra is doing is standing up for someone she believes to be innocent. I take my hat off to her. If I’m ever in trouble she would be my first call, someone who cares and will do whatever she can to help

youre right here -sandra does this becayse she believe firmly luke is innocent and seek to justify that beleif afterwards . but there is no place for belief in such matters. reality doesnt care for beleif

by never seriosly considering possibility of lukes guilt she reveals the  bias she always had