Author Topic: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings  (Read 3604 times)

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Offline Bullseye

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #45 on: October 21, 2019, 01:45:PM »
I can see how the hoodie can be mistaken and the logo missed. But no way can you mistake lighter blue trousers took to be jeans and extremely baggy black trousers. I dont think she saw Luke or Jodi. The fact she did not name Luke when she was on the stand says it all for me.

If it was Luke I think they met on the path, then went to the v, nobody around to see them.

Offline nugnug

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #46 on: October 21, 2019, 01:49:PM »
I can see how the hoodie can be mistaken and the logo missed. But no way can you mistake lighter blue trousers took to be jeans and extremely baggy black trousers. I dont think she saw Luke or Jodi. The fact she did not name Luke when she was on the stand says it all for me.

If it was Luke I think they met on the path, then went to the v, nobody around to see them.

no theres no way you can mistake that.

she said she dident see jodis face anyway so youcan hardly cliam it as a postive sighting.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2019, 01:50:PM by nugnug »

Offline David1819

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #47 on: October 21, 2019, 03:30:PM »
for one, i remember seeming every alternative kid in edinburgh had this hoodie and the proportions looked nothing like  one they used in reconstruction - it looked like theyd tried to mak their own with iron on transfers for reconstruction:


You are correct. You can see they have just stuck the designs on a plain hooded top. Its not the same product.

The logo on the genuine would have been more obscured by the hood.

Offline Parky41

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #48 on: October 21, 2019, 04:08:PM »
Bullseye:
Quote
If you mean the 2 at the top of the path then why do people continue to believe this was Jodi? It CLEARLY wasn’t.  The person seen at top of path wash wearing light blue, boot cut style jeans with a blue top, Jodi was wearing black baggy trousers and a black top.

Nowhere in any of AB's description, does she say light blue- the description is of Dark blue(Navy) top with LIGHTER coloured bottoms, possibly bootcut - thus baggy, flapping around the bottom of the legs. She goes on to further describe these trousers as been "slightly lighter" than that of the top.
So if this top is very dark blue/black the trousers are also, very dark.

Again - were the trousers that this girl was wearing, on the night she was murdered -
dark blue corduroy type jeans? baggy of course.
Therefore - this description of a navy blue/black baggy top with lighter coloured trousers is spot on.

Quote
The court document clearly states that exhibit 146 was a "black or very dark navy hooded top"

the trousers were lighter in colour than the jumper. (The description of the jumper was consistent with what the deceased was wearing when she left home; her trousers were dark in colour and of a "baggy" type). "

"her trousers were dark in colour and of a "baggy" type"


Quote
Can nugnug or Gordo or anyone else explain how Luke managed to describe the clothes Jodi was wearing on the night of the murder in a police interview afew days after the murder, if he hadn't seen her that night, she had changed since school, and her body was naked when he found her? Thanks.

(this was a police interview played at the trial for everyone to here, before you accuse me of making it up or ask for a source)

Gordo:
Quote
So Sandra the fact that Luke was describing the clothes Jodi wore  at school that day and they happened to be the same clothes Jodi wore at the time of her murder then somehow that morphed itself into him having knowledge of what she had on that night. This really is clutching at straws. Its clear what Luke was saying and I will apologise that he did inadvertantly describe the clothes Jodi wore when she was killed.
[/color]

LM:
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She liked that top, she like, she bought some of her own stuff, I mean, the clothes, the cords, jeans, she was wearing on Monday night. I think they were borrowed off her sister.
[/b]

So AB was correct - the trousers were blue. They were a cord/type Jeans - exactly as Luke described them.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2019, 04:10:PM by Parky41 »

Offline David1819

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #49 on: October 21, 2019, 04:11:PM »
Was Luke on bail while waiting trial or was he on remand?

Offline nugnug

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #50 on: October 21, 2019, 04:15:PM »
Bullseye:
Nowhere in any of AB's description, does she say light blue- the description is of Dark blue(Navy) top with LIGHTER coloured bottoms, possibly bootcut - thus baggy, flapping around the bottom of the legs. She goes on to further describe these trousers as been "slightly lighter" than that of the top.
So if this top is very dark blue/black the trousers are also, very dark.

Again - were the trousers that this girl was wearing, on the night she was murdered -
dark blue corduroy type jeans? baggy of course.
Therefore - this description of a navy blue/black baggy top with lighter coloured trousers is spot on.

 
Gordo:


LM:

So AB was correct - the trousers were blue. They were a cord/type Jeans - exactly as Luke described them.

we all read the descriptin it was nothing like what jodi was wearing.

Offline Bullseye

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #51 on: October 21, 2019, 07:25:PM »
Bullseye:
Nowhere in any of AB's description, does she say light blue- the description is of Dark blue(Navy) top with LIGHTER coloured bottoms, possibly bootcut - thus baggy, flapping around the bottom of the legs. She goes on to further describe these trousers as been "slightly lighter" than that of the top.
So if this top is very dark blue/black the trousers are also, very dark.

Again - were the trousers that this girl was wearing, on the night she was murdered -
dark blue corduroy type jeans? baggy of course.
Therefore - this description of a navy blue/black baggy top with lighter coloured trousers is spot on

So AB was correct - the trousers were blue. They were a cord/type Jeans - exactly as Luke described them.

Looking at the reconstruction picture of the girl in clothes Jodi was wearing, there is no way you would call those trousers lighter than the top, or bootcut. The description does not match for me. If I saw someone wearing that I’d say dark hoodie, black/dark very baggy trousers. Sorry in my opinion going by what she was wearing and AB description it’s not the same person.

She did not name Luke in court and the description not matching, again in my opinion it was not him

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #52 on: October 21, 2019, 07:28:PM »
Was Luke on bail while waiting trial or was he on remand?
I suppose we'll have to buy the book. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Innocents-Betrayed-story-justice-abandoned/dp/199961710X

Offline David1819

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #53 on: October 21, 2019, 07:57:PM »
Does Sandra have any intention of replying to my posts #33 #41?

Offline nugnug

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #54 on: October 21, 2019, 08:02:PM »
Looking at the reconstruction picture of the girl in clothes Jodi was wearing, there is no way you would call those trousers lighter than the top, or bootcut. The description does not match for me. If I saw someone wearing that I’d say dark hoodie, black/dark very baggy trousers. Sorry in my opinion going by what she was wearing and AB description it’s not the same person.

She did not name Luke in court and the description not matching, again in my opinion it was not him

i ewally dont think you can mistake baggys for jeans.

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #55 on: October 21, 2019, 08:04:PM »
Does Sandra have any intention of replying to my posts #33 #41?
She will do when she has time. She's not your nanny.

Offline WakeyWakey

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #56 on: October 21, 2019, 08:51:PM »
Looking at the reconstruction picture of the girl in clothes Jodi was wearing, there is no way you would call those trousers lighter than the top, or bootcut.

id agree if based soley on the reconstruction but we already saw that the reconstruction clothing is atbest approximation of what she had on that day. would want to see photos of actual garments if i was going to positively confirm anythin

Offline sandra L

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #57 on: October 21, 2019, 09:13:PM »
id agree if based soley on the reconstruction but we already saw that the reconstruction clothing is atbest approximation of what she had on that day. would want to see photos of actual garments if i was going to positively confirm anythin

No, not quite. The clothing was "reconstructed" from the clothing recovered from the crime scene and later shown in court. Those pictures are not going to be shared online under any circumstances.

However, during Andrina Bryson's testimony, when Jodi's actual hoodie was held up in court, Mrs Bryson said she had "no idea" how she could have missed the logo that was emblazoned right across the back.

The smaller logos were on the left sleeve (the one closest to the road where Mrs Bryson drove past) and the upper left front, so there were at least two opportunities for Mrs Bryson to have noticed something different to solid "navy blue" on the top.

After all, she was able to spot a "bulging pocket" on a sleeve several yards further away in her description of the male.


Offline David1819

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #58 on: October 23, 2019, 06:41:PM »
Does Sandra have any intention of replying to my posts #33 #41?

I take it she wont.

Offline nugnug

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Re: Manson's Black Dhalia Paintings
« Reply #59 on: October 23, 2019, 07:10:PM »
have you any intention of replying to mine is asked how luke could be influenced by pictures he hadent seen yet.